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  #1  
Old 09-03-2015, 05:13 PM
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ThePaladinTech ThePaladinTech is offline
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Thinking of building a SageTV VM

Hi all, with the excitement of Sage going open source, I'm thinking of building a VM to follow along.

When I last used SageTV, the one place it was lacking was setting up a digital tuner. As I recall it was a lot of hand done remapping of channels from the channel scan results to what the cable company called them.

At the time I was using an early version of SageDCT. Wondering if the current version is a little simpler? I also see there is an alternative to SageDCT, again is it more direct than my old experience? Are there pro's and con's to the two or is it mostly go with the new one?

Other question I have is the main reason I got out was all my extenders died (a couple hd-100s and one HD-300). So I guess I'd need to make a client PC, I do have a client license... Just one. Can I install that license on multiple PCs? ... Does the client license even matter anymore?

final question - My old sage setup, that I was quite happy with was the standard UI, tweaked by several plugins. SageMC's popularity was being challenged by Gemstone / Phoenix and Diamond. If I were to try a different skin which is the most supported now?

As I recall there was one simple plug in that the author quit supporting that was important to me. at the moment I can recall what it was, but I think it was a bjenkins plugin. for the life of me I cannot at this moment recall what it did.

Is there a current "must have" plug in list?

Thanks ... looking forward to following along as SageTV comes back
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(current) SageServer: SageTV Open Source V9 - Virtual Ubuntu on Win10 HyperV MSI 970A-G46, AMD FX-8370 , SD Prime via OpenDCT, Donater ComSkip
Clients: HD-200, Nexus Player w/ Android miniclient
Storage: "nas" 16 drive Win10 w/ DrivePool running Plex, Emby, & SD PVR
Retired - Hava, MediaMVP, HD-100, HD-PVR, HVR-2250, Ceton InfiniTV4, Original (white) HDHomeRun Died - HD-100, HD-300
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  #2  
Old 09-03-2015, 06:41 PM
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Fuzzy Fuzzy is offline
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Couple things. Digital ATSC configuration is incredile simple. Mostly channel scan, and go. Digital QAM is tougher, because cable co's do not make things friendly on that front. Callsigns are sometimes wrong or missing, etc. That's where the manual process comes in, and would be the case with any QAM tuning system. CableCard is actually pretty easy, once the cable-co has figured out how to pair it up and authorize it. Mapping is done by the cablecard, so channel numbers are identical as they would be on a cable box. Pretty much the only manual stuff is manually removing all the channels that are DRM'd, since sage cannot record them.

Regarding a client PC. Just about anything today will play 'good enough' for a client PC. The other option - there are actually new in box HD-300 extenders available for sale right now from Opus4 here on the forums. They are more than the original price, and instead are closer to the market price of used ones, but they are new. Worth a look.
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unRAID Server: i7-6700, 32GB RAM, Dual 128GB SSD cache and 13TB pool, with SageTVv9, openDCT, Logitech Media Server and Plex Media Server each in Dockers.
Sources: HRHR Prime with Charter CableCard. HDHR-US for OTA.
Primary Client: HD-300 through XBoxOne in Living Room, Samsung HLT-6189S
Other Clients: Mi Box in Master Bedroom, HD-200 in kids room
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  #3  
Old 09-04-2015, 06:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePaladinTech View Post
Other question I have is the main reason I got out was all my extenders died (a couple hd-100s and one HD-300). So I guess I'd need to make a client PC, I do have a client license... Just one. Can I install that license on multiple PCs? ... Does the client license even matter anymore?
No. There were two changes recently. First, the OSS version of Sage removes the license requirements (in the commercial version, the Server would check its own license to make sure it was valid and it would check the client licenses and make sure only one client was using the same license).

Second, they added a license check to the Sage EPG server. The Sage server needs to present a valid license to the EPG server whenever it gets EPG data now. The EPG server doesn't care too much about the type of license, so it is possible to use a Windows license on a Linux server or vice versa now.

The only piece missing right now is the Windows EXE file. Sage is actually written in Java, and the main program is actually a JAR file. I guess on Linux you invoke the JAR file directly. But, in Windows, you launch an EXE (sage.exe). Although the license checking code was removed from the core JAR file, the Windows EXE has not been rebuilt yet and it still checks for a license file.

This means:
  1. You can run the OSS version of server or client today on Linux without any license.
  2. If you want EPG data from Sage, you still need a license for the server, but not the client.
  3. You can get EPG from alternate sources without a Sage license, but may need a license for the alternate EPG provider (there is a Schedules Direct EPG plugin, but you need an account with Schedules Direct to use it).
  4. On Windows, you still need to install an old commercial version of Sage (v7.1.9) with a valid license first and then replace a couple of files to get the new OSS version of Sage (v9.x.x) running for now. This requirement is expected to go away soon.
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  #4  
Old 09-04-2015, 06:56 AM
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Fuzzy Fuzzy is offline
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The SageTVClient.exe file also continues to ask for a license, but since the 'no two clients can use the same license' check was in the server, and was removed from the v9 sage.jar, it means you'd be able to install multiple clients, with your one valid key, and it would get rid of the license prompts, yet still function fully. So, if you've still got your serer license, and a single client license, you can get up and running fully by installing the latest commercial release of the respective softwares, using your keys, and then replace a couple files to get up to the v9.x.x verison of sage. You'd still have full sagetv EPG data, and you can have an endless number of PC clients.

Hopefully, soon there will be some freshly compiled v9.x.x launchers, and installers, so you'd be able to do everything (except sagetv EPG data) without any license at all.
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unRAID Server: i7-6700, 32GB RAM, Dual 128GB SSD cache and 13TB pool, with SageTVv9, openDCT, Logitech Media Server and Plex Media Server each in Dockers.
Sources: HRHR Prime with Charter CableCard. HDHR-US for OTA.
Primary Client: HD-300 through XBoxOne in Living Room, Samsung HLT-6189S
Other Clients: Mi Box in Master Bedroom, HD-200 in kids room
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  #5  
Old 09-04-2015, 10:23 AM
HokiePerogi HokiePerogi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePaladinTech View Post
Other question I have is the main reason I got out was all my extenders died (a couple hd-100s and one HD-300). So I guess I'd need to make a client PC
Check out the following thread. There are an unspecified number of HD300 available for order. I snagged mine, you might want to do the same before you have to resort to eBay supply & demand pricing.

http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=62052
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Capture: HDHomeRun PRIME ♠ Ceton InfiniTV 4 PCIe (Clear-QAM only)
Tuning: OpenDCT v0.5.20-RC2
Software: Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit ♠ SageTV v9.0.12.504 ♠ Java 1.8.0_111
Clients: 4 x STX-HD300 ♠ 3 x STX-HD200 ♠ MacOS Placeshifter
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  #6  
Old 09-04-2015, 10:40 AM
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ThePaladinTech ThePaladinTech is offline
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Thanks all! Yeah, I never got rid of any of my sageTV licenses... So I've got several server licenses, 1 client, and bunch of placeshifter keys.
While I loved the extenders the 300 burning up on me soured me a bit on the extender

My 100's lasted WAY longer... needed caps replaced, but lasted much longer... the 300 is just dead

Right now I've got a lenovo Q150 hooked to one tv, and a foxconn e350 on another. so getting the client going is my goal. Although... i dunno it was nice to just turn on the extender, not deal with codecs et al.

So I think part of the plan this weekend is to build the VM, and trying my hand at 'upgrading' the install to version 9
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(current) SageServer: SageTV Open Source V9 - Virtual Ubuntu on Win10 HyperV MSI 970A-G46, AMD FX-8370 , SD Prime via OpenDCT, Donater ComSkip
Clients: HD-200, Nexus Player w/ Android miniclient
Storage: "nas" 16 drive Win10 w/ DrivePool running Plex, Emby, & SD PVR
Retired - Hava, MediaMVP, HD-100, HD-PVR, HVR-2250, Ceton InfiniTV4, Original (white) HDHomeRun Died - HD-100, HD-300
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  #7  
Old 09-04-2015, 10:41 AM
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Fuzzy Fuzzy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePaladinTech View Post
Thanks all! Yeah, I never got rid of any of my sageTV licenses... So I've got several server licenses, 1 client, and bunch of placeshifter keys.
While I loved the extenders the 300 burning up on me soured me a bit on the extender

My 100's lasted WAY longer... needed caps replaced, but lasted much longer... the 300 is just dead

Right now I've got a lenovo Q150 hooked to one tv, and a foxconn e350 on another. so getting the client going is my goal. Although... i dunno it was nice to just turn on the extender, not deal with codecs et al.

So I think part of the plan this weekend is to build the VM, and trying my hand at 'upgrading' the install to version 9
Codecs, in general, are much easier than they used to be. You can get pretty much all the way there simply installing ffmpeg, and LAV.
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unRAID Server: i7-6700, 32GB RAM, Dual 128GB SSD cache and 13TB pool, with SageTVv9, openDCT, Logitech Media Server and Plex Media Server each in Dockers.
Sources: HRHR Prime with Charter CableCard. HDHR-US for OTA.
Primary Client: HD-300 through XBoxOne in Living Room, Samsung HLT-6189S
Other Clients: Mi Box in Master Bedroom, HD-200 in kids room
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  #8  
Old 09-04-2015, 11:16 AM
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UgaData UgaData is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePaladinTech View Post
Thanks all! Yeah, I never got rid of any of my sageTV licenses... So I've got several server licenses, 1 client, and bunch of placeshifter keys.
If you have multiple Server Lis. you can also use the client option from a server install, at least for the short term.

FWIW - I've just recently setup my SageTV Server in a VM as well (2 maybe 3 weeks ago). I am using a Ceton ETH6 tuner (4 tuners are for SageTV the other 2 are for WMC7). If your using a Ceton tuner your stuck with SageDCT (for now), If you use a Silicon Dust tuner you can use SageDCT but there is another option as well check the hardware portion of the forum.

http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=62055
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Last edited by UgaData; 09-04-2015 at 11:18 AM. Reason: added link to HDHR Network Encoder
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  #9  
Old 09-04-2015, 02:06 PM
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Fuzzy Fuzzy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UgaData View Post
If you have multiple Server Lis. you can also use the client option from a server install, at least for the short term.

FWIW - I've just recently setup my SageTV Server in a VM as well (2 maybe 3 weeks ago). I am using a Ceton ETH6 tuner (4 tuners are for SageTV the other 2 are for WMC7). If your using a Ceton tuner your stuck with SageDCT (for now), If you use a Silicon Dust tuner you can use SageDCT but there is another option as well check the hardware portion of the forum.

http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=62055
As mentioned, the v9 server will accept the same client license from multiple clients, so the only reason for a client license at all at this point is as a singular task to get rid of the license prompts from the v7 launcher. In short, 1 server and 1 client license is the maximum utility that can be gained.
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Buy Fuzzy a beer! (Fuzzy likes beer)

unRAID Server: i7-6700, 32GB RAM, Dual 128GB SSD cache and 13TB pool, with SageTVv9, openDCT, Logitech Media Server and Plex Media Server each in Dockers.
Sources: HRHR Prime with Charter CableCard. HDHR-US for OTA.
Primary Client: HD-300 through XBoxOne in Living Room, Samsung HLT-6189S
Other Clients: Mi Box in Master Bedroom, HD-200 in kids room
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  #10  
Old 09-10-2015, 12:31 PM
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ThePaladinTech ThePaladinTech is offline
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Hey All -
So I've built a VM, Added SageTV
I've fixed the Java Issue by installing C++ 2010 runtimes (?) - found on another topic

I'm trying to get the primenet encoder going. The tuner says it is functional within sage BTW, but I get a "no signal" after tuning a station.

I read om the PrimeNetEncoder topic someone said "if you can't get the HDRH view working you won't get this working" - I'm wondering how true that is? as I cannot run the HDHR view app on my VM, it states my video card doesn't support shaders. The tuner says it is functional within sage BTW, but I get a "no signal" after tuning a station. If that is a deal breaker for PrimeEncoder is it also an issue with SageDCT???

Next question RE this is I read it doesn't do tuner locking (yet) - Does SageDCT do tuner locking? with all the stuff I am playing with tuner locking is pretty important, but if I have to dedicat a tuner to sage to play with it, well that is doable.

I could post in the several page long PrimeNet topic (which I have read through btw) but thought my random questions are better asked here.

As always I am greatful for this awesome community helping out!
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(current) SageServer: SageTV Open Source V9 - Virtual Ubuntu on Win10 HyperV MSI 970A-G46, AMD FX-8370 , SD Prime via OpenDCT, Donater ComSkip
Clients: HD-200, Nexus Player w/ Android miniclient
Storage: "nas" 16 drive Win10 w/ DrivePool running Plex, Emby, & SD PVR
Retired - Hava, MediaMVP, HD-100, HD-PVR, HVR-2250, Ceton InfiniTV4, Original (white) HDHomeRun Died - HD-100, HD-300
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  #11  
Old 09-10-2015, 02:58 PM
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UgaData UgaData is offline
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To actually tune and watch a channel on the server when it's in a VM most likely isn't going to happen. I have read that using Hyper-V with RemoteFX, video can be watched in an RDP session, but that requires special licensing, at least for the long run and I think it requires specific hardware as well.

I'm using a Ceton tuner with SageDCT and it is working from a VM. I have to use a client or extender to view/watch anything.

I don't think anything being used with SageTV is locking a tuner, at least not at this time.

I would think if SageDCT works from a VM the primenet encoder should as well. I suspect you won't be able to test with the app directly on/from the server. And any viewing/watching will need to be done from a client/extender.
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Last edited by UgaData; 09-10-2015 at 03:05 PM.
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  #12  
Old 09-10-2015, 03:00 PM
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Fuzzy Fuzzy is offline
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This is most likely a configuration problem with primenetencoder. Go ahead and post over in that thread.
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unRAID Server: i7-6700, 32GB RAM, Dual 128GB SSD cache and 13TB pool, with SageTVv9, openDCT, Logitech Media Server and Plex Media Server each in Dockers.
Sources: HRHR Prime with Charter CableCard. HDHR-US for OTA.
Primary Client: HD-300 through XBoxOne in Living Room, Samsung HLT-6189S
Other Clients: Mi Box in Master Bedroom, HD-200 in kids room
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  #13  
Old 09-10-2015, 03:28 PM
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cat6man cat6man is offline
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Can someone tell me if the open source Linux is ready for use, or is it in development (alpha) phase?

I want to replace my windows machine with a small low power linux thingy.

All I need is standard sagetv with hdhr and hdhr-prime tuners (all of which still work great today)
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  #14  
Old 09-10-2015, 03:48 PM
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Fuzzy Fuzzy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cat6man View Post
Can someone tell me if the open source Linux is ready for use, or is it in development (alpha) phase?

I want to replace my windows machine with a small low power linux thingy.

All I need is standard sagetv with hdhr and hdhr-prime tuners (all of which still work great today)
I believe that, yes, the Linux install is fully functional. I don't know if there is a solution for the HDHR-Prime on Linux.
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Buy Fuzzy a beer! (Fuzzy likes beer)

unRAID Server: i7-6700, 32GB RAM, Dual 128GB SSD cache and 13TB pool, with SageTVv9, openDCT, Logitech Media Server and Plex Media Server each in Dockers.
Sources: HRHR Prime with Charter CableCard. HDHR-US for OTA.
Primary Client: HD-300 through XBoxOne in Living Room, Samsung HLT-6189S
Other Clients: Mi Box in Master Bedroom, HD-200 in kids room
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  #15  
Old 09-14-2015, 10:15 PM
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cat6man cat6man is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzy View Post
I believe that, yes, the Linux install is fully functional. I don't know if there is a solution for the HDHR-Prime on Linux.
thanks fuzzy.
the lack of hdhr-prime makes linux a non-starter for me.
guess i'll live with sageDCT a while longer
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  #16  
Old 11-01-2015, 11:50 AM
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gordyp gordyp is offline
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On Windows, you still need to install an old commercial version of Sage (v7.1.9) with a valid license first and then replace a couple of files to get the new OSS version of Sage (v9.x.x) running for now. This requirement is expected to go away soon.

Do you happen to know which files need to be replaced, and/or do you know if this has been resolved? I have not been able to get the new version running yet...
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  #17  
Old 11-01-2015, 04:19 PM
Monedeath Monedeath is offline
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There still is no Windows installer for SageTV9 for Windows, so it requires doing a V7 install and then upgrading of the individual files.

There are some ongoing reports of random/strange issues cropping up for people running the V9 windows exe files that haven't been fully resolved just yet.

The Open Source Forum does have posts that walk through the process.
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