MVP Blinking black screen + Sage "booting up" screen.

[Fallen Kell]

Ok a lot more fun for you guys. I just spent the last 2 hours doing some extensive tests, debuging, configuration changes, and network snoops. As a result, I have some success and a lot of information.

Ok, let me first start with the most important catagory "Things That WORKED":

I found out by accident, that after the MVP downloaded the origional SageTV mvp.bin file and started to boot from it, that after it displayed the "Starting SageTV, please wait" screen and then going to a black screen, that if I did a "ipconfig /renew" on the SageTV Server system, the MVP would BOOT! Yes, you all heard me, with the origonal mvp.bin file, simply doing a "ipconfig /release" on the server caused the wireless mvp to boot and connect. I think I have some network performance issues to work out since I recieved a few errors when trying to open some files, or change channels, but I was able to watch some live tv as well as one of my recorded files (I need to re-enable the server debug log to give more info about the errors, but I full expect they are related to the network connection).

In the category of "Things that Might Work":

After reading through the snoop captures, I am pretty sure that some of the issue is due to the two different MAC addresses. So, I decided to start seting up my own DHCP server and configuring it so that when either of the two MAC addresses go through their request for DHCP services that they resolve to a specific static IP address. I am still working on this part since I havn't ever had to use this version of DHCP before (DNSMasq). My main experience is with QIP, where I could do this setup in a few seconds, but since I don't want to spend several thousand dollars for this software for home use, I will need to simple do more reading on how to properly configure DNSMasq to do the same thing. This will most certainly NOT be a solution for 99% of the population due to the complexity, equipment requirements, and technical knowledge required to implement this solution. But it probably WILL work and I will keep everyone posted as to progress in that respect.

In the category of "Things that Didn't Work":

Well, using the any of the supplied mvp.bin files that were supplied in this thread and just turning on the mvp.

Having the mvp connected wirelessly directly in the room with my wireless ap and using any of the different mvp.bin files all stopped communicating once the mvp switched over to the new MAC address as shown in this log:

1 0.000000 Hauppaug_07:e1:31 Broadcast XID Basic Format; Type 1 LLC (Class I LLC); Window Size 0
2 1.351815 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.255 DHCP DHCP Discover - Transaction ID 0x1eb7cec4
3 1.351831 192.168.1.1 Broadcast ARP Who has 192.168.1.114? Tell 192.168.1.1
4 2.353504 192.168.1.1 Broadcast ARP Who has 192.168.1.114? Tell 192.168.1.1
5 3.355285 192.168.1.1 Broadcast ARP Who has 192.168.1.114? Tell 192.168.1.1
6 3.366369 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.255 DHCP DHCP Discover - Transaction ID 0x1eb7cec4
7 3.617994 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.255 DHCP DHCP Request - Transaction ID 0x1eb7cec4
8 3.660879 192.168.1.114 255.255.255.255 WCCP Unknown WCCP message (1)
9 3.843644 192.168.1.109 Broadcast ARP Who has 192.168.1.114? Tell 192.168.1.109
10 3.938923 Hauppaug_07:e1:31 192.168.1.109 ARP 192.168.1.114 is at 00:0d:fe:07:e1:31
11 3.938934 192.168.1.109 192.168.1.114 UDP Source port: 16881 Destination port: 16882
12 7.266192 192.168.1.114 255.255.255.255 WCCP Unknown WCCP message (1)
13 7.435356 192.168.1.109 192.168.1.114 UDP Source port: 16881 Destination port: 16882
14 7.443046 192.168.1.114 192.168.1.109 WCCP Unknown WCCP message (91247)
15 7.461892 192.168.1.109 192.168.1.114 WCCP Unknown WCCP message (196609)
16 7.465221 192.168.1.114 192.168.1.109 UDP Source port: nfsd Destination port: 16869
17 7.467307 192.168.1.109 192.168.1.114 UDP Source port: 4563 Destination port: nfsd

...

11423 23.756934 192.168.1.109 192.168.1.114 UDP Source port: 4563 Destination port: nfsd
11424 23.957135 192.168.1.109 192.168.1.114 UDP Source port: 4563 Destination port: nfsd
11425 39.751922 SamsungE_f1:3e:73 Broadcast XID Basic Format; Type 1 LLC (Class I LLC); Window Size 0
11426 40.003311 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.255 DHCP DHCP Discover - Transaction ID 0x137e3d19
11427 40.003327 192.168.1.1 Broadcast ARP Who has 192.168.1.120? Tell 192.168.1.1
11428 40.980200 192.168.1.1 Broadcast ARP Who has 192.168.1.120? Tell 192.168.1.1
11429 41.981979 192.168.1.1 Broadcast ARP Who has 192.168.1.120? Tell 192.168.1.1
11430 42.108489 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.255 DHCP DHCP Discover - Transaction ID 0x137e3d19
11431 42.510129 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.255 DHCP DHCP Request - Transaction ID 0x137e3d19
11432 46.837571 192.168.1.120 255.255.255.255 UDP Source port: 3072 Destination port: 31100
11433 47.009298 192.168.1.109 Broadcast ARP Who has 192.168.1.120? Tell 192.168.1.109
11434 47.035623 SamsungE_f1:3e:73 192.168.1.109 ARP 192.168.1.120 is at 00:02:78:f1:3e:73
11435 47.035630 192.168.1.109 192.168.1.120 UDP Source port: 31100 Destination port: 3072
11436 53.096971 SamsungE_f1:3e:73 192.168.1.109 ARP Who has 192.168.1.109? Tell 192.168.1.120
11437 53.096982 192.168.1.109 SamsungE_f1:3e:73 ARP 192.168.1.109 is at 00:11:09:dc:8f:e0


Again, once it switches over to the new MAC address, the system stops responding as shown in previous posts.

The one time where I said that I got the MVP to work in the room with my wireless ap and HTPC can be attributed to the "ipconfig /renew" solution that I noted at the top of this post. I didn't make the connection at that time, but after extensive testing tonight, that was the actual cause of it working then.




So my current status, well, it sortof works. I found that I NEED to do a "ipconfig /renew" each and EVERY time I even power off the mvp (not remove the plug, just put it into the standby mode with it still retaining the mvp.bin already downloaded). This simply won't work, as I can't expect everyone in the house to go do that everytime someone accidentally hit the "power button" on the remote for the mvp, or whenever we lose power to the house (the mvp is not on a UPS system, unlike my HTPC, data server, unix server, and network infrastructure).

[Fallen Kell]

Update:

I got my DHCP server configured and running properly. The wireless mvp is now assigned the same IP address no matter which wireless mac address it is using. Unfortunately, this did not do change the behavior of the default mvp.bin file. I still need to execute a "ipconfig /renew" on the SageTV Server for the mvp to connect...

I also tried using the mvp.bin file from this thread again with this new dhcp setup, but no change in how that works either. It simply loads a black screen and does nothing.

Also interesting is that when I was looking at my dhcp logs/status. The wireless mvp grabbed a second ip address after it had booted using the sagetv mvp.bin file from this thread, this second ip is using the origonal mac address used on the mvp when it does the initial download. I am not sure if that is part of the intent of this patched bin or not or if it was some annomaly. I am glad I properly setup my config file to handle that possible, but unlikely scenario where both of those mac address requested an IP address (I had it simply supply a free one from the DHCP address pool in this case, and not use the specific static address that I created).

If anyone has some ideas, I will give them a try. I have found that I do have an issue with signal strength on the network. Even though I boosted the power on my AP, this didn't fix the problem of the mvp itself being able to communicate back to the AP. I am not certain how much return traffic there is, but I suspect that the mvp will mostly be receiving data and not transmitting. Still, the overall network slows down to only 36Mbps instead of the full 54Mbps due to this. I may try setting up my second wireless AP again and use it as a wireless bridge and simply connect use the wireless mvp through the wired port, but after all this trouble-shooting, I feel that doing so would be surrendering

[bobvoeh]

Originally Posted by _Demo_

Those test versions are for the wireless units. Could you post your server debug log and give information on your network configuration/hardware?

_Demo_

Demo, I have an older 1.0 MVP Wired and a 2.03 Firmware Wireless MVP, will this MVP.BIN not work for me then? My Older Wired MVP works fine, however the wireless one has the blinking sage logo.

[MrApollinax]

Originally Posted by Fallen Kell

Update:
I still need to execute a "ipconfig /renew" on the SageTV Server for the mvp to connect...

Can you tell me if it will connect if you only clear your ARP table on the server? If you issue an "arp -d" to clear the arp table does that help?

Originally Posted by Fallen Kell

I have found that I do have an issue with signal strength on the network. Even though I boosted the power on my AP, this didn't fix the problem of the mvp itself being able to communicate back to the AP.

Your poor performance can be caused by co-channel interference by other wireless devices or other 2.4Ghz devices (i.e. old microwaves). Can you do a site survey and see what other wireless networks are seen by your router/MVP? Rule of thumb for wireless networking is to have at least 5 channels of seperation to avoid co-channel interference.

[_Demo_]

Originally Posted by bobvoeh

Demo, I have an older 1.0 MVP Wired and a 2.03 Firmware Wireless MVP, will this MVP.BIN not work for me then? My Older Wired MVP works fine, however the wireless one has the blinking sage logo.

The latest one I uploaded should also work on wired MVP.

_Demo_

[Fallen Kell]

Originally Posted by MrApollinax

Can you tell me if it will connect if you only clear your ARP table on the server? If you issue an "arp -d" to clear the arp table does that help?




Your poor performance can be caused by co-channel interference by other wireless devices or other 2.4Ghz devices (i.e. old microwaves). Can you do a site survey and see what other wireless networks are seen by your router/MVP? Rule of thumb for wireless networking is to have at least 5 channels of seperation to avoid co-channel interference.

I will see if clearing the arp table works when I get a chance. You might be on to something there since that makes more sense as to what is probably really needed for the client/server connection to occur. It didn't make sense that renewing the IP should make the difference, especially since the server was also configured to use a static IP on my DHCP server.

I have done several site surveys including using some wireless network snooping software to detect networks that do not broadcast their SSID. There are 3 G-only networks in my area, all are setup using channel 6. There are also 4 other B networks in the area which use channels 6, 8, and 11. My network is set to run on channel 1, since everyone else in the area went with the default or chose a high numbered channel, so I am within the 5 channel rule (we use that same rule at work).

[MrApollinax]

how many walls are between you and the MVP? What are their composition? Keep in mind that a standard wood-frame wall with drywall on each side will add about 3db of loss. Walls that have something of higher reflectivity will cause more loss i.e. bathroom tile. I haven't seen a new MVP but it might be a better to put a higher gain antenna on the MVP or even a directional antenna for best performance.

[xred]

Originally Posted by spence

I'm having the exact same problem... It's a new MVP as of Friday from Sage!

Wired works after several reboots of the MVP, but when I go wireless - Exact same problem!

When I place the MVP within a few feet of my router it starts to work but NOT 14 Feet away and also line of sight!

I get only 1 bar on the MVP, 2-3 when it's on the workbench besides the router!

Also I have 2 other items on the wirless end of things, one is ~60 feet and the other is in the mother-in-laws bunker behind the house ~100 from the router with both displaying 3 bars...

Btw everything was off except the MVP and my router during my troubleshootng...

I'm in the middle of the woods and the closest electrical anything is almost 1/4 mile from me - Hell the cell starts to work when I get into town

I hope that none of my cows are jaming me

Spence

I am having the *exact* same issue. I have the wireless MVP sitting on my coffee table and my laptop beside it. Laptop reports full signal, MVP reports 1 -2 bars no matter what channel I put it on. This has been super frustrating as I have had it for over a week and have yet to see it work. I suspected it might be my Sage server (its only a P3-800) but I can play the recorded video on my laptop no problem, and since the MVP should be doing the decoding, I can't see it as a CPU limited issue.

[MrApollinax]

Wow. I didn't realize that there were that many issues with wireless performance in general. Again, i don't have a wireless MVP to look at but for these bad wireless connections i think the network environment is probably compounded by one of two things:

1. TX power levels are by default set low by the MVP kernel or
2. Bad/unshielded/poorly grounded/noisy connection from the external antenna to the main board wireless.

In the case of 1, low TX power output will effectivly cut the signal down. RF is a two way street. The remote radio may be able to hear the base radio but if it can't talk loud enough for the base radio to hear the response... then you have problems. In the case of 2, bad hardware design/components will make the wireless extremely sensitive to ANY noise (on-board, external, power...) and effect your wireless connection.

I know there were some problems with the older wired MVPs *cough*lowsvideooutput*cough* due to component issues. So I would think that the only addition to the main board (SPDIF was there, just not accessible) could be suspect in terms of hardware. Just my $.02.

Hopefully it is #1 since that can be fixed in software. If it's #2... well I think I might wait a rev or two before I pick up another MVP.

[Fallen Kell]

I have a floor between the MVP and the wireless AP. But I also have some other wireless issues in/near that AP, one being a brick fireplace chimney on the external wall 8 inches from the AP, and a metal heating/cooling duct in the floor almost in a direct line-of-sight pathway between the AP and the MVP. So, what I have done is to pickup 2 omni-directional 5dBi antenna's that have a very good vertical axis reception and a single high gain 14 dBi directional antenna. I plan on placing one of the omni's on the MVP and the directional and the other omni on the AP. The directional will be aimed at the mvp but from a different angle of attack since I can use the 10' wire to move where the directional will be placed in the room above the MVP so that I can get it out of the line-of-sight problem with the heating/cooling duct. The decent powered omni's should also help because the have a MUCH better vertical axis coverage then the "donut shaped" coverage from the standard rubber-duck bipole antennas on the AP.

I will also most likely be using a second WRT54G as a wireless bridge to connect the MVP. I was able to get the MVP to work without needing the "ipconfig /renew" when using the bridge last night, and it also helped some of the wireless network coverage due to having a more powerful transmitter and the ability to eventually turn on "overdrive" support once I can get a better SNR (signal-to-noise ratio). Given that, I could have probably saved a few bucks and simply got a wired MVP for that location (although I might still do that and use the wireless MVP on a different TV).

I hadn't really looked too hard at the wireless MVP to see how easy it would be to replace the default antenna. If it can not be replaced, the wireless MVP really will not be a good choice for people who will have it on a different floor/elevation from their AP (as I said the donut shaped coverage really does not extend that well in the vertical axis).

Now I just need to make sure I do not blow the FCC statues for broadcast power since a 14dBi antenna will probably allow me to exceed the statute (FCC Part 15). I will have to do some math as to what I should set the transmitter strength to on the AP's with the new antenna.

The other option I have is to set up some reflectors to bounce/shape the signal, but this will usually cause a lot of off axis/phase added to the system depending on what type of antenna's are used, and that will simply show up as more noise and lower my lower my SNR not raise it...

Also, I am using the latest mvp.bin posted in this thread and it works perfectly with the wired connection. I will try using the wireless again with it as well as to test out the clearing the arp table on the server (sorry, I forgot about trying that when I was fooling around last night, I was more excited about the fact that I almost have a fully working MVP. The only reason it is still just "almost working" is because of the bandwidth issues stated above. It is so close! It drops about 1/4 second of video/audio every other second.

[MrApollinax]

Hmm... with the brick chimney, flooring and ceiling duct work you're looking at about 15-20dB of potential loss. I think you are better off getting a wireless bridge up and running rather than bending metal to reflect signals around your house. Also the reflections may cause a lot of multipath interference and make your situation worse. Like you said having another transmitter addresses all your coverage issues not just your MVP issue.

Good to hear that you are *almost* there!

[dbullock]

Is there an update or fix available?

I just purchased Sage (both linux and windows versions) and a wireless MVP. I have tested the MVP against both the Linux and Windows installations but they both exhibit the same flashing behavior described in previous posts.

Right now Sage is completely unusable for me.

Thanks,
Dan

[nicklaz]

I get a black screen on my wired MVP as well. Mine goes black before the Sage client interface comes up. In fact, I've only been able to load Sage completely a couple of times but when it did load it worked nicely. I also tried the new mvp.bin but it did not help either.

Below is a simple diagram of my setup.

MVP <--> Netgear WGE111 )))))) (((((( Linksys WRT54GS <--> Sage Server

Does anyone have any suggestions?

[dbullock]

Using the latest mvp.bin posted I have been able to get the MVP running, but when I playback an MP3 the MVP will reboot after about 45 seconds.

Dan

[srothwell]

Originally Posted by Fallen Kell

I will also most likely be using a second WRT54G as a wireless bridge to connect the MVP. I was able to get the MVP to work without needing the "ipconfig /renew" when using the bridge last night, and it also helped some of the wireless network coverage due to having a more powerful transmitter and the ability to eventually turn on "overdrive" support once I can get a better SNR (signal-to-noise ratio).

Can you tell me how you made this work? I've got a D-Link travel router lying around. It has a mode called Client. I can successfully make a laptop use this little device (in client mode) to connet to my wireless lan. But the MVP just sits there on its blue screen saying "Contacting DHPC server".

Or.... and sorry to sound dumb, but is what you did unique to the WRT54G or can any wireless router act as a client? If so can you help?

with all the trouble people are experiencing with the wireless MVP I dont' want to get anywhere near it.

Thanks!

Stacy

[_Demo_]

Originally Posted by dbullock

Using the latest mvp.bin posted I have been able to get the MVP running, but when I playback an MP3 the MVP will reboot after about 45 seconds.

Dan

I'll try to post an updated mvp.bin that fix some parsing issues that can cause issues. By reboot do you mean the application restarts or it goes through the hauppauge menus?

_Demo_

[ignarps]

I got my wireless MVP to finally work by removing my MAC filtering on the AP.

I really don't like having MAC filtering turned off but after hearing that the sagetv mvp.bin changes the MAC address I thought about testing this.

Can anyone explain to me why sagetv would change the MAC address like this?
Is it a setting I can change?
If not where can I find the MAC address I need to add to my access list?

Thanks

[dbullock]

Very strange, but my wireless MVP is now running like a champ using the original mvp.bin file. since it the new file was not working I decided to lfip back to the original file to give it one more try. It works fine now.

Now to figure out how to recompile the kernel to support software raid.

Dan

[Fallen Kell]

Originally Posted by srothwell

Can you tell me how you made this work? I've got a D-Link travel router lying around. It has a mode called Client. I can successfully make a laptop use this little device (in client mode) to connet to my wireless lan. But the MVP just sits there on its blue screen saying "Contacting DHPC server".

Or.... and sorry to sound dumb, but is what you did unique to the WRT54G or can any wireless router act as a client? If so can you help?

with all the trouble people are experiencing with the wireless MVP I dont' want to get anywhere near it.

Thanks!

Stacy

Sorry, I hadn't stopped back in for the last few days. Ok, well it isn't unique to the WRT54G, but it was where it started. The WRT54G originally ran a custimized linux kernel. When that was discovered, Linksys was petitioned to release their source code as required by the GPL, which included full access to drivers for the Broadcom wireless chipset (since it was a kernel mod, and thus covered by the GPL). After finally being forced to release this information, other people started to modify the kernel to enable more and more options. I personally am using the DD-WRT linux distribution on my two routers. For a list of supported devices see:

http://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php...ported_Devices


Ok on to the news update. My new wireless antennas arrived today. This allowed me to fix my bandwidth and signal strength issues (well I think). I can now use the wireless mvp in wireless mode with the final mvp.bin file posted in this thread and everything connects, boots up, and can stream live and recoded TV I have run into a new issue, that I remember seeing someone else here post about. Now after about 5 minutes or so of watching a show, everything freezes. I have to turn the mvp off and then on again for anything to work. The server doesn't appear to be freezing since I do not need to do anything to it. Again, I know I saw someone else post this recently and I am going to try and find that thread to see if it was figured out. It might still be a bandwith issue. if it is, I still have many options, since I basically only installed one of the omni-directional antenna's on my AP and I am using the regular built-in antenna from the mvp. I can always try using the other router I have and put the other omni on it, and/or try the high gain directional antenna. So I have lots of tweaking to do, but I now get 5 minutes of smooth audio/video which is a lot better then either a black screen or the chop that I had before. Oh, and I don't need to do anything with arp tables or ipconfig. It seems that with the higher signal strength, that issue went away.

[_Demo_]

Originally Posted by Fallen Kell

Now after about 5 minutes or so of watching a show, everything freezes. I have to turn the mvp off and then on again for anything to work. The server doesn't appear to be freezing since I do not need to do anything to it.

If this always happen at the same segment in the video/audio it's a bug I have recently fixed (it was new to the latest mvp.bin). I will try to post an updated version as soon as I have cleared up some other modifications I have been working on.

_Demo_