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Hardware Support Discussions related to using various hardware setups with SageTV products. Anything relating to capture cards, remotes, infrared receivers/transmitters, system compatibility or other hardware related problems or suggestions should be posted here.

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  #1  
Old 02-11-2018, 06:30 PM
waynedunham waynedunham is offline
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Xfinity X1 STBs

Does anyone know, or have any experience with the Xfinity X1 boxes and the old Hauppauge HD-PVR? It looks like at least some on the NON-DVR models have a firewire port, not sure if it is active or not. Some NON-DVR models do not have firewire ports it seems.
I have not checked into the availability of firewire vs. non-firewire boxes.

The reason I ask is that every time I talk to Comcast/Xfinity they try to cram X1 down my throat and also say that the time is fast approaching when I won't have an option and will be forced to switch to X1.

I have several HDHR-Primes, but I still have a few channels in one of the packages I have that won't work on the Primes and are only tuenable on the cable co's STBs which is why I still have a couple HD-PVR/STBs in my system.

Whether or not the X1 boxes will work with the HD-PVRs will also help me decide that if/when they do force me to go X1 on where I might go as another option. Probably not much choice since I need about 8 tuners to feed my TV "habit".
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Last edited by waynedunham; 02-11-2018 at 06:33 PM.
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  #2  
Old 02-11-2018, 08:29 PM
wayner wayner is offline
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I would ask them to send you the detailed manual that shows all of the connections. Or go to one of their shops and ask to see a box. You want a box with Component video and 1394/FireWire. I would hope that you can get one with component but it may be harder to get one with FireWire.
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  #3  
Old 02-12-2018, 08:16 AM
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Tiki Tiki is offline
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This link has pretty good info about the various X1 compatible boxes that Comcast currently offers:
https://www.xfinity.com/support/arti...-companion-box

They make no mention of firewire.

I have an X1 RNG150N that I use with Sage (I use it with a Colossus connected via HDMI with a splitter to strip the HDCP). It does have a firewire port on it, but I have no idea if it works (I use 64-bit Windows and don't own any firewire cables, so have no way to test it).

If you install any X1 devices in your home, then Comcast requires ALL of your equipment to be X1-compatible. You cannot mix and match X1 with Legacy equipment (such as the older DCT cable boxes).

If you want to use a cable box with Sage (and an HDPVR, Colossus, or similar sort of device), you will want one of these X1 RNG150N boxes.
Comcast makes both Legacy and X1 versions of their RNG150 cable boxes. They look about the same from the outside, but they run different software.

Here is my summary:

X1-DVR (XG1 or XG2): This is a multi-tuner device (up to 6 tuners). Not a good choice for controlling with Sage, since Sage would only be able to make use of one of the tuners.

X1-Extender (Xi3, Xi5, XiD): This device doesn't have any tuners of its own - it is a slave to an X1-DVR. When you watch live TV on one of these it is using one of the tuners from the X1-DVR. Could probably work for Sage, but not a great choice since it doesn't have any tuners of its own.

DTA: Comcast offers SD and HD Digital Tuning Adaptors. These have their own tuners and can be used with Sage, but they can't record premium channels. If you aren't going to record premiums, you are better-off using a cable card with a cable card tuner like HDHR PRime.

X1-RNG150N: This is more or less like a traditional set top box. Best choice for Sage with a tuner like Colossus or HDPVR. It has connections for HDMI, component, composite, Firewire, USB, Ethernet, optical. Note: it will run special X1 software, so menus and navigation are a bit different from older set top boxes. You will need to setup your IR blaster tuning a little bit differently.

**Comcast has standardized their model names, but has multiple vendors making each one (so Samsung, Pace, Arris, or Motorola could make almost any of the above). Comcast defines a core set of features for each model, but there will be slight differences between each vendor (for example, it's possible that not all RNG150N's will have a firewire port).
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Capture Devices (8 tuners): Colossus (x1), HD-PVR (x1), HDHR Prime (x2)
,USBUIRT (multi-zone)
Source:
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Primary Client: Server Other Clients: (1) HD200, (1) HD300
Retired Equipment: MediaMVP, PVR150 (x2), PVR150MCE,
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  #4  
Old 02-14-2018, 09:29 AM
mgpaulus mgpaulus is offline
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I have an X1 setup, and I'm using 2 of the X1-RNG150N boxes mentioned above. 1 of them I have connected to an HD-PVR via component cables, and I change channels using a USB-UIRT. The other one is connected to a BMI-3000 via HDMI and also tunes with the 2nd channel of the USB-UIRT. I use these 2 recorders for premium/copy protected channels. The rest of my channels are tuned via (2) HDHR-CC3.

The 2 STB boxes work pretty good. However, I have had 2-3 recordings lately that have been screwed up in the middle while Comcast has been doing a firmware upgrade or some other kind of maintenance. That's kind of annoying, and I'm not at all sure how to get around that.

I used to be on Comcast legacy with RNG-150N boxes with Firewire, and I used the FW to do Channel Changes and HD-PVRs for video capture. But like was mentioned above, once you go to X1 on the main DVR, you have to convert the entire shooting match to X1.
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  #5  
Old 02-14-2018, 09:42 AM
wayner wayner is offline
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My cable company here in Canada, Rogers Cable, is in beta testing of the Comcast X1 system and they will be rolling it out in the near future so this is very useful information. Hopefully they offer the RNG150N boxes with component as well. The one area where I will likely be screwed is channel changing as I currently use FireWire.

Since you are one of the few people with both HD-PVR and BM-3000 what is your view on the pros/cons of those two options?
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Old Server - Sage7 on Win7Pro-i660CPU with 4.6TB, HD-PVR, HDHR OTA, HVR-1850 OTA
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  #6  
Old 02-14-2018, 03:03 PM
mgpaulus mgpaulus is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wayner View Post
My cable company here in Canada, Rogers Cable, is in beta testing of the Comcast X1 system and they will be rolling it out in the near future so this is very useful information. Hopefully they offer the RNG150N boxes with component as well. The one area where I will likely be screwed is channel changing as I currently use FireWire.

Since you are one of the few people with both HD-PVR and BM-3000 what is your view on the pros/cons of those two options?
I haven't really noticed a quality issue. Both units produce good recordings. I don't have any kind of recordings where I can/do say, "Oh, that one is from my xxxxx device." All of my recordings are at 1080i or 720, and I don't really notice a difference. I don't use any of the advanced audio features, that I am aware of, so how audio is captured/encoded isn't as big of a concern to me.

I kind of like the BM-3000 option a bit better than the HD-PVR personally. I have a network cable and an HDMI cable, and the box is smaller. Also haven't had any wal-wart problems yet. The HD-PVR has the big 5 cable bundle (RGB/RW), and it takes a USB port on your sage box. And, I've replaced the wal-wart on my HD-PVR a couple of times. You can read all about those troubles here in the forum.

The USB-UIRT thing is kind of finicky. I use direct connect DTA cables instead of IR transmitters/receivers, so I don't have to worry about interference or cross-device channel changing. https://www.ebay.com/itm/TiVo-to-DTA...QAAOSw7aBVJGPl
Even with the cable, it still took some fine tuning to make sure I had reliable channel changes, and no mis-tunes.

I apologize, it's kind of rambley. I treat both of them as a "set and forget", until something doesn't work then it's try to fix it. And so far, both of them have been pretty reliable and consistent. And most of the up-front work is more on the usb-uirt side than on the actual capture device.

Last edited by mgpaulus; 02-14-2018 at 03:22 PM.
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  #7  
Old 02-14-2018, 03:37 PM
wayner wayner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgpaulus View Post
I kind of like the BM-3000 option a bit better than the HD-PVR personally. I have a network cable and an HDMI cable, and the box is smaller. Also haven't had any wal-wart problems yet. The HD-PVR has the big 5 cable bundle (RGB/RW), and it takes a USB port on your sage box. And, I've replaced the wal-wart on my HD-PVR a couple of times. You can read all about those troubles here in the forum.
I have been running my SageTV systems with two HD-PVRs, plus a backup from time-to-time, for about 9 years. So I have been through about ten wall-warts in that time.

The wall warts for the HDHR also suffer from similar problems.
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  #8  
Old 05-28-2019, 10:56 AM
KAZUNA KAZUNA is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiki View Post
I have an X1 RNG150N that I use with Sage (I use it with a Colossus connected via HDMI with a splitter to strip the HDCP). It does have a firewire port on it, but I have no idea if it works (I use 64-bit Windows and don't own any firewire cables, so have no way to test it).

X1-RNG150N: This is more or less like a traditional set top box. Best choice for Sage with a tuner like Colossus or HDPVR. It has connections for HDMI, component, composite, Firewire, USB, Ethernet, optical. Note: it will run special X1 software, so menus and navigation are a bit different from older set top boxes. You will need to setup your IR blaster tuning a little bit differently.
How did you make Colossus' IR blaster to work with RNG150N?
Colossus' IR blaster doesn't seem learning RNG150N code.
Did you need a special HCWBlast.ini for RNG150N?

How did you setup your IR blaster tuning a little bit differently?
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  #9  
Old 05-29-2019, 07:23 AM
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Tiki Tiki is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KAZUNA View Post
How did you make Colossus' IR blaster to work with RNG150N?
Colossus' IR blaster doesn't seem learning RNG150N code.
Did you need a special HCWBlast.ini for RNG150N?

How did you setup your IR blaster tuning a little bit differently?
First - Comcast has stuck with pretty much the same remote codes over the years, regardless of STB (this way you can use almost any remote with almost any STB). So, your IR file shouldn't really need to change.

However, I have seen sensitivity to timing change with different boxes. So you may need to change the repeat count or the delay between digits (otherwise you may see some digits register twice, or not at all).

Next, the X1 interface and navigation is completely different from the older Comcast STB's. On the old box, if you typed "25" on your remote and waited a few seconds, it would tune to channel 25. Or, if you typed "252" it would immediately change to channel 252 (since it knew there were no channels with more than 3 digits).

On the new X1 boxes, there is no timeout or maximum number of digits, so you have to press the "OK" button after typing the channel number. The X1 boxes have an integrated numeric text search function and allow you to change to channels by call-sign in addition to channel number. When you press the "2" key on the remote it knows this could be the number 2 or the letter A, B, or C. So, it immediately pops up a list of all the channels with A,B, or C in their name. You can then use the arrow keys to navigate the list. Fortunately, the first item in the list will be the channel number you typed, and pressing the OK key selects it.

This means you have to make sure you have the OK command in your IR file. Also, in the Sage setup there is an option for a Channel Change Confirm Code - this needs to be set to OK.

One other item to be aware of - the new X1 boxes have a feature that allows you to pair a remote with a specific STB. I think that once you do this, the remote stops using IR and instead uses RF to communicate with the box (this way the remote no longer requires line of site). For the STB that I use with Sage, I made sure that I did not go through this remote pairing process. I don't know if it would have caused a problem, but wanted to be sure that the box would not stop responding to normal IR signals.

Anyway, I currently have my Sage setup as follows:

Digits per channel: 4
Channel Change Prefix Code: None
Channel Change Confirm Code: OK
Delay Between Codes: 200 msec
Delay Between Channel Changes: 600 msec
IR Blaster Repeat Factor: 3
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Server: Athlon II X4 630 CPU, Gigabyte MA770T-UD3P (AM3) Motherboard, VisionTek Radeon HD4670 PCIe w/ Component output to 50" CRT Rear-Projection HDTV (Mitsubishi), Win7-64Bit (Home Premium), 4GB RAM
Capture Devices (8 tuners): Colossus (x1), HD-PVR (x1), HDHR Prime (x2)
,USBUIRT (multi-zone)
Source:
Comcast Cable
Primary Client: Server Other Clients: (1) HD200, (1) HD300
Retired Equipment: MediaMVP, PVR150 (x2), PVR150MCE,
HDHR, HVR-2250
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  #10  
Old 05-29-2019, 01:36 PM
KAZUNA KAZUNA is offline
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So you are not using Colossus IR Blaster but using USB-UIRT, so that SageTV sends IR signal via USB-UIRT and Colossus works just as a capture device?

I'm currently using Windows 7 MCE and Colossus' internal IR blaster to record Comcast Digital programs. I just started looking at alternatives before Microsoft stops supporting Windows 7.

I have Comcast RNG110(non-X1) and Colossus IR Blaster has been working perfectly until recently I got Xfinity XG1(X1-DVR) and XG2(X1). It turned out X1 uses different IR code than non-X1. I tried Colossus IR Blaster to learn X1 IR code but it didn't work. Then I found your posts about using Colossus and RNG150N(X1).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiki View Post
First - Comcast has stuck with pretty much the same remote codes over the years, regardless of STB (this way you can use almost any remote with almost any STB). So, your IR file shouldn't really need to change.
That means unlike other X1 TV boxes, RNG150N(X1) uses the same IR code as the old TV boxes like your old RNG150N(non-X1)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiki View Post
IR Blaster Repeat Factor: 3
What does it do? I found other settings in Colossus IR Blaster setting but not this repeat factor.
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  #11  
Old 05-30-2019, 11:01 AM
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Tiki Tiki is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KAZUNA View Post
So you are not using Colossus IR Blaster but using USB-UIRT, so that SageTV sends IR signal via USB-UIRT and Colossus works just as a capture device?

I'm currently using Windows 7 MCE and Colossus' internal IR blaster to record Comcast Digital programs. I just started looking at alternatives before Microsoft stops supporting Windows 7.

I have Comcast RNG110(non-X1) and Colossus IR Blaster has been working perfectly until recently I got Xfinity XG1(X1-DVR) and XG2(X1). It turned out X1 uses different IR code than non-X1. I tried Colossus IR Blaster to learn X1 IR code but it didn't work. Then I found your posts about using Colossus and RNG150N(X1).

That means unlike other X1 TV boxes, RNG150N(X1) uses the same IR code as the old TV boxes like your old RNG150N(non-X1)?

What does it do? I found other settings in Colossus IR Blaster setting but not this repeat factor.
Yes I use the usbuirt. I used the built in Hauppauge blasters many years ago, but moved away from them because they donít work well if you have more than one Hauppauge device attached to your system.

The repeat factor is how many times it sends the code. It basically mimics you holding down the button on your remote.
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Capture Devices (8 tuners): Colossus (x1), HD-PVR (x1), HDHR Prime (x2)
,USBUIRT (multi-zone)
Source:
Comcast Cable
Primary Client: Server Other Clients: (1) HD200, (1) HD300
Retired Equipment: MediaMVP, PVR150 (x2), PVR150MCE,
HDHR, HVR-2250
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  #12  
Old 05-30-2019, 03:12 PM
KAZUNA KAZUNA is offline
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Originally Posted by Tiki View Post
Yes I use the usbuirt. I used the built in Hauppauge blasters many years ago, but moved away from them because they don’t work well if you have more than one Hauppauge device attached to your system.

The repeat factor is how many times it sends the code. It basically mimics you holding down the button on your remote.
How did you get the IR code for RNG150N(X1)?
I think it is XMP IR code and it's difficult to learn.
Do you happen to know if the same IR code works for RNG150N(X1) and other X1 box (XG1/XG2)?

Last edited by KAZUNA; 06-03-2019 at 04:04 AM.
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Old 06-04-2019, 02:59 PM
KAZUNA KAZUNA is offline
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Originally Posted by Tiki View Post
Comcast makes both Legacy and X1 versions of their RNG150 cable boxes. They look about the same from the outside, but they run different software.
I picked up a RNG150N (Pace PR150BNM) at the local Comcast store and the rep confirmed that it is a X1 compatible box. However, when I install it, the initialization or activation took such a long time (an hour or so) and then it eventually came up with iGuide interface (non-X1). Does RNG150N require something special to make it run in X1 interface? I don't have any X1 box other than this RNG150N, if that makes difference.
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Old 06-05-2019, 04:02 PM
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Tiki Tiki is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KAZUNA View Post
I picked up a RNG150N (Pace PR150BNM) at the local Comcast store and the rep confirmed that it is a X1 compatible box. However, when I install it, the initialization or activation took such a long time (an hour or so) and then it eventually came up with iGuide interface (non-X1). Does RNG150N require something special to make it run in X1 interface? I don't have any X1 box other than this RNG150N, if that makes difference.
Itís possible - I donít know for sure. I also have an X1 multi-room DVR and other equipment in my house, so maybe that makes a difference.
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Server: Athlon II X4 630 CPU, Gigabyte MA770T-UD3P (AM3) Motherboard, VisionTek Radeon HD4670 PCIe w/ Component output to 50" CRT Rear-Projection HDTV (Mitsubishi), Win7-64Bit (Home Premium), 4GB RAM
Capture Devices (8 tuners): Colossus (x1), HD-PVR (x1), HDHR Prime (x2)
,USBUIRT (multi-zone)
Source:
Comcast Cable
Primary Client: Server Other Clients: (1) HD200, (1) HD300
Retired Equipment: MediaMVP, PVR150 (x2), PVR150MCE,
HDHR, HVR-2250
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