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  #1  
Old 08-21-2004, 11:42 AM
Gemini1706 Gemini1706 is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 27
Probably a widely discussed problem:STUTTERING, LiveTV stuttering:causes and remedies

I am now experimenting with GB-PVR so I can see if my machine can handle LiveTV ...etc., if I did not like GB-PVR I will install SageTV next week after getting some confidence in my machine (Sage TV Trial Period is not enough, too short, most of us experiment during weekends, so very short time.. )

Ok, to the topic:

I have a Pentium III 1GHz Machine with 256MB of ram (PC100), PVR-250MCE, Windows XP Pro with SP1, DirectX9.0c.
I am planning to use Radeon 9500 Pro for TV-Out, but for now I am using old TNT2 video card to view on monitor.
I also use a 30GByte Harddisk, 100ATA 7200rpm.

I installed GB-PVR successfully, and was experimenting on my monitor (before hooking stuff to mt TV using DVI with Radeon 9500 Pro).

During LiveTV, Windows Task Manager shows: ~ 70% to 80% CPU usage, and about 160MB of PageFile (virtual memory) usage (without GB-PVR it shows 90MB PageFile Usage)

For the LiveTV/playback I used:

1-a regular old TNT2 video card,
2- Installed a free codec pack (K-lite codec pack 2.27 Full from http://kppfree.altervista.org ) which uses elecard as the mpeg decoder.
3- I am using Overlay Manager (not VMR9) since my TNT2 video card cannot do VMR (obviously)


Now, the LiveTV option works fine except of those problems:

1- During fast moving scenes, the video blurs/slows down, which appear as a decoding issue.
Will changing my decoder to say Sonic Decoder or something similar will solve my problems?
Will increasing RAM help this? or it is just a decoder problem?

2- Even during slow/still scenes, or fast scenes, I see a little bit of stuttering (kinda like dropped frame??) with some scense every few seconds not running 100% smooth (jerky/jumpy). It is not very severe, but it is still noticable.
Is this Stuttering due to:
Low RAM? Do I need more RAM?
Slow Macine? I do not think so, since CPU usage never went above 80%
Bad Decoder? Will buying the Sonic codec help this? Unlikely since it is more like a system slowdown due to paging file or RAM or harddisk, (unlikely CPU)..
Video Card? Do you think installing the Radeon 9500 Pro will help resolve this? I do not see any link between the video card and the stuutering.. Is there?


Please help..
I really do not want to upgrade mu machine to a faster one, since it appears that CPU is not fully overloaded so a faster machine will not help..

Basically, what worked for you/other people?:

1- Better codec? Is this has anything to do with Sttutering?
2- More RAM?
3- Faster machine? (God, please NO NO)
4- Radeon 9500 Pro can help reduce stuttering? Unlikely



Sorry for the long post.. ???

Thanks in advance...
Cheers...

Last edited by Gemini1706; 08-21-2004 at 11:45 AM.
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  #2  
Old 08-21-2004, 04:37 PM
kny3twalker kny3twalker is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,074
Quote:
Installed a free codec pack (K-lite codec pack 2.27 Full from http://kppfree.altervista.org ) which uses elecard as the mpeg decoder.
thats like one of the worse things to do to a computer

those things cause such problems
and I am not sure if there is an easy way to get everything off the computer even after you uninstall it


first I would stick in the 9500 PRO

that should reduce the CPU usage alot

I have seen that happen more than once

furthermore I would get a good DVD decoder

elecard does not support DXVA
which is hardware assisted deinterlacing

without this or ffdshow
the image is often quite blurry

I would look into sonic DVD decoder pack for 15 dollars

if you need the full 5.1 audio for DVDs
you can buy sonic surround cineplayer

or use the free AC3 filter

and BTW you never going to get smooth playback with VMR on that computer

maybe if you did not Antivirus or planned to not to use the computer for anything else other than SageTV

your RAM might be ok

but since I am guessing you are using XP
I would get the another 256 stick

so put the video card in, buy sonic or some other high quality DVD decoder pack/program, and look into the RAM (I would get it personally)


you can also look into an X card...........
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  #3  
Old 08-21-2004, 04:54 PM
Gemini1706 Gemini1706 is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 27
Thanks a lot kny3twalker for reply..

Ok.. I tried putting the 9500 Pro, but looks like it has some problems (I remeber it did this problem a while back in this same computer):

Every now and then, Windows freezes for a few seconds (No programs are running, maybe only brwosing the web) and then the video card driver(ATI ver 4.8 and also tried 4.7) issues this weird message:
The Video Card cannot (?? I forgot the exact words, but the meaning is roughly the same) send the hardware accelration command ... blah blah blah..
[Do you want to send the error report to ATI: Yes, No]

Now this happens randomly every many minutes or hours.. even while browsing ...etc.

Could this be a compatibility issue between my Video Card 9500 Pro and my old PIII motherboard (it is a Sis 635 based motherboard)?

If I turned down hardware accelleration in the ATI driver, will this affect SaeTV and decoding power? I have the option to step down hardware acceleration in maybe 6 steps (cursor and mouse accelleration, then 3D blah blah ...etc.)..

NOTE: The Video Card 9500 Pro is running FINE in my other AMD XP1600+ machine and I use it for gaming alot.. it is working 100% fine with the same drivers ...etc.

What is this weird error? Conflict with motherboard?
Hardware accelleration down can slow SageTV?

Thanks for help in advance..

Cheer....
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  #4  
Old 08-21-2004, 05:37 PM
kny3twalker kny3twalker is offline
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Posts: 3,074
try using driver cleaner (and the optional cab cleaner) and boot into Safe mode and clean that old stuff out
then install the newest driver for the 9500 PRO once booted back into regular windows


I never heard of a motherboard not liking a video card

whats the AGP slot on the motherboard?

1x,2x, ??????
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  #5  
Old 08-21-2004, 05:40 PM
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stanger89 stanger89 is offline
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Location: Marion, IA
Posts: 15,188
I would not doubt that your motherboard is causing problems, SIS boards, especially from that era (along with VIA and ALi, just about anything but Intel) were crap, really poor PCI implimentations that cause problems all over the place.

And dito on the codec pack thing, NEVER, EVER, install a "codec pack" on your machine, that is the worst possible thing you can install, it generally includes all kinds of quesitonable stuff, hacked/cracked/pirated decoders (Elecard, if you didn't pay for it, it's pirated), etc.

The #1 most important rule to follow for a stable system is to install only the programs, drivers, codecs you absolutely need.
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  #6  
Old 08-24-2004, 12:24 PM
michael_tx michael_tx is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 1
hi, i was having similar problems. i was getting a split-second stutter every 10-15 minutes during live tv. however, my recorded shows did not display this behavior. i tried just about every tip here from buying more ram to trying overlay and VMR to formatting my drive. i finally broke down and got the Sonic decoders and they seem to have fixed my problem! so far i have not seen any stuttering at all. previously i was using the Intervideo ones that come with WinDVD 6 (with the hardware decode enabled in the registry).

system specs:

amd athlon64 2800+
1gb ram (yeah, went from 512mb to 1gb...didn't help. doh!)
pvr-250mce
geforce4mx
windows xp sp2

on a side note, i think the Sonic decoders have much better color by default comapred to the Intervideo ones. i would have to adjust the overlay settings with the Intervideo ones to get it how i liked it, and then for some reason the overlay settings would reset all the time. it was very frustrating! i don't have to adjust the Sonic ones at all and am very happy with the output. YMMV of course.

Last edited by michael_tx; 08-24-2004 at 12:29 PM.
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  #7  
Old 08-24-2004, 12:32 PM
falchulk falchulk is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,150
Quote:
Originally posted by michael_tx
hi, i was having similar problems. i was getting a split-second stutter every 10-15 minutes during live tv. however, my recorded shows did not display this behavior. i tried just about every tip here from buying more ram to trying overlay and VMR to formatting my drive. i finally broke down and got the Sonic decoders and they seem to have fixed my problem! so far i have not seen any stuttering at all. previously i was using the Intervideo ones that come with WinDVD 6 (with the hardware decode enabled in the registry).

system specs:

amd athlon64 2800+
1gb ram (yeah, went from 512mb to 1gb...didn't help. doh!)
pvr-250mce
geforce4mx
windows xp sp2

on a side note, i think the Sonic decoders have much better color by default comapred to the Intervideo ones. i would have to adjust the overlay settings with the Intervideo ones to get it how i liked it, and then for some reason the overlay settings would reset all the time. it was very frustrating! i don't have to adjust the Sonic ones at all and am very happy with the output. YMMV of course.
Funny, I have an almost identical system to you and the sonic decoders studder while Nvdvd and Intervideo (both use hardware acceleration) are rock solid.
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