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  #1  
Old 08-25-2018, 05:38 PM
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tvmaster2 tvmaster2 is offline
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multiple lineups - dual channel maps - conflicting channels - help!

I have two tuners in my SageTV Server, each with an independent, Schedules Direct lineup.

Problem: two versions of CNNHD (just one of many channels like this), only one of which will appear in my guide listings, because:

Logical Channel numbers are different since the sources are different (cable set top box and satellite)
Station ID's at Schedules Direct are the same
Description at Schedules Direct = the same (CNNHD for example)

How can you edit the channel map to rename one of them? Whenever I try, as soon as Sage sees the similar Station ID, it changes the name for BOTH channels, and will only allow ONE in the guide listings.

Was this an oversight by the original designers, which will now never be able to work? The reason I'd like both active is there's always a time when something starts recording on one tuner, and you'd like to use the other tuner to access one of the duplicate channels.

Does this make sense?
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Last edited by tvmaster2; 08-25-2018 at 06:05 PM.
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  #2  
Old 08-25-2018, 06:44 PM
JustFred JustFred is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvmaster2 View Post
How can you edit the channel map to rename one of them? Whenever I try, as soon as Sage sees the similar Station ID, it changes the name for BOTH channels, and will only allow ONE in the guide listings. Was this an oversight by the original designers
Not an oversight. It's intentional.

Quote:
and you'd like to use the other tuner to access one of the duplicate channels.
That's what Sage already does, without having to jump thru hoops. Give it a try.
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System #1: Win7-64, Core2-Quad Q9400, 8 GB Mem, 4TB HD. Java-64 1.8.0_141. Sage-64 v9.2.1 ATSC: 2x HDHR-US (1st gen white) tuners. HD-200.
System #2: Win7-64, I7-920, 8 GB Mem, 2TB HD. Java 1.8.0_131. Sage v9.1.6.747. ClearQAM: 2x HDHR3-US tuners. HD-200.
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  #3  
Old 08-25-2018, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustFred View Post
Not an oversight. It's intentional.



That's what Sage already does, without having to jump thru hoops. Give it a try.
Sage can’t select a tuner channel that isn’t in the lineup, I’ve tried. And if the channels have the same ID and name, only one can exist.
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  #4  
Old 08-25-2018, 08:05 PM
JustFred JustFred is offline
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Originally Posted by tvmaster2 View Post
Sage canít select a tuner channel that isnít in the lineup, Iíve tried. And if the channels have the same ID and name, only one can exist.

I must have mis-understand your configuration and use-case. I understood that CNNHD really does exist in both SD lineups, so I'm unclear about the statement that the channel isn't in the lineup. Is it possible that maybe CNNHD has simply been **disabled** for a particular tuner?

I was referring to the following situation, which works well:
1 ATSC (OTA) tuner and 1 STB using the HD-PVR for capture.
2 SD lineups; 1 for OTA and a 2nd for cable (the STB/HD-PVR).
Several channels exist in both lineups, and could be tuned by either device.

Example: ABC-HD appears in both lineups. It's available via OTA (channel 7-1) or cable (ch. 617). It's also **enabled** for both tuners. Regardless of the channel numbers (which I never care about), ABC-HD can be selected from the Guide and tuned. Sage will pick whichever tuner is available (subject to it's Merit, of course).

Given that there's a program currently being recorded using the OTA tuner, if I then also attempt to watch ABC-HD, Sage automatically tunes ABC-HD via whatever unused tuner has ABC-HD in it's lineup (the STB in this example).
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System #1: Win7-64, Core2-Quad Q9400, 8 GB Mem, 4TB HD. Java-64 1.8.0_141. Sage-64 v9.2.1 ATSC: 2x HDHR-US (1st gen white) tuners. HD-200.
System #2: Win7-64, I7-920, 8 GB Mem, 2TB HD. Java 1.8.0_131. Sage v9.1.6.747. ClearQAM: 2x HDHR3-US tuners. HD-200.
System #3: Win7-64, I7-920, 12 GB Mem, 4TB HD. Java-64 1.8.0_141. Sage-64 v9.2.1 ATSC: 2x HVR2250; Spectrum Cable via HDPVR & USB-UIRT. 3x HD-200.
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  #5  
Old 08-26-2018, 12:57 AM
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tvmaster2 tvmaster2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustFred View Post
I must have mis-understand your configuration and use-case. I understood that CNNHD really does exist in both SD lineups, so I'm unclear about the statement that the channel isn't in the lineup. Is it possible that maybe CNNHD has simply been **disabled** for a particular tuner?

I was referring to the following situation, which works well:
1 ATSC (OTA) tuner and 1 STB using the HD-PVR for capture.
2 SD lineups; 1 for OTA and a 2nd for cable (the STB/HD-PVR).
Several channels exist in both lineups, and could be tuned by either device.

Example: ABC-HD appears in both lineups. It's available via OTA (channel 7-1) or cable (ch. 617). It's also **enabled** for both tuners. Regardless of the channel numbers (which I never care about), ABC-HD can be selected from the Guide and tuned. Sage will pick whichever tuner is available (subject to it's Merit, of course).

Given that there's a program currently being recorded using the OTA tuner, if I then also attempt to watch ABC-HD, Sage automatically tunes ABC-HD via whatever unused tuner has ABC-HD in it's lineup (the STB in this example).
yeah, I have OTA tuners as well, and they pose no problems. Itís the similar Station IDís / names which mess up Sage. And from what Iíve found, thereís no way to rename one of the two.
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  #6  
Old 08-26-2018, 09:33 PM
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Opus4 Opus4 is offline
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It has been this way for years. The stations are the same. SageTV knows how to tune the channel on each tuner and uses whichever tuner it needs to. It gets listed once in the guide. Page 53 of the last manual I made. it even uses CNN as an example.
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  #7  
Old 08-26-2018, 10:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Opus4 View Post
It has been this way for years. The stations are the same. SageTV knows how to tune the channel on each tuner and uses whichever tuner it needs to. It gets listed once in the guide. Page 53 of the last manual I made. it even uses CNN as an example.
Thanks for the info - I never would have looked there with those search terms. But how is that possible if you can’t manually select the channel with a remote? It’s true that both CNNHD’s are ticked as active channels in my guide lineups, but the newest one cannot be selected with a remote, as it isn't visible in the guide.
So when a show comes up which you want to record, on the tuner already in use, you select CNN on THAT tuners guide, and Sage will magically record from the other tuner, even if they’re different sources? OK, I’ll try it.
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Last edited by tvmaster2; 08-26-2018 at 11:41 PM.
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  #8  
Old 08-27-2018, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Opus4 View Post
It has been this way for years. The stations are the same. SageTV knows how to tune the channel on each tuner and uses whichever tuner it needs to. It gets listed once in the guide. Page 53 of the last manual I made. it even uses CNN as an example.
Thanks - Although the manual really isnít that clear, I figured out how to do this based on page 53. I never would have thought to select a channel from the SAME tuner that was already locked up in a recording, knowing it would trigger the lineup which DOESN'T show the channel in that lineups guide. Wouldnít it make more sense to be able to RENAME one of the channels, so they BOTH show up in the guide?
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Old 08-27-2018, 12:56 PM
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But you arenít selecting a channel from the same tuner...

The idea is that Sage merges the lineups. The user doesnít need to keep track of which tuners are in use or which physical channel number each tuner uses. If you have 3 different CNN channels from multiple different tuners, you donít need to worry that itís channel 52 on one tuner and 358 on another and 736 on another - Sage just picks one to show in the guide (and you ca always remap if you donít like which one it picked). In this case Sage might pick channel 52. It will only show up once in the guide under 52. You only have to remember 52. When you request channel 52, Sage will pick the best available tuner and might actually tune 358 or 736 behind the scenes.

For everyday usage this is really the best way to do things. However, it can make it more difficult to troubleshoot when things arenít working right (it's much harder to force Sage to use a particular tuner).
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  #10  
Old 08-27-2018, 01:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiki View Post
But you arenít selecting a channel from the same tuner...

The idea is that Sage merges the lineups. The user doesnít need to keep track of which tuners are in use or which physical channel number each tuner uses. If you have 3 different CNN channels from multiple different tuners, you donít need to worry that itís channel 52 on one tuner and 358 on another and 736 on another - Sage just picks one to show in the guide (and you ca always remap if you donít like which one it picked). In this case Sage might pick channel 52. It will only show up once in the guide under 52. You only have to remember 52. When you request channel 52, Sage will pick the best available tuner and might actually tune 358 or 736 behind the scenes.

For everyday usage this is really the best way to do things. However, it can make it more difficult to troubleshoot when things arenít working right (it's much harder to force Sage to use a particular tuner).
Yes, I am selecting the channel from the same tuner. If I try and select the channel from the tuner which isnít recording, it canít find it, since it isnít in the guide lineup. Right? I understand what youíre saying, and what Sage is designed to do, but having the option to rename the duplicate channels, to me, would be easier to understand in many ways. CNNShaw. CNNCox., etc.
Just my .02 cents, usually worth nothing. Lol
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