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  #1  
Old 07-17-2010, 11:57 AM
Brent Brent is offline
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Suggestion for Channel Sorting Method - HD over SD

I have a simple suggestion for the Channel Setup page. Currently you can organize your EPG in these ways:
  • Channel Number
  • Channel Name
  • Channel Description
I'd like to have an additional option to favor HD channels first. So you could sort by the channel number, but all HD channels would come first in channel # order and then the SD channels second in channel number order.

Unless there's a way to do this already that I'm not considering beyond removing my SD channels entirely

Last edited by Brent; 07-17-2010 at 12:04 PM.
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  #2  
Old 07-17-2010, 12:13 PM
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Narflex Narflex is offline
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The main problem there is we don't really know which channels are HD from the lineup information (we know if it has an HD-capable tuner that records it...but that doesn't mean the channel is actually HD).
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  #3  
Old 07-17-2010, 12:16 PM
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you still watch SD channels? why?
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  #4  
Old 07-17-2010, 12:16 PM
Brent Brent is offline
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Not sure if any of these ideas would work for detecting which channels are HD, but here's a few thoughts:
1. Any channel with DT or HD in the callsign (most if not all of my HD channels have this)
2. Any channel that has HDTV in the EPG data
3. Manually defined by the user during guide setup (obviously not the best choice from an ease of use perspective)
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  #5  
Old 07-17-2010, 12:18 PM
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Fuzzy Fuzzy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzy View Post
you still watch SD channels? why?
Actually, to go along with this.. if they really are duplicate channels.. then really.. why DO you keep the SD version enabled?
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  #6  
Old 07-17-2010, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzy View Post
you still watch SD channels? why?
Because not every channel is available in HD yet.
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  #7  
Old 07-17-2010, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzy View Post
Actually, to go along with this.. if they really are duplicate channels.. then really.. why DO you keep the SD version enabled?
Because in some viewing areas (e.g. the west coast) the HD feed is east coast time and the SD might be west coast time -- allows for some additional flexibility for both recording and viewing.
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  #8  
Old 07-17-2010, 12:21 PM
Brent Brent is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzy View Post
you still watch SD channels? why?
I figured that question would come up. Definitely a valid question.
Reason #1: You see, MrsGeekTonic has a knack for watching these daytime soap operas and shows like "Bachelor or Bachelorette etc etc". Since the quality of such shows suck so bad anyway she doesn't seem to notice or care if those record in SD either. Bonus: I save on drive space in these situations and free up tuners.

Reason #2: During peak TV season there are 3 TV watchers in my house (not including the papillon dog who watches whatever we watch) and we all have somewhat differing viewing preferences. So the SD tuners act as an overflow of sorts when the HD tuners are all tied up.

Reason #3: Some channels here aren't available in HD yet.
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  #9  
Old 07-17-2010, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darcilicious View Post
Because not every channel is available in HD yet.
yes I know.. but the good ones are.. ;-)

seriously though, this topic was about channel sorting, where the same channel was showing the Sd version first.. my point really is why keep the SD version enabled, if you have an HD version available
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  #10  
Old 07-19-2010, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzy View Post
my point really is why keep the SD version enabled, if you have an HD version available
I have at least four reasons:
  1. If you are using Placeshifter over the internet you will likely get a better result with an SD channel (most of my HD comes from the HD-PVR and it is a lot more work to transcode this) - my upload speed is 800 kbps
  2. If you want to edit a show for some reason it is easier to edit SD shows in MPEG-2 format rather than HD shows in H.264 format.
  3. If you need to burn a DVD it makes sense to use SD since the source file is in pretty much the format used on DVDs
  4. You don't want to bother recording kids' shows in HD as you don't want to use too much disk space
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  #11  
Old 07-19-2010, 01:16 PM
TwistedMelon TwistedMelon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent View Post
I have a simple suggestion for the Channel Setup page.
This is the most important part of the request. The suggestion is for the setup page, not the Guide, not a master list of all channels available on all tuners.

The setup page works on a single tuner at a time.

"DT" or "HD" on a channel identifier does not mean the channel broadcasts HD. It just means the channel broadcasts digitally from my own empirical evidence. Lots of sub-channels around with SD-only broadcasts. And not all HD channels have these two letters as a suffix. When only some of the HD channels get sorted first what good will that be?

Looking at the EPG data - how far ahead do you look? A few hours? Days? weeks? What happens when there's incorrect EPG data? This could work, but it's clumsy/slow and not necessarily 100% either. More so than the alternative I suppose.

Manually defined... I'd love to see some manual abilities for a few things, but just to get a different channel order during setup isn't one of them. I'd much rather have channel priorities so that I can pick which HD channel a show gets recorded from without necessarily blocking it from recording from another if it absolutely must.

As far as display in the Guide, obviously you can renumber your channels any way you like to allow them to come up wherever you want. As long as the channel identifiers don't overlap, the channels should be listed independently.

Anyway, I think channel setup needs a huge overhaul, but this would be low on my personal priority list. I'd like to be able to delete individual channels from a lineup for instance, be able to rename a line-up, tell Sage what line-up to look for programming information from without actually using that line-up (custom line-ups won't download any EPG data unless you get data for the corresponding station ID's from a real Zap2It line-up). Etc.

My active setup: 3x ATSC OTA HD tuners. 2x Analog Cable + QAM (Free SD Digital Cable) combination . Composed of 2x HVR-2250 and 1x HVR-1600 cards. I love being able to double-define each virtual tuner on the HVR-2250.
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Last edited by TwistedMelon; 07-19-2010 at 01:20 PM.
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  #12  
Old 07-19-2010, 01:24 PM
wayner wayner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TwistedMelon View Post
"DT" or "HD" on a channel identifier does not mean the channel broadcasts HD. It just means the channel broadcasts digitally from my own empirical evidence. Lots of sub-channels around with SD-only broadcasts. And not all HD channels have these two letters as a suffix. When only some of the HD channels get sorted first what good will that be?
I think we all realize that not all DT channels are HD but most of them are so it this is an excellent first cut. I am guessing that Brent is trying to solve the problem that Mrs. Geektonic (or in my case Mrs. Wayner) watches shows in SD even though they are availble in HD. It is likely because they are used to the SD channel placement and/or the SD channels are sorted first.

Another good fix would be able to change where the guide defaults to when you first go into it. On my system it always starts at channel 2-2. But I would prefer to start it at channel 501 as my HD channels are from 501-590 or so. Perhaps you can already do that?
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  #13  
Old 07-19-2010, 01:36 PM
TwistedMelon TwistedMelon is offline
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Quote:
I am guessing that Brent is trying to solve the problem that Mrs. Geektonic (or in my case Mrs. Wayner) watches shows in SD even though they are availble in HD. It is likely because they are used to the SD channel placement and/or the SD channels are sorted first.
Did the latest versions of 7's UI add a channel setup page that's specific to the guide rather that setting up a specific tuner? If so perhaps we're confusing two different things here. Channel setup inside tuner setup doesn't affect channel ordering inside the Guide or the ability to tune to a particular channel first other than by remapping numbers or conflicting station IDs.

The guide itself, if set to numerical order, sorts by number and doesn't group SD first. So, why not put all your HD channels first by making them lower numbers? This can be a lot of remapping if you have a lot of channels or if you have a lot of channels using insane numbers like on Rogers or the worst TV service on the planet, Starchoice.

If you truly want a custom guide view, I can see the sense in that. I'm offering a possible solution for right now. A manual guide ordering would be useful, certainly more so that manual ability to order the numbers during tuner setup. It would look weird, but then again, I don't really look at channel numbers anyway. The benefit here is that you can also group by category.

WAF here is generally pretty high since HD episodes are marked as such and HD channels currently all have dashes in them.

Quote:
Another good fix would be able to change where the guide defaults to when you first go into it. On my system it always starts at channel 2-2. But I would prefer to start it at channel 501 as my HD channels are from 501-590 or so. Perhaps you can already do that?
I don't know how to do that the first time. Sensible request. It's a configuration oddity of course because I've never seen such an option anywhere else, but it would certainly be workable. As long as it doesn't get in the way. Temporary solution, type 5-0-1 on your remote.
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