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  #1  
Old 09-27-2017, 09:45 AM
waynedunham waynedunham is offline
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Non SageTV OTA PVR

I would like to get some kind of OTA PVR for my Mom, but there are several restrictions on what can be used at her location.

The main qualification that it needs is that it cannot need/require and internet connection for getting guide data. My Mom has no WiFi available, and only has a dial up internet connection. So there is no "always on" internet connection.

My Mom is also 83 years old and not very good (OK, HORRIBLE!) with technology so the UI has to be pretty simple.

If I lived anywhere nearby then I might try to set up a SageTV setup, but I'm 350+ miles away so that isn't realistic.

Ideally it would have at least 2 tuners as well, but that is probably just a pipe dream.

The TiVo is another possibility, but I'm not sure whether is can use a phone connection to get guide data, or whether it requires an internet connection. Plus then there's the whole deal with having to find a reasonable price on a lifetime unit. The monthly fees for their guide are not realistic *IMHO*.

Any thoughts on something I might not have thought of already.
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Old 09-27-2017, 11:06 AM
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TabloTV would likely be a good candidate, but, I think the "no internet" is going to be a barrier for most pvr solutions, and likely an issue for tablo as well.

https://www.tablotv.com/
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Old 09-27-2017, 01:23 PM
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Hmmm you know that where SageTV may come in handy if it still dose this as I recall it can still pulling the EPG off the TV station channel with out any internet just keep that only days or two of guide data.
UPDATE: it works is still pulling the data off channel I just test this on my laptop and WinTV-daulHD with out any internet, But it may not be very reliable it dose auto up date ever 4 hours so you may have miss data for some channel where internet data EPG is far more reliable.
On first tuner just Select: Do Not Use Program Guide Data with this Source.
As you add the other tuner in you just Select: Use or Copy an Existing Channel Lineup for this Source.
You could just build and small pc slap in quadHD running windows and set it up to auto run a full screen, then get a remote for setup using the Hauppauge one IR.

Another option but you need call and check with Channel Master on there DVR+ I think it also works without the internet by pulling the EPG off the TV station channel, but want and op for 1TB Expansion USB Hard Drive to go with that DVR+ as it only come 16GB storage.
TabloTV, Simple TV, TiVo Bolt and most other need the internet for there EPG service.

Last edited by SHS; 09-27-2017 at 03:31 PM.
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Old 09-27-2017, 07:28 PM
razrsharpe razrsharpe is offline
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I've heard good things about the Channel Master DVR+ (I have not personally used the device). It has dual tuners and doesn't require an internet connection (2 days guide data without internet).

https://www.channelmaster.com/DVR_Pl...m-7500gb16.htm

EDIT: just read all of SHS's response recommending the DVR+
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  #5  
Old 09-27-2017, 08:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waynedunham View Post
I would like to get some kind of OTA PVR for my Mom, but there are several restrictions on what can be used at her location.

The main qualification that it needs is that it cannot need/require and internet connection for getting guide data. My Mom has no WiFi available, and only has a dial up internet connection. So there is no "always on" internet connection.

My Mom is also 83 years old and not very good (OK, HORRIBLE!) with technology so the UI has to be pretty simple.

If I lived anywhere nearby then I might try to set up a SageTV setup, but I'm 350+ miles away so that isn't realistic.

Ideally it would have at least 2 tuners as well, but that is probably just a pipe dream.

The TiVo is another possibility, but I'm not sure whether is can use a phone connection to get guide data, or whether it requires an internet connection. Plus then there's the whole deal with having to find a reasonable price on a lifetime unit. The monthly fees for their guide are not realistic *IMHO*.

Any thoughts on something I might not have thought of already.
A used Tivo Premiere, Roamio or Bolt WITH Lifetime service. The easiest, most reliable DVR's ever built, and OTA friendly. You'd have to research the phone connection. Do so here: www.tivocommunity.com
I actually found a Tivo HD Lifetime at a thrift store for $15! Don't expect that luck. Realistically on Craigslist, $130 for a Premiere, $200 for a Roamio, used. Shoot for those prices.
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Last edited by tvmaster2; 09-27-2017 at 09:57 PM.
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  #6  
Old 09-30-2017, 06:31 PM
waynedunham waynedunham is offline
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Thanks for the suggestions everyone.

If I am seeing things right in my searches it looks like a Tivo series 3 might be the perfect option. Mom has a phone line in the basement right under the TV location and also right near where I'm running the antenna line up through the floor so running a line to the unit would be no problem. It appears they do OTA just fine and with a lifetime sub and using a phone line it should get full EPG support. I'm seeing many places online where they can be had for $150 or even less.

The CM DVR+ is another option. The external storage isn't an issue, I've got lots of old HD's sitting around. However no internet and no ability to "phone it in" means only a couple days of EPG which isn't optimum.

Again, thanks to everyone for their help with this non SageTV question.
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Old 09-30-2017, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by waynedunham View Post
Thanks for the suggestions everyone.

If I am seeing things right in my searches it looks like a Tivo series 3 might be the perfect option. Mom has a phone line in the basement right under the TV location and also right near where I'm running the antenna line up through the floor so running a line to the unit would be no problem. It appears they do OTA just fine and with a lifetime sub and using a phone line it should get full EPG support. I'm seeing many places online where they can be had for $150 or even less.

The CM DVR+ is another option. The external storage isn't an issue, I've got lots of old HD's sitting around. However no internet and no ability to "phone it in" means only a couple days of EPG which isn't optimum.

Again, thanks to everyone for their help with this non SageTV question.
I was hoping you'd update this. Unfortunately the Roamio's, Premiere's and Bolts don't work with phone connections.
While the Series 3 / TiVo HD will accept a phone connection, TiVo may have restricted the transfer of ownership of Lifetime units from a seller to a buyers account, especially if you've never had a TiVo account. I'd call TiVo customer support about that. The only thing you could do in that case is just ask the seller to not remove the 3/HD from their account. If you actually knew the person selling, family, friend, that would be easy.
Sorry, I forgot the new, TiVo ownership are trying to eliminate the older Tivo's from the market, and this is how they are going to start that process.
Call TiVo and ask. But I believe the person selling the TiVo has to have a current account for an older unit to be associated with.
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  #8  
Old 10-01-2017, 09:58 AM
waynedunham waynedunham is offline
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Originally Posted by tvmaster2 View Post
I was hoping you'd update this. Unfortunately the Roamio's, Premiere's and Bolts don't work with phone connections.
While the Series 3 / TiVo HD will accept a phone connection, TiVo may have restricted the transfer of ownership of Lifetime units from a seller to a buyers account, especially if you've never had a TiVo account. I'd call TiVo customer support about that. The only thing you could do in that case is just ask the seller to not remove the 3/HD from their account. If you actually knew the person selling, family, friend, that would be easy.
Sorry, I forgot the new, TiVo ownership are trying to eliminate the older Tivo's from the market, and this is how they are going to start that process.
Call TiVo and ask. But I believe the person selling the TiVo has to have a current account for an older unit to be associated with.
Well, that would just bite, wouldn't it? I'll have to do some more investigation I guess since I've never owned a TiVo.

I went with ReplayTV back in the day, and I've still got several of those sitting in the closet, but they won't work with HD and have no way to get guide data without an ethernet connection and going through a 3rd party app on your computer. (at least the last I checked) Moot point anyway since all the ReplayTV predate HDTV and only do SD recordings.
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Old 10-01-2017, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by waynedunham View Post
Well, that would just bite, wouldn't it? I'll have to do some more investigation I guess since I've never owned a TiVo.

I went with ReplayTV back in the day, and I've still got several of those sitting in the closet, but they won't work with HD and have no way to get guide data without an ethernet connection and going through a 3rd party app on your computer. (at least the last I checked) Moot point anyway since all the ReplayTV predate HDTV and only do SD recordings.
Definitely call Tivo customer service and ask. You may still be able to transfer ANY Lifetime unit between owners, but it's best to be sure. If you've never been a customer, then setting up a new account would be necessary for sure. Also, the previous owner MUST contact Tivo and tell them they're transferring the unit to a new owner. At that point, Tivo gives them a case number, which is the same case number you'd use to associate the used, Lifetime Tivo unit to your account. It sounds like a pain, but it really isn't. And Tivo is by far the best device for what you want. I found two, Tivo HD's with Lifetime service today on Craigslist, Orange County Ca., one for $100
https://orangecounty.craigslist.org/...286265751.html
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  #10  
Old 10-01-2017, 11:42 AM
wayner wayner is offline
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The other thing to consider is getting your mom a low end internet connection. You might also be able to justify it because you could use it for other monitoring systems to keep an eye on her.
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  #11  
Old 10-01-2017, 06:23 PM
waynedunham waynedunham is offline
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The other thing to consider is getting your mom a low end internet connection. You might also be able to justify it because you could use it for other monitoring systems to keep an eye on her.
Not really an option. Dial up is the only "low cost, low end" option, which She has, but won't work with any PVR I'm aware of.
Cable or Cell internet connections are too costly (both $40 a month and up) and She lives too far out for any possibility of DSL (yuck anyways).
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Old 10-01-2017, 10:41 PM
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Originally Posted by waynedunham View Post
Not really an option. Dial up is the only "low cost, low end" option, which She has, but won't work with any PVR I'm aware of.
Cable or Cell internet connections are too costly (both $40 a month and up) and She lives too far out for any possibility of DSL (yuck anyways).
over at tivocommunity.com people are reporting that any Lifetime unit can be transferred to a new owner, as long as the seller transfers the machine properly.
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  #13  
Old 10-02-2017, 02:42 PM
wayner wayner is offline
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Will your Mom solely be using this PVR? I also have an 83 yo mother and have had to remotely troubleshoot lots of issues. One of the big problems can be when you have multiple sources that require changing the TV's input. You wouldn't believe the number of times that I was called about that. Or the audio being hosed because somebody pushed the SAP button.

So hopefully this will be the sole source that you have to minimize issues. But even then pushing one of the numbers on the remote control can send the TV into ATSC tuner mode from HDMI-1, or whatever.
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Old 10-02-2017, 07:04 PM
waynedunham waynedunham is offline
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Originally Posted by tvmaster2 View Post
over at tivocommunity.com people are reporting that any Lifetime unit can be transferred to a new owner, as long as the seller transfers the machine properly.
That is a hopeful development. Now to just find out for sure what the "proper" transfer entails.

No matter what route I go it will probably have to wait until next month at least. Maybe a nice Xmas present for Her.
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Old 10-02-2017, 07:12 PM
waynedunham waynedunham is offline
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Will your Mom solely be using this PVR? I also have an 83 yo mother and have had to remotely troubleshoot lots of issues. One of the big problems can be when you have multiple sources that require changing the TV's input. You wouldn't believe the number of times that I was called about that. Or the audio being hosed because somebody pushed the SAP button.

So hopefully this will be the sole source that you have to minimize issues. But even then pushing one of the numbers on the remote control can send the TV into ATSC tuner mode from HDMI-1, or whatever.
I'm all too familiar with "remote support" for my Mom. Every time she loses power her thru the wall AC unit in the living room reverts to "fan only". If is hasn't happened in a while I'll get the call "The air conditioner isn't putting out cool air." and I'll have to lead her through the steps to get the AC back on with the proper cooling and fan settings.

Then there's the danged "universal" TV remotes all TVs come with now. Either her or the cat will inadvertently press the button to control another device so "The remote control doesn't work."

She got a new TV in the living room and when they (my Brother/Sister, I wasn't up there) hooked it up they didn't have an HDMI cable so hooked the DVD player up with the RCA cables. Not a huge issue except in order to get it to work they "added" an extra DVD input selection (the default was for HDMI) and even with her "cheat sheet" to play DVDs She had trouble getting the right input selected. I fixed that this spring when I went up. I hooked it up via HDMI and removed the "other" DVD input selection.
Of course that still doesn't help the "OK, put down the TV remote, you have to use the DVD remote to work the DVD."

Good thing I love her.
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Old 10-03-2017, 08:29 AM
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Originally Posted by waynedunham View Post
I'm all too familiar with "remote support" for my Mom. Every time she loses power her thru the wall AC unit in the living room reverts to "fan only". If is hasn't happened in a while I'll get the call "The air conditioner isn't putting out cool air." and I'll have to lead her through the steps to get the AC back on with the proper cooling and fan settings.

Then there's the danged "universal" TV remotes all TVs come with now. Either her or the cat will inadvertently press the button to control another device so "The remote control doesn't work."

She got a new TV in the living room and when they (my Brother/Sister, I wasn't up there) hooked it up they didn't have an HDMI cable so hooked the DVD player up with the RCA cables. Not a huge issue except in order to get it to work they "added" an extra DVD input selection (the default was for HDMI) and even with her "cheat sheet" to play DVDs She had trouble getting the right input selected. I fixed that this spring when I went up. I hooked it up via HDMI and removed the "other" DVD input selection.
Of course that still doesn't help the "OK, put down the TV remote, you have to use the DVD remote to work the DVD."

Good thing I love her.
Maybe it high time for talk them in to moving closer to you LoL.
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Old 10-03-2017, 09:06 AM
wayner wayner is offline
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Originally Posted by waynedunham View Post
Of course that still doesn't help the "OK, put down the TV remote, you have to use the DVD remote to work the DVD."

Good thing I love her.
Many of us have been there as well!
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Old 10-03-2017, 12:55 PM
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Have you looked into satellite TV? If you are an AT&T customer, you could add DirecTV pretty cheap.
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Old 10-03-2017, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by waynedunham View Post
Not really an option. Dial up is the only "low cost, low end" option, which She has, but won't work with any PVR I'm aware of.
Cable or Cell internet connections are too costly (both $40 a month and up) and She lives too far out for any possibility of DSL (yuck anyways).
You may want to inquire about "lifeline" Internet service. I set that up for a neighbor of mine; she was in her 80's and didn't need anything more than reliable Internet connectivity for email and very very light surfing. I think Comcast was basically giving it to her for almost free; it was only $12 a month, and it was capped at 512Kbps/128Kbps, but that was "good enough".
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Old 10-03-2017, 06:24 PM
waynedunham waynedunham is offline
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Originally Posted by rkulagow View Post
You may want to inquire about "lifeline" Internet service. I set that up for a neighbor of mine; she was in her 80's and didn't need anything more than reliable Internet connectivity for email and very very light surfing. I think Comcast was basically giving it to her for almost free; it was only $12 a month, and it was capped at 512Kbps/128Kbps, but that was "good enough".
Sadly the only internet services available to her area in Miane (read:Boonies) "don't have that" every time I've called. Heck, they didn't even offer a bare minimum TV service for low $$ a month when I looked into that. Luckily putting an HDTV antenna up on the roof now gives her reliable signal to all the local stations.
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