New Server - SageTV+unRAID under ESXi 4.1

[stanger89]

Actually it wouldn't work too bad, Sage doesn't cleanup files from imported media unless it can access the drive/share to see that they were actually removed. It does it for just this reason, to avoid doing unnecessary/unwanted cleanups if the network goes down (or the machine temporarilly disappears).

[dcardellini]

Originally Posted by stanger89

Actually it wouldn't work too bad, Sage doesn't cleanup files from imported media unless it can access the drive/share to see that they were actually removed. It does it for just this reason, to avoid doing unnecessary/unwanted cleanups if the network goes down (or the machine temporarilly disappears).

ok...its your thread...and I'm going to run with this....

So if we ever get dynamic menus in sage, real easy, on main menu, to "Turn on Server" and send the Magic Packet.

The remaining issue would be how the file server knows to put itself to sleep. That is the tough one. Don't know if Windows XP will sleep automatically on "no network drive access activity."

Suddenly, two boxes is looking awfully attractive.

[madpoet]

I am working on a plugin to spin unRaid up (and if needed I suppose spin it down) as needed based on events like opening Sage. I am running two boxes and love it

[stanger89]

What are you running for your unRAID server?

[madpoet]

I ran an original unRaid server for many years (5 in fact) with Celeron and IDE drives. Just tore it down to upgrade to all SATA. I've got a CM Stacker case and am loading it up with Supermicro 5 in 3 enclosures so I can hit 20 drives. i3 CPU on a MSI H55M-ED55 motherboard. The i3 is likely overkill but I'm getting into things like Sickbeard and nzb downloads so it will come in handy. The one thing I don't have yet (but is next on my list!) is a cache drive. The write speeds stink without it.

[stanger89]

Don't suppose you know if that board supports VT-d do you (I'm pretty sure the i3 doesn't but that's easily remedied with an i5 )?

[davephan]

Originally Posted by madpoet

The i3 is likely overkill but I'm getting into things like Sickbeard and nzb downloads so it will come in handy. The one thing I don't have yet (but is next on my list!) is a cache drive. The write speeds stink without it.

How much CPU is needed for unRAID? I currently am using an i-7 950, quad core 3.06 gig. I assume that a dual core is more than enough. I have two identical i-7 systems, that is why I am using it for the unRAID server. The system board has 10 sata ports and two IDE ports. Most system boards don't have that many ports. I think I will probably move the unRAID server to a lower end processor and a different system board to free up my i-7 system for a Linux SageTV system so I can start migrating SageTV to Linux. I plan to add a 1.5 TB 7200 rpm cache drive soon. My parity drive and data drives are all 2 TB green drives. Do you know if the cache drive also needs to be precleared?

Dave

[madpoet]

Don't know what VT-d is Honestly if you aren't getting too crazy a celeron works fine. If you want to do more than just file serving, then you need more juice. I do think you need to pre-clear the cache drive.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by madpoet

Don't know what VT-d is

It's IO virtualization, ie PCI passthrough.

Honestly if you aren't getting too crazy a celeron works fine. If you want to do more than just file serving, then you need more juice. I do think you need to pre-clear the cache drive.

I was thinking for an ESXi box

[Fuzzy]

I'm pretty sure the H55/57 chipsets don't support VT-d. It would probably have to be a P or Q series chipset, which, unfortunately, eliminates most onboard video options as well. Really, no one seems to be focused on making a consumer level virtualization system, really for good reason, as until ESXi was free, there was no significant potential market. maybe in the next year this might change... either way, on the intel side, best bets would be P55 with i5 or greater. There is a VMDirectPath Whitelist on vm-help.com that does list quite a few

[dcardellini]

Originally Posted by madpoet

...... I've got a CM Stacker case and am loading it up with Supermicro 5 in 3 enclosures so I can hit 20 drives........

That is my exact setup..... a CM Stacker with 4 Supermicro 5in3's. I had to pop out the top bay that holds power/reset/usb to get the last one in, and still have it kludged to the side. Surprised you are buying (4) 5-in-3's as the cost for these alone should get you into a complete Norco 20-bay hot swap without the power slot kludge. Norco was not available when I did mine.

[madpoet]

I already had the CM Stacker. It works out to be only a little more expensive and I prefer the tower form factor. My MB has a power switch on the board, so I just pop the side and hit that if I have to.

Off-topic question, does your top 5in3 sit flush with the top of the bays? I am having a hard time getting it up there. Right now there's a slight gap.

[davephan]

The Supermicro 5in3 photos in NewEgg look good. Most reviews are good too. I have six bays in my full tower that I could turn into 10 drives, plus six internal drives in an existing bracket. So I could boost my drive capacity to 21 drives with 3 of the Supermicro 5in3 units. Then I could mount a single drive somewhere to increase the capacity to 22 drives to fill the unRAID Pro capacity. However, I don't know if I would ever need to expand up to 40 TB with 20 data drives, plus 1 parity and 1 cache drive.

Do you have any heat related problems with the Supermicro 5in3? The drives must be very close to each other. I read one review on NewEgg, which was the worst rated review for the Supermicro 5in3, where the drives kept failing after about six months. I read the same kind of review about the Norco where you could not get a playing card between the drives. If the density is that high, do the drives run hot? What are the drive temperature in the unRAID GUI when using the Supermicro 5in3? Do you have any temperature problems with the high drive density?

Dave

[madpoet]

At full load my 7200rpm drive is at 33c and my 5400s are at 28c. The super micro does a really good job but it is a little louder than I expected.

[dcardellini]

Originally Posted by madpoet

Off-topic question, does your top 5in3 sit flush with the top of the bays? I am having a hard time getting it up there. Right now there's a slight gap.

Yes...the last 5in3 on top was tough to get in. I had to slowly force it. It will not be easy now to remove any of these units given the force I had to use. However, there are no gaps, and it looks perfect. It is a great looking setup in a tower, for sure.

Originally Posted by davephan

Do you have any heat related problems with the Supermicro 5in3? The drives must be very close to each other. I read one review on NewEgg, which was the worst rated review for the Supermicro 5in3, where the drives kept failing after about six months. I read the same kind of review about the Norco where you could not get a playing card between the drives. If the density is that high, do the drives run hot? What are the drive temperature in the unRAID GUI when using the Supermicro 5in3? Do you have any temperature problems with the high drive density?

Dave

I keep a close eye on my drive temps, as this system is located at my ceiling in a closet where ambient sits around 85 degF. At one point, I had two arrays.......16 WD black 750GB's and 8 WD20EADS's and a 5in3 loose on top of the case (I have 24 port 3ware). Today I have 17 Green drives.

My SMART reported drive temps range from 37-41 degC year round, and I run 24/7. Just up'ed drives to 17, but ran 11 for nearly a full year like this. Just a week ago I failed two of these, but not a single hiccup nor reported sector reallocation before that....so I don't believe it is temperature related.

I replaced the fan on the 5in3's years ago....they scream....and when I started with two of these units a 4 years ago, it was unbearable. The new fans are real quiet, slightly less CFM....and this made a huge difference (unfortunately, did not compare before and after drive temps....IDIOT!). The replacement fan is identical in size, mounting screws, and takes about 10 seconds. If there is interest, I can try to find the exact model and source.

Originally Posted by madpoet

I am working on a plugin to spin unRaid up (and if needed I suppose spin it down) as needed based on events like opening Sage. I am running two boxes and love it

OK.....that could be the nail in the Hardware RAID coffin. See doctor, I can let go of that obsession for ONE box. Those pills are working!

[stanger89]

So I found another sort of stumbling block on my road to virutualized happiness. I will "shortly" need more SATA ports for just my unRAID config (5x2TB drives now), so I was looking at the 8-port Supermicro SAS card that's recommended for unRAID. However it appears it doesn't work in ESXi....

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by stanger89

So I found another sort of stumbling block on my road to virutualized happiness. I will "shortly" need more SATA ports for just my unRAID config (5x2TB drives now), so I was looking at the 8-port Supermicro SAS card that's recommended for unRAID. However it appears it doesn't work in ESXi....

I also wouldn't worry about getting an 'unRAID recommended' card if unRAID isn't' going to be talking to it directly. If you're going to be virtualizing unRAID, and unless you're using PCIe passthrough to the entire SAS card, the drives are gonna end up being virtualized by ESXi as a standard SCSI or IDE interface (as far as unRAID is concerned)

[stanger89]

Well the bigger reason is that card is about 1/2 the price (or less) than any other 8+ port SATA/SAS card I've found. The fact that it was unRAID recommended was really just the reason I found it.

Of course it's looking like my hand my be forced. It's looking like the boot drive in my "production" SageTV machine may have just died.

[stanger89]

Miraculously a firm smack got that HDD working again, so I'm running with it (everything on it is backed up) for now.

I was poking around today, trying to figure out what I would get/do for a low-power NAS-like unRAID build, and I found this:
http://www.supermicro.com/products/m...m?typ=H&IPMI=Y

I saw some unRAID users are running it. Looks pretty good, 6x SATA, Dual-core Atom, pulls 25-30W idle, and it's got a PCIe X4 slot, so you could easily add that Supermicro SATA card for a total of 14 drives. And it's got IPMI

[Fuzzy]

I, too, was looking for some atom based boards with PCIe slots - there aren't many, mostly because the NM10 chipset I think only exposes 4 lanes. The more expensive nvidia based platforms offer a LTO more IO lanes - but also cost a lot more.