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SageTV Github Development Discussion related to SageTV Open Source Development. Use this forum for development topics about the Open Source versions of SageTV, hosted on Github.

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  #21  
Old 06-17-2016, 07:00 AM
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EnterNoEscape EnterNoEscape is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
An alternative option would be to have that be part of the setup wizard (in the STV) that's run the first time you run Sage.
I like that idea and it would take the burden off the installer. A list of EPG source plugins could be downloaded from an up-to-date source and either be installed as a part of the first run wizard or the list could be incorporated into the wizard when you add a new capture device.
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  #22  
Old 06-17-2016, 07:56 AM
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stanger89 stanger89 is offline
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The other benefit is that's cross platform, it will work the same whether your server is Windows or Linux.
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  #23  
Old 06-17-2016, 08:16 AM
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Yeah, ultimately, whether the plugin is installed by the installer, or once inside sage, each of the EPG plugins REALLY need their configuration to be done from inside the STV. If this is just a file that defines the configurable options and the properties they set, and the STV detects that and reads in those options to dynamicly generate a config screen, or if each are required to have a UIMOD that hooks into the STV - either way, it's something that needs to be worked towards. I, personally, am not even aware of what it currently takes to set up a different EPG source, as I've always just used sage (I've told myself many times to go through the schedules direct process, but it hasn't happened yet).
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  #24  
Old 06-17-2016, 09:40 AM
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I think the SD EPG support (and probably commercial skipping support) should be rolled into the core in some way, shape or form. The end goal is to have the user click "install" and have it work without installing plugins, editing files, and other assorted voodoo.

If we want more people to use Sage it must be easy. Right now the learning curve for new users is too steep.
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  #25  
Old 06-17-2016, 10:12 AM
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EnterNoEscape EnterNoEscape is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmiranda View Post
I think the SD EPG support (and probably commercial skipping support) should be rolled into the core in some way, shape or form. The end goal is to have the user click "install" and have it work without installing plugins, editing files, and other assorted voodoo.

If we want more people to use Sage it must be easy. Right now the learning curve for new users is too steep.
I prefer that it remain a plugin so it can be fixed/updated more quickly; maybe it would just be "pre-installed." I also think that the EPG plugins should be made easier to find/install/configure than normal plugins.
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  #26  
Old 06-17-2016, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EnterNoEscape View Post
I prefer that it remain a plugin so it can be fixed/updated more quickly; maybe it would just be "pre-installed." I also think that the EPG plugins should be made easier to find/install/configure than normal plugins.
Pre-installed plugins would be my preference as well. I think the key is that the user doesn't have to do much after installation.
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  #27  
Old 06-17-2016, 05:09 PM
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KryptoNyte KryptoNyte is offline
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Could the SageTV installer launch from a webpage, similar to how Adobe Reader is downloaded (with riders)? On that webpage there would be a list of plugins with a checkbox beside each (and probably a description for each), with the webpage launcher dynamically updated per the current plugin repository.

If you want to marvel in the beauty of a website driven application, get yourself a one month subscription to the iRacing service, if for no other reason than to see how an app is operated from a dynamic website interface.

Not sure exactly how an uninstall would go ...

I dunno. The only real issue that I have with plugins as they are today is the long list of things that I didn't select to install (dependencies). I understand why it is that way, but it's hard for an end user to filter through that list and make sense of it.
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  #28  
Old 06-17-2016, 08:11 PM
trk2 trk2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmiranda View Post
If we want more people to use Sage it must be easy. Right now the learning curve for new users is too steep.
I agree with your points philosophically, but the competition is not easy to install or configure either. As a long time Sage user, with no programming experience, let me humbly offer up my opinion on this topic:

We need to grow the user base, but to do that I think we really need more devs and users who are going to contribute to improving Sage. Honestly, the EPG is the tip of the iceberg when it comes to user friendliness. I think we need to be building to a "release" of V9 with as much fanfare as we can generate but it should be targeted towards attracting potential contributors and media server veterans. We should highlight the advantages of Sage's DVR system, the new Android and IOS miniclients and openly state that we're looking for contributors. Some new, but savvy users would be valuable in pointing out the barriers to installing, configuring, and using Sage as well as provide focus on what to improve for V10.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KryptoNyte View Post
The only real issue that I have with plugins as they are today is the long list of things that I didn't select to install (dependencies). I understand why it is that way, but it's hard for an end user to filter through that list and make sense of it.
I think this is a good point about the user friendliness of the current plugin system. It would be nice if in the future the dependencies could be moved to a separate tab in the plugin system and filtered from the standard views, but still easily accessible if they need to be installed manually.
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  #29  
Old 06-18-2016, 01:51 PM
SageWizdom SageWizdom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzy View Post
We can modify the plugin system to, on startup once the plugin manager is up and running, look for a loadplugins.txt file that is a simple list of plugins by id, pull those plugins in, and then delete the text file. The installer would simply have to dynamically create this file as it needs.
This is a great idea and would totally get what I was attempting. This list could be generated by an installer, a web page or just a default based on the downloaded version. Yes it requires a Sage restart, but is not a deal breaker in any way as the first boot would (should) count and auto pull in the plugins.

I'll go write a feature request.

I will also note, while this chases my particular goal, there are a lot of great ideas in this sub that I enjoyed reading.
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  #30  
Old 06-20-2016, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trk2 View Post
I think this is a good point about the user friendliness of the current plugin system. It would be nice if in the future the dependencies could be moved to a separate tab in the plugin system and filtered from the standard views, but still easily accessible if they need to be installed manually.
most of the 'dependency-only' plugins are in the Library section, so most of them are already spread out. UI Mods and General are all most people would need to go to - that said, it would be great if there was a rating system, and plugins could be sorted by rating, but that's a lot more dependency on a server based repository that doesn't really exist at this point.
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