Digital OTA Broadcast Sub-Channels

[jkoutrouba]

Originally Posted by Humanzee

Yes - Yes - Yes
the channel-channel-subchannel (41-41-1 etc) worked for me. I guess I need to buy this tuner now. Just a little stuttering on some channels, I might need to put the antenna somewhere other than on the shelf behind the tv.

I just want to be sure I understand this correctly -- you were not using any special dlls to get this working? You just went in and added a custom channel to the EPG lineup?

[jkoutrouba]

Originally Posted by jkoutrouba

I just want to be sure I understand this correctly -- you were not using any special dlls to get this working? You just went in and added a custom channel to the EPG lineup?

Just tried it. Worked for me, too. I was having trouble with PBS, but now it comes in. THANK YOU!

[Humanzee]

Originally Posted by jkoutrouba

I just want to be sure I understand this correctly -- you were not using any special dlls to get this working? You just went in and added a custom channel to the EPG lineup?

Yup

[Narflex]

When you add a digital channel to your lineup you should use the following rules:

1. When assigning channel numbers, always assign the UHF channel number as the channel mapping for the digital TV station.
2. If you're adding a digital station like WAVYDT then make sure that the channel WAVY is also mapped correctly (if it's the case where WAVY does not exist, then don't worry about this). This is how SageTV determines the major channel to use.
3. Always use the correct call sign (i.e. if the station is WKABCDT3 then be sure to use that call sign; this is how the subchannel is derived)

From rule #1 the frequency to tune to is determined (the UHF channel).

From rules #2 & #3 the major and minor channels are determined.

I do not suggest using mappings like "31-31-1" as they will have an unknown effect (although they might work for some as was posted in this thread).

EDIT: As of V4.1.8, it is OK to use mappings like 31-31-1 (UHF Chan-major chan-minor chan). SageTV will notice you've done that and not do any modifications to it then.

[jbuszkie]

Originally Posted by Narflex

I do not suggest using mappings like "31-31-1" as they will have an unknown effect (although they might work for some as was posted in this thread).

Jeff, That is what I got from your tech support folks!

[Narflex]

They probably got that from the developer who wrote the lower layer tuning code. Internally, that's the full channel string. But it's auto-generated for digital TV stations at a layer above that.

[rfutscher]

Originally Posted by Narflex

When you add a digital channel to your lineup you should use the following rules:

.........
3. Always use the correct call sign (i.e. if the station is WKABCDT3 then be sure to use that call sign; this is how the subchannel is derived)

........

When I tried the beta version I scaned the channels. Channels that were found that did not have guide info were just listed using the RF channel number. i.e. 30-.
I have four channels listed as 30-.
I guess each is a different subchannel.

What is the procedure to add the call sign? Will this allow me to get the guide info? Everything I have tried to get the program data has failed.

[Humanzee]

Originally Posted by Narflex

2. If you're adding a digital station like WAVYDT then make sure that the channel WAVY is also mapped correctly (if it's the case where WAVY does not exist, then don't worry about this). This is how SageTV determines the major channel to use.

Jeff,
I don't get it, this is not intuative and all so confusing. For some reason Millenium cable here at our appartment broadcasts "KCTS 9" in SD on channel 8 on the cable. Its mapped that way and works, however on OTA broadcasts KCTS 9 is broadcast on VHF channel 9 in SD. If KCTS is my major channel, it "should" be on 9 but shows up on 8. So in this situation what do you mean by "mapped correctly"? My fusion5 tuner can be used for either digital reception or analog reception not both, so it can not detect the major channel on VHF 9 anyway.

In digital KCTS broadcasts 4 channels on channel 41. If I do not change anything after downloading my OTA line up I get KCTSDT1, KCTSDT2, KCTSDT3 and KCTSDT5 in the program guide all on channel 41. Thats fine but when I tune to KCTSDT2 in the program guide I actually start watching the show that is supposed to be on KCTSDT5. Thats the reason I started this thread. The channel-channel-subchannel syntax works, but now you are advising against using it. If we are not to use this syntax because of an unknown efffect, how are we supposed to remap epg data to the correct subchannel if we can not differentiate them?

[Falcon64]

Originally Posted by Narflex

2. If you're adding a digital station like WAVYDT then make sure that the channel WAVY is also mapped correctly (if it's the case where WAVY does not exist, then don't worry about this). This is how SageTV determines the major channel to use.

I have a similar situation to the previous poster. I have a dual tuner system, one for analog cable and one for OTA digital. The local Fox affiliate broadcasts analog on channel 43, the digital channels are 43-1 and 43-2. However, the local cable company broadcasts Fox on 14 and Animal Planet on 43 which is what is in my EPG. So if I add WVBTDT, how would I enter the channel? Is it possible to make it so we can add simply the channel and subchannel? Or at least make the scan channels feature work - it does nothing for me.

I have a total of 4 stations (50% of the digital lineup in my area) that I can't watch in STV because the OTA broadcast channel is UHF and has a different channel on cable which is where the analog guide comes from.

Hope this all makes sense, and I hope that you can provide a way for us to work around this problem.

Regards,

Henry

[Hector]

I have a similar issue. One of my PBS stations has 6 sub channels and every one of them has the wrong EPG data. I think the first one is missing and then the next 5 are off by one and the last one just says 'no signal'. I have an A180 and its software tunes them correctly.

What is the right way of fixing this?

peace . . .

[teknubic]

I had similar problems as you guys. Here's how I overcame them.
Go to AntennaWeb and fill in your address info. It will display the stations you should be able to get from the direction you point your antenna.



I used the vBox signal meter for dialing in the antenna and then went into sage's channel configuration and selected only the channels on the broadcast antenna I was pointed at (176°). The channel for KNXV-DT is actually 56-15-1 to Sage (Frequency Assignment, Channel and Sub-Channel).
If your EPG doesn't know about a channel you can get, that channel is really only good for timed recordings because it constantly shows "No Data" in the lineup. KTVK-DT is like that for me but I've never seen anything worth recording so it's no big deal.
HTH

[Falcon64]

Originally Posted by teknubic

I had similar problems as you guys. Here's how I overcame them.
Go to AntennaWeb and fill in your address info. It will display the stations you should be able to get from the direction you point your antenna.



I used the vBox signal meter for dialing in the antenna and then went into sage's channel configuration and selected only the channels on the broadcast antenna I was pointed at (176°). The channel for KNXV-DT is actually 56-15-1 to Sage (Frequency Assignment, Channel and Sub-Channel).
If your EPG doesn't know about a channel you can get, that channel is really only good for timed recordings because it constantly shows "No Data" in the lineup. KTVK-DT is like that for me but I've never seen anything worth recording so it's no big deal.
HTH

Well, thanks for going through the trouble, but it seems the problem here is that this info has been posted previously...but the folks at Sage have told us this is not correct. Unfortunately the "correct" method doesn't work for some...myself included...under the circumstances described previously.

I haven't received an answer from tech support, either. Wouldn't be so bad if the scan feature worked.

Henry

[Hector]

Agreed. You'd think a bug that caused a PVR to miss recordings would be fairly high on the critical list.

peace . . .

Originally Posted by Falcon64

I haven't received an answer from tech support, either. Wouldn't be so bad if the scan feature worked.

Henry

[Falcon64]

At this point I'm out of things to try. Seems my problem lies with the fact that no matter what I do, if I keep my analog card and my A180 I will be unable to manually tune 4 of 8 channels whose OTA and cable analog channels are on different channels. The remaining problematic digital channel just won't get the EPG data, preventing me from setting up favorites.

I've tried tech support, I've followed the posted instructions for reporting EPG lineup errors, weeks later the problems still exist. If anyone has any other ideas, I'm open to suggestions...if they didn't have my $$$ already I'd give up.

Henry

[Falcon64]

Was told 4.1.7 would correct the problem I have been having. So I downloaded it last night and installed - no change. I still can't get EPG on the one channel I can manually add and actually view. The 4 channels I wasn't able to tune in before after manually adding are still not coming in with the new version.

[egeller]

I can add a channel that doesn't exist in the initial download of the digital (HD) channel line up, but get no EPG data for it, even though I've added the station ID I got from Zap2it.

Also, I've tried all sorts of ways to add a second stream that exists for a channel whose first stream IS in the digital Line up. Nothing works, unless I give it a fake call sign. If I give it the correct call sign with a "2" at the end, it does not ask for the station ID and remaps the existing stream without adding a second occurrence of the channel. When I put in a fake call sign, it asks for the Station ID (again, I get the 5 digit no from Zap2it), but no data is downloaded. At least it adds the channel (which I'm entering as "55-55-2").

I feel so near, yet so far.

e

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by egeller

I can add a channel that doesn't exist in the initial download of the digital (HD) channel line up, but get no EPG data for it, even though I've added the station ID I got from Zap2it.

Not every OTA channel on the Zap2It site can be added as a 'custom' channel. SageTV doesn't seem to get every single channel that the Zap2It site offers & I believe a channel has to be available on either a cable or satellite lineup in order for SageTV to get access to its listings for some reason.

Also, I've tried all sorts of ways to add a second stream that exists for a channel whose first stream IS in the digital Line up. Nothing works, unless I give it a fake call sign. If I give it the correct call sign with a "2" at the end, it does not ask for the station ID and remaps the existing stream without adding a second occurrence of the channel.

When you add the name of your channel, make sure you really are entering a '2' onto the end of the string before pressing Enter. If NTE is on, the first press of the 2 key adds an 'A' into the NTE highlight area, but doesn't yet add it to the string. (You can turn NTE off via the Pause command, btw.) Don't press Enter until you see that there is a '2' added to your channel name.

- Andy

[egeller]

Thanks for the information on the guide. So, is there any recourse to customize a channel line up to get all the streams I want with their EPG data? (I admit this is a newbie question that may have been answered before, but I haven't figured out where it is in the forums).

Originally Posted by Opus4

When you add the name of your channel, make sure you really are entering a '2' onto the end of the string before pressing Enter. If NTE is on, the first press of the 2 key adds an 'A' into the NTE highlight area, but doesn't yet add it to the string. (You can turn NTE off via the Pause command, btw.) Don't press Enter until you see that there is a '2' added to your channel name.

Thanks, but that's not the problem. I figured out, fairly quickly, how to make sure I get past "ABC" to get to the "2."

I really am adding a 2 at the end and the name of the channel I enter really shows as "WHYYDT2" before I press enter. After pressing enter, the dialogue box where it asks for the channel shows the channel name without the "2". After completing the process to add the channel I've found that stream #1 is remapped, not stream #2 added, when I add the channel as "55-55-2". No remapping occurs when I just add the channel number as "55," which according to this thread, seems to be what I should be doing.

The remapping does not happen if I put in a channel name that does not match the channel name of the stream that already exists in the downloaded channel guide.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by egeller

Thanks for the information on the guide. So, is there any recourse to customize a channel line up to get all the streams I want with their EPG data?

If it isn't available to SageTV, they can't provide the info to you. The only other solution I can think of is to use an EPG plugin -- there is one in a sticky post in the Canadian forum section that also uses the Zap2It data, but in a different way, so perhaps it could get the info?

Thanks, but that's not the problem. I figured out, fairly quickly, how to make sure I get past "ABC" to get to the "2."

I really am adding a 2 at the end and the name of the channel I enter really shows as "WHYYDT2" before I press enter. After pressing enter, the dialogue box where it asks for the channel shows the channel name without the "2". After completing the process to add the channel I've found that stream #1 is remapped, not stream #2 added, when I add the channel as "55-55-2". No remapping occurs when I just add the channel number as "55," which according to this thread, seems to be what I should be doing.

The remapping does not happen if I put in a channel name that does not match the channel name of the stream that already exists in the downloaded channel guide.

I'm not sure what to say because this was the only way I could reproduce this problem. If I use the Philadelphia Digital Broadcast lineup & try adding "WHYYDT2", it will ask for the station ID unless I recently already added it; it does not match to the existing WHYYDT. (Of course, not being near Philadelphia, I can't actually try tuning it.) Have you tried pressing Pause (Ctrl+S) when the dialog for entering the channel name first shows up? That will remove NTE from the equation completely. When you enter a channel name + number, it does a name match against existing channels, so it shouldn't match "WHYYDT" unless that is what was entered.

Hmmm.... When you enter a channel name, it simply converts it to upper case & then uses that string when it asks for the channel number. What happens if you were to make something up & enter a name with multiple numbers, such as "XYZ123" -- what channel name does that list when it asks for the channel number in the next dialog? Maybe there is somethig strange going on with the routine converting it to upper case.

- Andy

[egeller]

After some other details, with which I won't bore you, CTRL-S did the trick. I am now getting the correct stream for WHYYDT2. It still says no data in the guide, but being able to code it as channel 55 and not 55-yadda-yadda make navigating the program guide better.

Thanks