SageTV vs. Snapstream PVS - Page 2

trevorst · #21 10-07-2003, 03:50 PM

I have been experimenting with the client and just replaced my 11b setup with a 11g and I can stream DVD Long Play 2.5 Gig per hour with out any problems... With the 11b setup I could only get 1.5 Gig ph and that was jerky as hell. With 11g everything works great.

Need clarification on the client issue though. If I want to load a clien to two other pc's and use SageTV software on the server with only one tuner, do I need 1 client license or two ??? I will only ever be using one at a time just in different locations in the house.

jptaz · #22 10-07-2003, 03:56 PM

The answer depends.

Technically you can do what you propose with one client, but because the server does license verification you will have to exit the client or it will not let you connect. So Spend the extra $30 and save the trouble of having to exit the client.

EDIT: Correction actually the SageTV Server would also have to be restarted so really this would not work...you really do need to buy two. Sorry my mistake

John

trevorst · #23 10-07-2003, 04:17 PM

Thanks...
I understand but as a previous poster noted the cost of the software in total becomes an issue. It would be to Frey's advantage to have one client license cover a full house setup to one tuner.

pawn · #24 10-07-2003, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ShadeD1
I can run a copy on all 3 clients but only 1 tuner is possible per license. Even if I enter program recordings over the web the all go to my server. And yes they added support for PVR 250 cards but only 1 per license. I also seemed to have solved the problem I was having with the 1 client so all is golden

I'll take another look at Snapstream when they support multiple sources. I won't hold my breath in the interim. And by that time, I'm guessing Sage's interface will be leaps and bounds ahead.

This kind of reminds me of my struggles trying to make my ATI AIW + MMC setup viable as a PVR. I struggled (quite literally) for years with their crap, until someone (thanks Lester) posted about SageTV in AVS Forum, and I've been happy ever since.

I feel sorry for you.

jptaz · #25 10-07-2003, 07:26 PM

I agree.

The client functionality would seem some what limited when you only have one tuner and the fact that you could only watch one live tv show at a time. But from their stand point the client does give you full access to play a previously recorded item or to schedule a future recording using the epg. Maybe in the future they will change the license structure or allow a client to work without a license and just disable DVD playback, watching live tv and limit it watching videos on the server and scheduling items for the server to record. It kind of sounds like this is basically the way Snap Stream works.

John

gplasky · #26 10-08-2003, 04:59 AM

I think we need to understand something here. When a Snapstream user says they are using their client machine they are watching their TV thru the web interface. Snapstream streams it to their client machine and they watch thru their web browser. There is no "Snapstream Client" From another machine thru their web browser they can watch TV, use the channel guide and watch recorded programs. This is all done thru streaming to the client machine. I would thing this would require a client machine with pretty good horsepower. I had Snapstream loaded for awhile but never got into the web interface or tried to access it from another PC. I just don't feel it is as functional as SageTV. My opinion. Correct me if I'm wrong on the Snapstream client scenario.

Gerry

PS. Get to Download.com and vote for SageTV.

mlbdude · #27 10-08-2003, 05:02 AM

Correct, SnapStream does not have a client. It cannot stream MPEG2 data. All it is doing in the above users case is opening uip the file via a network share and playing it. Media Play or any Software DVD player can do the same thing. That is not a client

.

stanger89 · #28 10-08-2003, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Narflex
Correction - The DVD Drive is in the client. The client can playback DVDs in its local drive, or DVDs that have been ripped and stored on the server. A DVD in a drive on the server cannot be streamed to the client....or at least it didn't work for me, it was all choppy. If anyone has gotten DVD streaming to work from a DVD-ROM drive on the server, please let me know.

That's not really a fair comparison. It would be like $800 for a Tivo setup like you describe wouldn't it?

You could put the SageTV server on one of the clients and that would save you the cost of one client.

gplasky · #29 10-08-2003, 02:25 PM

Beg to differ mlbdude. Here is the setup instructions from Snapstream:

· Using a remote web-browser

In the browser's address field, type http://<IP Address>:8129 where <IP Address> is the IP Address of the machine on which Personal Video Station is running. For example, a user at a computer in their home office can make a configuration change on the computer running Personal Video Station in the media room by accessing it over a home network. The user would enter http://192.168.1.122:8129 in office computer web-browser

Note: In order to use all functionality available in the Personal Video Station Web Admin interface, the following ports must be open in any firewall between you and your Personal Video Station server. Please see your firewall manufacturer documentation for instructions on opening these ports.

Port 8129: Personal Video Station uses this port for remote accessibility.

Port 1755: Personal Video Station uses this port to stream recorded content.

Port 8080: Personal Video Station uses this port to stream live TV.

There is no drive mapping required. It IS streaming to the client. All of this is available in the web browser window.

Gerry

mlbdude · #30 10-08-2003, 02:29 PM

Sorry

To clarify, SnapStream cannot stream MPEG2 files for streaming. That is only for WMV files that are encoded using a software encoding card. When I speak I am generalizing MPEG2 and hardware encoding cause the other does not count. Sorry.

As the user specified, for his MPEG2 files he added the drive mapping as a library sharpoint into SnapStream. Doing so just uses SS as a frontend for his share.

gplasky · #31 10-08-2003, 03:00 PM

Ah-good. Everything is begining to clear. You are correct on the WMV format required for streaming. Also noticed that if SS uses WMV format it can't do timeshifting. Timeshifting is only available when using MPEG2 format. Seems like a lot of limitations when you start reading the fine print. That's why I love my SageTV Server with 3 tuners and 2 SageTV Client machines.

Love it...love it...love it.

Gerry

EDIT: Plus this post just put me over 100 posts. Whoopee!

trevorst · #32 10-08-2003, 09:14 PM

I tried SnapStream before I purchased Sage and agree Sage wins hands down if you want quality output. As I stated in a previous post I have just started playing with the client capability (even though my 10 day trial is almost up). My personal opinion is that $30 for each client is a little high given that we have purchased the full SageTV software. I could live with an additional $30 for unlimited client usage to one SageTV server (license number tied to server to prevent copying).

jptaz · #33 10-08-2003, 11:09 PM

I had this noble idea that I would try snapstream again.

I downloaded it just to see how live tv and time shifting works
as well as the guide.

Pros:
-Setup was much better than my last experience.
-I setup ATI Remote Wonder, Actisys-IR Blaster, capture card, guide data.
-Actisys-IR Blaster was faster than SageRecorder
-Pretty Interface
-Web scheduler
-display settings easily accessible while viewing show

Cons:
-Default MPEG settings on PVR 250 look and sound worse than SageTV Text not so pretty. (352x480 low bit rate )
-Had to actually train the Remote for my device, SageTV had predefined settings for many box so this was not needed.
-ATI Remote wonder still needed to be programmed as most of the buttons do not actually work for SS only the basics. (I would probably use Girder any way as I want to use all the remote)
-When I set the video capture settings to the same as on SageTV (720x480 2GB/HR) It was unwatchable. It was very jerky audio dropout and the interface unresponsive.
-Because of overscan on my TV the interface was cropped could not for the life of me find any settings for adjusting the GUI to fit in the viewable area of the TV screen.
-Even though I the web admin shows an option to change the MPEG2 Decoder none was listed.
-Configuration and settings are not very easy to do in web interface. I honestly prefer a good old fashioned dialog box like in SageTV.
-Not very customizable
-Full screen would only work on primary so I had to switch display settings.

My Nvidia card is connected to TV using composite out and it configured as an extended desktop secondary display. The primary display is a 14" monitor. Both are at 720x480 x 60Hz. The TV is setup with full overscan.

Just my views and any SS users who can correct me on these issues or tell me how to fix them. I do like the interface but SageTV is much more usable on my systems at this point and I willing to wait for SageTV 2 and I think SS users will be pleased.

John

Beelzebub · #34 10-10-2003, 05:41 AM

$150 isn't bad If you want to build a Multi-Tuner server. You could do all this in MythTV for free. However you need a good understanding of Linux to configure it.

Beelzebub · #35 10-10-2003, 05:42 AM

$150 isn't bad If you want to build a Multi-Tuner server. You could do all this in MythTV for free. However you need a good understanding of Linux to configure it.

mlbdude · #36 10-10-2003, 06:00 AM

I would gladly pay $150 to not have to go through a MythTV installation and maintenance

.

ToxMox · #37 10-10-2003, 06:17 AM

I tried going the MythTV route and kept running into brick walls. I won't even go into all the problems I had. Once I had it set up with just one tuner I couldn't get it to record or watch live tv for more than a minute without crashing. After a few weeks and countless hours of configuring and tweaking and reinstalling Linux and MythTV I decided to format - install XP and SageTV. Was up and running flawlessly with 3 tuners in just a couple of hours. I couldn't be happier. I'm amazed that I can record 3 things at once each at 2GB an hour and watch one of them at the same time without so much as a stutter. Absolutely amazing!

mikejaner · #38 10-10-2003, 08:17 AM

I had a better experience with Mythtv. I think it's a great package. Especially for the linux gurus who don't want to spend money, and have almost any type of tuner including the hardware ones, though not sure about external ones at this point.
When I set it up, I followed the step by setp instructions at http://pvrhw.goldfish.org/tiki-page....Name=rh9pvr250 and got it up and running with a pvr 250 at the time with no issues.
The package worked pretty well, I was very impressed, but there are a few things that make sage stand out. Like you said ToxMox, the setup is difficult, and depends on alot of preinstalled and properly configured packages. In Sage, the fact that I can have a PVR 350 in my system, coupled with a PVR 250, be watching live tv, recording another show, and only be using 5% of my cpu, which leaves all of the processor practically and all of the real estate on the monitor for me to surf the web, if I so choose. And all this in a windows environment which is easy to configure. What I do like about MythTv is the fact that it is the closest competitor, IMHO, to SageTv right now, because Snapstream is so behind in supporting two of my key needs at this point, PVR 350 output (let alone overlay support), multiple tuners, and clients.

I just converted to Sage about three weeks ago, and I have never looked back. I post on the Snapstream forums to help other people out with questions, but I have uninstalled their software and never had second thoughts about it. I can't wait to get Sage 2.0 cause of the interface and the 350 overlay support!

cedeveloperx · #39 10-13-2003, 03:58 PM

I originally purchased Snapstream 2.0 for one simple reason, I wanted to record shows to playback on my pocketpc. I had a long commute and would basically watch an hour or so of TV every morning.

Well Snapstream, unlike most software companies, offered a free upgrade to the new 3.0 version. I had since changed jobs and no longer had a long commute to work so I had put my snapstream on the shelf for a long while.

I decided to resurect an old PC and make it a dedicated snapstream server, the machine was a P3-500 with a USB WinTv device. Big mistake it did not have the horsepower to watch live TV over, the machine was just to slow, I could record fine but I no longer was planning on using it in that capacity. So I got a new machine, an XP2400 with a Happauge 250 and an Nvida graphics card, ATI Remote Wonder(I actually had this lying around) and a low speed serial cable to control my RCA DirecTv box. Much to my dismay after hooking it all up I could no longer stream live video over the internet. So of course I hear all the bragging over in the SageTv camp that they can stream live MPEG video. And now I would like to know given my setup why I would consider Sage of Snapstream?

My server machine is a dedicated PVR, and is connected directly to a TV only, actually I am sending the same signal out to three TVs. I have direcTv and I am not paying for another tuner so I basically can only record one thing at a time no matter what. I like to convert certain shows to windows media format for streaming over the internet. My upload speed being 384 requires that I have a very small sized format (ie NOT MPEG) for streaming.

So I ask what would SageTV do for me that Snapstream doesn't/can't do?

mikejaner · #40 10-13-2003, 04:49 PM

Not much, you are looking for a feature that SageTv has no intention of having. Streaming in another even more compressed format is something you need to look back at snapstream for. You can recompress after the fact of recording a show in Snapstream by selecting an already recorded show in the web interface under recompress or whatever.
mikejaner

BTW you can stream a show with snapstream and a pvr 250, you just can't stream livetv

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)