MVP can be crashed 'on demand' ...

[lektrikpuke]

I believe your assessment is correct (but I haven't worked with engineering on either the software or the hardware).

I have contacted Hauppauge and their official response was the software that they supply is not Vista ready. I tried it before asking, but I was hoping they would tell me different. As the hardware is networked, I don't really think that (being compatible) is an issue (assuming MS fixes the TCP stack problem).

I tried the fixes, too, and no joy. That's why I finally broke down and bought another copy of XP.

[coryking]

That KB article and the related ones were what I was thinking as well. Since this bug appears to affect network file copies as well (not to mention just any other device that does heavy TCP/IP traffic), I'd imagine Microsoft will be rolling out a fix pretty quick.

I also found another TCP/IP related KB as well. The bug featured in this one has a "call microsoft" hotfix. Narflex, is this one on the right track?
The behavior of TCP acknowledgments (ACKs) does not change after you modify the TcpAckFrequency registry entry in Windows Vista

The good news in my case is that the lady seems to be tollerating my insistance on being an early adopter I just keep reminding her that Vista is so new we are basically beta testers (and then remind her that she'd be hard pressed to find another guy who could provide her with such a cool thing as SageTV)

[bcjenkins]

treat this with caution..

http://thehotfixshare.net/download/i...935458-x86.msu

B

[Narflex]

Originally Posted by coryking

That KB article and the related ones were what I was thinking as well. Since this bug appears to affect network file copies as well (not to mention just any other device that does heavy TCP/IP traffic), I'd imagine Microsoft will be rolling out a fix pretty quick.

I also found another TCP/IP related KB as well. The bug featured in this one has a "call microsoft" hotfix. Narflex, is this one on the right track?
The behavior of TCP acknowledgments (ACKs) does not change after you modify the TcpAckFrequency registry entry in Windows Vista

The good news in my case is that the lady seems to be tollerating my insistance on being an early adopter I just keep reminding her that Vista is so new we are basically beta testers (and then remind her that she'd be hard pressed to find another guy who could provide her with such a cool thing as SageTV)

That looked promising; but it's the opposite end of the connection for that one. The problem isn't in Vista sending ACK's. It's in Vista not re-sending TCP packets when it doesn't receive an ACK for them being sent (and even after receiving packets with mismatched sequence numbers it still doesn't realize it's lost a packet).

[JParedis]

Originally Posted by Narflex

That looked promising; but it's the opposite end of the connection for that one. The problem isn't in Vista sending ACK's. It's in Vista not re-sending TCP packets when it doesn't receive an ACK for them being sent (and even after receiving packets with mismatched sequence numbers it still doesn't realize it's lost a packet).

Aha, hadn't gone that deep in it. I did try the fix yesterday evening (getting slightly upset with these reboots, still holding of reverting to WinXP though) and as you pointed out, doesn't resolve the issue.

I did notice a behaviour I did not see before, not sure if related. When I for instance scroll through a video directory, suddenly all freezes. That's the indication of an imminent reboot. However, what I now notice is that a fraction before SageTV reboots the SageTV screen on my TV does what it was asked to do (display next page or whatever). So it seems that when finally the command gets executed, the reboot kicks in. Did not notice this before and not sure if relevant.

So back to start. Would there be any way to change the time-out period on the MVP (even if one has to go each time the MVP is started in a telnet session to do so)? I prefer a longer freeze image period than a reboot.

Jan

[stevieray7]

Finally a light at the end of the tunnel, kinda....

I've been booting into XP for viewing purposes over the network, but running Vista with Sage fulltime for recording (without a single hitch).

It's been 3 months. Not a huge inconvenience, but an inconvenience nonetheless.

[bialio]

There is some general weirdness with Vista's TCP stack - I had all kinds of problems with it until I found this command. It turns off the "auto-tuning" feature. Solved all my problems with Vista TCP stuff - it might fix the extender issue....

--------------------

- Click start
- Type: cmd
- Right-click cmd.exe when it appears under Applications
- Click Run As Administrator
- Type the following: netsh int tcp set global autotuninglevel=disabled
- Press enter
- Restart your computer

[bcjenkins]

Originally Posted by bialio

There is some general weirdness with Vista's TCP stack - I had all kinds of problems with it until I found this command. It turns off the "auto-tuning" feature. Solved all my problems with Vista TCP stuff - it might fix the extender issue....

--------------------

- Click start
- Type: cmd
- Right-click cmd.exe when it appears under Applications
- Click Run As Administrator
- Type the following: netsh int tcp set global autotuninglevel=disabled
- Press enter
- Restart your computer

Can anyone confirm this?

[carlgar]

It was one of the things I tried several weeks ago and I saw no change for this problem from it. My main issue is with the 30 second timeout problem. In general Visa file transfer is too slow for me. I have about a 1 GB test file that takes at least 5 minutes on Vista to transfer to my notebook. I can transfer the same file in 3 minutes using XP to transfer to my notebook. The autotuning change did improve the speed from hours to the current 5 minutes.

[lektrikpuke]

So, I guess it's a good thing I bought another copy of XP while I could, huh? Somebody at Sage realizes that MS plans on stopping the sale of XP pretty soon, right?

[lektrikpuke]

Did a file transfer from my one computer running XP to my Vista box the other day. Network utilization at the Vista box showed on average 92% while XP showed around 70'ish percent. Different ways of calculating utilization? One or both is errant in its report? One is more efficient than the other? They weren't really communicating with each other? Hmmm.

So, SageTV, what's the status on a fix for this problem (OP)? I'm glad Mac users can now access the software, but seeing as how we've been using it all along, don't we deserve some attention, or is our 15 minutes in the sun over?

[laurenglenn]

http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/show...9&postcount=14

Has anyone else tried this solution and gotten it to work? It made the MVP work as good in Vista HP for me as it did in XP.

Lauren

[JParedis]

Originally Posted by laurenglenn

http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/show...9&postcount=14

Has anyone else tried this solution and gotten it to work? It made the MVP work as good in Vista HP for me as it did in XP.

Lauren

Didn't do it for me, my MVP still reboots on regular bases. I do some manipulation (e.g., FF and PLAY when I'm where I should be) and all gets blocked. The video keeps on playing but no response anymore to the remote, and some time later a reboot.

I used to believe that the video is transmitted over UDP, the controls and 'screens' over IP, confirming it's an IP related problem. This article however makes me doubt. Is the video also transmitted over IP to the MVP?

Getting closer to removing VISTA and go back to XP .

Jan

[kevine]

Originally Posted by laurenglenn

http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/show...9&postcount=14

Has anyone else tried this solution and gotten it to work? It made the MVP work as good in Vista HP for me as it did in XP.

Lauren

Didn't work for me either. Vista Ultimate. I am just testing on Vista anyway. When my new system gets in Wednesday, it will be an XP Pro system. At least until Vista is stable.

[clove]

I downloaded the "Vista Network Helper" tool from http://keznews.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6974 and ran the Disable TCP auto-tuning command. I also increased the TCP retransmission timeout to 5000 as outlined here http://www.windowsitpro.com/Articles...5004.html?Ad=1.

One thing that I noticed was that this article didn't speciy setting the value as a decimal number of 5000. You should set this as a decimal value. DWORD defaults to hex and if you enter a hex value of 5000 there that would be over 20 seconds. Reboot after you make these changes.

I am running SageTV 6.2.10.152 on a 64bit Vista box with 2GB of RAM. I am using the standard UI for now. I haven't had a single crash since I made these changes. Previously my MVP would crash every few minutes. Starting live tv or a recording does still take 5+ seconds to queue up and sometimes the skip forward / backward functions will lag for a few seconds, but definitely more useable than it was.

[JParedis]

I did change the Sage timeout parameter from 15 into 45 seconds, and although I still have the IP related problem, my MVP does almost never reboots again. The IP driven menu just freeze's on me, but gets released before the 45 seconds are over - giving me back full control (and having executed the last command).

When watching a video, and doing a FFW, at least the video keeps on playing (that's not going over IP). I got the time-bar at bottom just a bit longer than it should .. but it beats a reboot.

I read about this timeout parameter on the day I intended to revert back to XP, so Microsoft just got a bit more time to resolve this IP issue. Not sure what's happening, but it sure takes them a long time to get this resolved - either they do not see it as a major issue, or it's a difficult issue to resolve.

Jan

[hawleyrw]

I researched the Vista/XP media center issue prior to buying an extender, and specifically purchased the MVP intending to run with XP media center edition (Not Vista). I had originally wanted to use an XBox to do my media center sharing, but it's much too restrictive (won't see mpg files, only works with WMV, etc). Not for me. So, rebuilt my system with XP an went from there. Works wonderfully.

Rich

[lektrikpuke]

Okay, now that Vista is releasing its SP1 beta is there any hope on the horizon, or do I have to give up on SageTV?

[carlgar]

I retested the MVP the other day after several updates were to applied to my system. The problem was still there, I encountered it after about 50 minutes. The one thing that has always bothered me about this being a TCP issue is why are there no complaints from the Sage Client users? Today, I ran across a Inside the Widows Vista Kernel:, The Multimedia Class Scheduler Service was very interesting. I then used their example to see if Sage was using it. The SageClient does appear to be using it because I saw one thread running at priority 22. I then fired up my MVP and starting watching a show and could not find any high (above 16) threads from the server. Could this be the answer to this issue?

[coryking]

Hopefully the next version. I doubt the Sage folk are gonna gut out their streaming media system for the up comming release canidate :-) To their credit, the new beta seems to have worked around the TCP/IP bug so the box just stops responding for 30 seconds instead of rebooting.

We aren't alone though. There some guy on one of Microsoft's blog's that has also been tracking this issue. ... at least I think. You can read his post about it here.