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Hardware Support Discussions related to using various hardware setups with SageTV products. Anything relating to capture cards, remotes, infrared receivers/transmitters, system compatibility or other hardware related problems or suggestions should be posted here.

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  #1  
Old 07-15-2011, 01:15 PM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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HDPVR audio sync issues

Hi there,

I have been struggling to get my HDPVR recordings to have proper audio and video sync.

My setup includes: 2x HDPVRs ver F2, component + spdif, 2x DishNetwork 211Ks, and Win7 64-bit SP1.

When searching the forms I found many postings about this issue. The postings are all very old; which suggests that this is no longer an issue for people. Good news, right? The problem is that the solutions in these posts don't seem to work for me.

I am using the latest drivers (1.5.7.0) and have the TME software installed.

I tried various audio hook ups (RCA or spdif), it didn't seem to make a difference.

For a long time I would get frequent unit failures. The HDPVR would just stop recording all together and I would have to reboot the unit. For some reason ,that I am unaware of, this just stopped happening. Now I never get failures, but I do still get audio sync problems.

I also contacted Hauppauge directly.

After communicating for a while, they replaced my units. My original units were ver F1 and now my new ones are ver F2.

The new units recorded a few shows with no problem the day that I hooked up them up. But since then all my recordings have been out of sync. I am not sure what that means.

I read that I should try to change the resolution that my shows are recorded in. I.E. locked at 720p, locked at 1080i, whatever the source show is broadcast in. But I can't figure out where that setting is.

I am running out of ideas, does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks
Les
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  #2  
Old 07-18-2011, 09:45 AM
wolfie99 wolfie99 is offline
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I'm having the same issues are you are having (with relatively the same equipment). I didn't have the audio sync issues for a long time (months), but now it has reared it's ugly head again.

I'm in the process of getting new HD-PVR's since mine were quite old (C1's) and are constantly freezing. I'm hoping that new HD-PVR's (F2's) may fix the issue. If that fixes both issues (freezing and audio sync) then I will be a happy camper, but I don't think it will be that easy.

If I find out the fix I will let you know.
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  #3  
Old 07-18-2011, 12:18 PM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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Thanks wolfie, I will also update this post with any new info I find.
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  #4  
Old 07-20-2011, 07:45 PM
wolfie99 wolfie99 is offline
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I replaced my old Hauppauge HD-PVR's a couple of days ago with new ones (F1's). After 48 hours, it 'looks' like this has fixed both of my freezing and audio sync issues. I don't know what else to say. Time will tell if this has fixed it for me. Also I'm currently using component. I'm tempted to try SPDIF but I worry that my audio sync issue will appear.
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  #5  
Old 07-20-2011, 08:00 PM
skozin skozin is offline
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I have contacted both Hauppauge and SageTV a while ago, and Hauppauge asked me to record with the Total Media Extreme and see if there was any sync issues. I never seemed to have any issues with their software. When I contacted Sage, the response I received was that they new about the issue and thought it might be a communication issue with Dish network and the HD-PVR. There was no solution to fix this issue and to this day I keep on getting lag audio issues. I also have an OTA usb card to record Over the Air on my system and that seems to never have an audio sync issue, just Dish network on the HD-PVR. My only solution is to restart Sage and power cycle the HD-PVR.

I don't think it is the HD-PVR. Just wondering if people with Direct TV or Comcast or At&T are having any issues.

Last edited by skozin; 07-20-2011 at 08:04 PM.
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  #6  
Old 07-21-2011, 11:40 AM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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skozin,
You mention that you have to power cycle your HDPVRs. When you do so, does it fix your audio sync problems? For a short while at least?

wolfie99,
I am really curious to hear about your status in a couple days, if you don't mind.

Thanks again
Les
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  #7  
Old 08-12-2011, 05:49 PM
n9cqs n9cqs is offline
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one works, one does not

I added a new VIP222 DISH recently with an older HD-PVR sitting around, and have absolutely no audio sync problems at all.

I have a VIP211 DISH with R5000 (that I have been fighting issues with for 18 months, but that is for another forum). In a last ditched effort to prove that the receiver itself was bad (it keeps rebooting itself arbitrarily), I bought a brand new HD-PVR. The Audio sync issues that are being mentioned here became apparent with that receiver immediately.

One thing I noticed in my recordings, the VIP222 combined with the older HD-PVR records at 29.97 fps while the VIP211 combined with the new HD-PVR records video at 30 fps. I presume the difference is because of the VIP 211? And could that be enough for this audio problem?
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  #8  
Old 08-15-2011, 01:42 PM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n9cqs View Post
I added a new VIP222 DISH recently with an older HD-PVR sitting around, and have absolutely no audio sync problems at all.

I have a VIP211 DISH with R5000 (that I have been fighting issues with for 18 months, but that is for another forum). In a last ditched effort to prove that the receiver itself was bad (it keeps rebooting itself arbitrarily), I bought a brand new HD-PVR. The Audio sync issues that are being mentioned here became apparent with that receiver immediately.

One thing I noticed in my recordings, the VIP222 combined with the older HD-PVR records at 29.97 fps while the VIP211 combined with the new HD-PVR records video at 30 fps. I presume the difference is because of the VIP 211? And could that be enough for this audio problem?
The fps difference sure sounds like it could be a problem. However, it's also different hardware, so maybe something else is going on?

Do you notice your audio problems growing at certain points within the recording? Or is it a gradual problem that continues to grow evenly within your recording?

Personally, I notice that my audio sync problems seem to start with commercial breaks. From what I understand, it is something about the change in resolutions that happens when it switches from program to commercial and then back to program.

Someone told me to have my STB lock the output resolution to 720P and it might solve my problems. However, I have not figured out how to do this. Do you know how to do it with your VIP211?

Thanks
Les
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  #9  
Old 08-17-2011, 02:30 PM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by les_bloom View Post
The fps difference sure sounds like it could be a problem. However, it's also different hardware, so maybe something else is going on?

Do you notice your audio problems growing at certain points within the recording? Or is it a gradual problem that continues to grow evenly within your recording?

Personally, I notice that my audio sync problems seem to start with commercial breaks. From what I understand, it is something about the change in resolutions that happens when it switches from program to commercial and then back to program.

Someone told me to have my STB lock the output resolution to 720P and it might solve my problems. However, I have not figured out how to do this. Do you know how to do it with your VIP211?

Thanks
Les
I found out how to lock the output of my VIP211 last night.

One of my STBs was set to output 480p, so I changed it to output 1080i. Before changing it, I noticed that recordings from that STB were captured at 30fps. After changing it, I noticed that my recordings are at 29.97fps. These new recordings do not appear to have audio sync issues

MY other STB was already set to output at 1080i. I looked at the recordings from that STB and they were at 30fps. So (as a just in case) I went back to that STB, changed it to output 720p, and then changed it to output 1080i again. And after doing that, the recordings from that STB are at 29.97fps. These recordings seem to have audio sync fixed as well

So there you have it.

Sounds like the recordings at 30fps vs 29.97fps are in fact causing a problem.

Thanks n9cqs for that piece of info

Hopefully you can try something similar with the STB that is connected to your newer HDPVR.

Note that you might need to change and re-change the values (like I did with my 2nd STB) in order for the HDPVR to pick up the change.

Les
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  #10  
Old 08-17-2011, 06:48 PM
n9cqs n9cqs is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by les_bloom View Post
I found out how to lock the output of my VIP211 last night.


Sounds like the recordings at 30fps vs 29.97fps are in fact causing a problem.

Thanks n9cqs for that piece of info


Les
Thanks Les! Yes, that would seem to be a big part of the problem. My older VIP211 seems to want to put out 30fps. I have a new one on the way, so we will see what that does. But yes, that is the issue, plain and simple.

By the way, my older (silver) VIP211 with R5000 has been giving me fits... gaps in the recording... which is why I got a HD-PVR to hook to it. That showed me that the receiver was actually shutting down, coming back on (power-cycling) and then going through the whole satellite acquisition routine. I noticed it doing that a lot one evening when the room was especially hot, and so put a fan on the receiver to really cool it and (knock on wood) so far, so good! R5000 back in business on that one, too.

Thanks for also giving us indication as to what you did. It certainly is the 29.97 vs. 30 fps causing the audio sync issues.

Jeff
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  #11  
Old 08-18-2011, 11:37 AM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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Well, I spoke a bit too soon =/

Getting my HDPVR to record at 29.97fps is the fix for the audio problems.

However, getting my HDPVR to stay recording at that frame rate is the real issue.

I got my HDPVR to record at 29.97 vs 30 by changing the output resolution of my VIP211. However, at 4am every day my VIP211 shuts off to do an update. As soon as this happens, my HDPVR reverts and starts recording at 30fps again.

As a test, I set shows to record from 11pm to 9am. Everything up to 4am was recorded at 29.97 and everything after that was recorded at 30.

Does anyone have any ideas how to get around this problem?

Thanks again
Les
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  #12  
Old 08-19-2011, 02:32 AM
sflamm sflamm is offline
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If I recall correctly, I believe I found that setting the STB to output 1080i (fixed) is the cure. No need to change the frame rate it is recorded at....
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  #13  
Old 08-19-2011, 01:03 PM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sflamm View Post
If I recall correctly, I believe I found that setting the STB to output 1080i (fixed) is the cure. No need to change the frame rate it is recorded at....
That helped me part of the way, but not all the way


When I set my STB set to 1080i fixed output, it causes my HDPVR to record at 1080i@29.97fps. And then everything records perfectly

But then at 4am, my STB does its update, and that causes my HDPVR to suddenly start recording at 1080i@30fps. And then everything is out of sync again.

Then I go back to my STB, and check what the fixed output setting is at. It is still at 1080i. But if I change it to something else and then change it back to 1080i, it causes my HDPVR to start recording at 1080i@29.97fps. And once again everything records great.

Until 4am again ....


This has been my situation for the last few days.


Any idea?
Thanks
Les
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  #14  
Old 08-19-2011, 03:22 PM
sflamm sflamm is offline
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One idea is to put your STB on a timer (ie. vacation timer style) and have it off during their upgrade cycle from 3:45a - 4:15a.

How is that for a creative solution?
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  #15  
Old 08-20-2011, 07:13 AM
ccsmoke ccsmoke is offline
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Don't have a VIP211 but found a old post that maybe of revelance

http://www.satelliteguys.us/dish-net...saver-bug.html
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  #16  
Old 08-22-2011, 07:58 PM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccsmoke View Post
Don't have a VIP211 but found a old post that maybe of revelance

http://www.satelliteguys.us/dish-net...saver-bug.html
From what I understand, Dish Network removed the ability to stop the daily update process.

However, I am going to try that code tonight and see if anything happens. I got my fingers crossed
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  #17  
Old 08-23-2011, 12:06 PM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sflamm View Post
One idea is to put your STB on a timer (ie. vacation timer style) and have it off during their upgrade cycle from 3:45a - 4:15a.

How is that for a creative solution?
I couldn't find a setting like this in my STB unfortunately.
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  #18  
Old 08-23-2011, 12:07 PM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by les_bloom View Post
From what I understand, Dish Network removed the ability to stop the daily update process.

However, I am going to try that code tonight and see if anything happens. I got my fingers crossed
I was able to disable the screen save, but that didn't fix my problem.

I was not able to disable the updates, that feature is no longer on my STB.
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  #19  
Old 08-30-2011, 04:21 PM
les_bloom les_bloom is offline
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I appear to have found a better solution to my audio sync issues.

I tried locking my STB to 720p instead of 1080i. After doing this, I found that about half of my recordings worked perfectly and the other half were out of sync.

The recordings at 720p are captured at 60fps, and that works fine. It's only the 1080i recordings that need to be 29.97fps. More importantly, the HDPVR defaults to recording at 60fps with 720p, so there is no required trickery to get the HDPVR to stay recording at the correct fps.

Eventually I noticed that the half that were out of sync were also recording 5.1 audio, and the half that worked were recording stereo audio. So I set my HDPVRs to use RCA instead of SPDIF.

Now all my recordings are in sync.

The best part is that I have not had to do any daily power cycling. When the STB does its 4am update, my HDPVR keeps recording at 720@60fps.

I have had this setup this way for about 3 days, and have had no problems yet.

It sort of sucks that I must give up the 5.1 recording, but at this point I will take what I can get

/fingers crossed

Thanks
Les
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  #20  
Old 09-03-2011, 04:37 PM
n9cqs n9cqs is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by les_bloom View Post
I appear to have found a better solution to my audio sync issues.

...

It sort of sucks that I must give up the 5.1 recording, but at this point I will ake what I can get

/fingers crossed

Thanks
Les
Les,
How old are your DISH receivers? I had the troubles you had with Audio sync with an 18 month old VIP 211 (the big silver one, not the newer "k" version). Sometime it worked, sometimes it didn't. That receiver has R5000 in it, and I found that it has a bit of a heat problem which I was able to solve by using small fans around it. But... I was using HD-PVR to help with the diagnosis.

I have since added two NEW receivers to my system with two HD-PVRs. One is a VIP 222 k, the other a VIP 211 k. I have no sync issues with either of these.

If you are leasing your receivers, you might try trading them for new ones. I am getting 29.97 fps 1080i and Dolby 5.1 audio with no sync problems at all after two or so weeks.

Jeff
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