Can anyone here verify 5.1 Audio output from DirecTV?

[sdsean]

My setup is kinda complicated. . . HD-PVRs connected to STBs via Optical cable, then from the PC, I'm using my mother board to do coaxial RCA to the stereo.

1st off, I don't know for sure if ANY of the channels are actually broadcast in 5.1. If so can you please tell me what ones?

From there obviously I have something wrong, b/c if I set my Pioneer receiver to "auto" it gets a digital signal, but just stereo. . .

as always help appreciated. . .

[rbruce25]

Originally Posted by sdsean

My setup is kinda complicated. . . HD-PVRs connected to STBs via Optical cable, then from the PC, I'm using my mother board to do coaxial RCA to the stereo.

1st off, I don't know for sure if ANY of the channels are actually broadcast in 5.1. If so can you please tell me what ones?

From there obviously I have something wrong, b/c if I set my Pioneer receiver to "auto" it gets a digital signal, but just stereo. . .

as always help appreciated. . .

First of all Most of all the DirectTV broadcasted in surround 5.1 is a matrixed stream (MPEG-TS). It is true 5.1 but you need a decoder to decode the audio + video stream. I had the same issue. Let me explain.

1. How is the HD-PVR connect to the PC?
If it is using the coxial to stereo you will only get stereo. This is Analog always.

2. You must have a AC3 or DTS driver on your computer to output AC3 or DTS streams.

3. You cannot use the Mini-Din plug to RCA that is only analog stereo.

4. Your reciever set to "AUTO" means that it is setting it to an analog input and not digital. IF you change the setting from "AUTO" to digital you will not get any sound because you are inputting only analog.

5. If your sound card has SPIF connector on it that is your digital output. Must current sound cards that are on the motherboard have the connector but usually require an additional "L" bracket connector the converts the SPIF to a coaxial connector. Must of the add on higher end soundcard (PCI or PCI-Express) have a direct coaxial connector.

6. To correct your issue you need the following.

a. Find out if you have and SPIF connector and the "L" bracket to coaxial connector for your motherboard. If not then purchase it from you motherboard vendor or purchase a sound card that has a coaxial connector.

b. Run a coaxial cable from the SPIF connector on you computer to you Pioneer Reciever and make "SURE" you connect it directly to the coaxial input of the Pioneer reciever. DO NOT CONNECT IT TO ANY ANALOG LINE INPUT JACK!!!!

c. Download AC3Filter it is freeware (www.ac3filter.com) and install on you computer.

d. In AC3Filter set the input mode to 3/2.1 and the output to SPIF out, (read the documetation it will tell you more completely how too.)

e. Depending on your reciever you may need to uncheck SPIF passthrough for AC3 and DTS audio, this setting depends on the type of decoder your reciever has. On My Yamaha it usually causes it to distort or be intermittent.

f. Set the Input to the source you connected the SPIF too. Set that souce input to Digital and then test by outputing the DirectTV source. Keep the volume very low at first to make sure you do not damage you speaker.

g. On your computer you need to set the output of your sound card to SPIF, then open up AC3Filter and go to AC3config. This will give you a graphic output of your channels. The input should show all 6 channel and the levels should all be green with not flashing red. If this is the case the input signal is to high and distorting. This is also the same for output. If either input or output are flashing red go to the mixer tab and adjust the input and output setting to where all channels are green and not flashing red. I usually set it to where the levels never peak above 75% of the bar.

You should now have 5.1 surround from you STB box.

[bcjenkins]

Originally Posted by sdsean

My setup is kinda complicated. . . HD-PVRs connected to STBs via Optical cable, then from the PC, I'm using my mother board to do coaxial RCA to the stereo.

1st off, I don't know for sure if ANY of the channels are actually broadcast in 5.1. If so can you please tell me what ones?

From there obviously I have something wrong, b/c if I set my Pioneer receiver to "auto" it gets a digital signal, but just stereo. . .

as always help appreciated. . .

FWIW - I just went through my DirecTV receiver (H21) menus over the weekend and Dolby Digital was off. After enabling it I also turned of SageTV (stopped it in Linux) and restarted the HDPVR.

One of my recordings now says Dolby Digital/384kbps@48kHz Stereo instead of PCM on the detailed info screen.

I don't know if any of my shows broadcast in 5.1 and I don't have any premium channels.

B

[bcjenkins]

I just recorded my first show in 5.1. This works.

B

[sdsean]

OK so let me explain some things further

1.) My receiver / stereo says its getting a "digital" signal. But it is automatically going to "stereo" mode. From the PC to the stereo i'm using coaxial RCA (single plug), not old-school left / righ RCA. Are you saying i need to switch this to Optical? As this is an EVGA classified MOBO, I doubt that I need to worry about this L-connect deal that you speak of. . . but I wil try that as the last resort. . .I know that the connector is plugged into the stereo correctly.


2.) From DirecTV STBs to the HD-PVRs I'm using optical, and then just the USB to the PC. I'm not using the outputs at all on the HD-PVR

I will play with steps d-g 1st, I believe AC3 Filter is already installed with Sage.

However what does step f mean?? Do you just mean on the stereo receiver (yeah that's already done, all i use is my PC and sage for watching tv).

I will also check my STBs as well and make sure they are set to 5.1

But. . . can anyone for sure tell me a channel they know always broadcasts in 5.1?
Any local channel? ESPN?

I'm assuming this should all work the same for DVDs as well correct?

My guess I just have wrong settings in AC3 filter (I do hate messing with that thing. . .)

[Spectrum]

Originally Posted by sdsean

OK so let me explain some things further

1.) My receiver / stereo says its getting a "digital" signal. But it is automatically going to "stereo" mode. From the PC to the stereo i'm using coaxial RCA (single plug), not old-school left / righ RCA. Are you saying i need to switch this to Optical? As this is an EVGA classified MOBO, I doubt that I need to worry about this L-connect deal that you speak of. . . but I wil try that as the last resort. . .I know that the connector is plugged into the stereo correctly.

The connection you are using is fine. SPDIF is SPDIF regardless of the connection medium. You just need a 75 Ohm cable for coax or a TOSLINK cable to use optical; the signaling is the same.

Originally Posted by sdsean

2.) From DirecTV STBs to the HD-PVRs I'm using optical, and then just the USB to the PC. I'm not using the outputs at all on the HD-PVR

I will play with steps d-g 1st, I believe AC3 Filter is already installed with Sage.

An older version is. You can use the installed version, install the newer version, or install FFDShow to decode AC3/DTS and enable/disable passthrough.

Originally Posted by sdsean

However what does step f mean?? Do you just mean on the stereo receiver (yeah that's already done, all i use is my PC and sage for watching tv).

I will also check my STBs as well and make sure they are set to 5.1

But. . . can anyone for sure tell me a channel they know always broadcasts in 5.1?
Any local channel? ESPN?

If you look at the recording properties in sage it will tell you what kind of audio the recording has as well as how many channels. You can also use mediainfo to find out the audio type/number of channels in a recorded file.

Originally Posted by sdsean

I'm assuming this should all work the same for DVDs as well correct?

My guess I just have wrong settings in AC3 filter (I do hate messing with that thing. . .)

One other thing to check is your Windows audio config. Make sure it is set to 5.1 if you are going to your stereo, otherwise Kmixer could be downmixing your signal before it ever gets to your receiver.

[bcjenkins]

Originally Posted by sdsean

OK so let me explain some things further

1.) My receiver / stereo says its getting a "digital" signal. But it is automatically going to "stereo" mode. From the PC to the stereo i'm using coaxial RCA (single plug), not old-school left / righ RCA. Are you saying i need to switch this to Optical? As this is an EVGA classified MOBO, I doubt that I need to worry about this L-connect deal that you speak of. . . but I wil try that as the last resort. . .I know that the connector is plugged into the stereo correctly.


2.) From DirecTV STBs to the HD-PVRs I'm using optical, and then just the USB to the PC. I'm not using the outputs at all on the HD-PVR

I will play with steps d-g 1st, I believe AC3 Filter is already installed with Sage.

However what does step f mean?? Do you just mean on the stereo receiver (yeah that's already done, all i use is my PC and sage for watching tv).

I will also check my STBs as well and make sure they are set to 5.1

But. . . can anyone for sure tell me a channel they know always broadcasts in 5.1?
Any local channel? ESPN?

I'm assuming this should all work the same for DVDs as well correct?

My guess I just have wrong settings in AC3 filter (I do hate messing with that thing. . .)

The show I caught in 5.1 was White Collar on USA. You should first verify that you're recording the shows in digital. If you are, you will see something like: Dolby Digital @ 48khz 5.1 or Dolby Digital @ 48khz stereo in the recording information. Prior to fixing the output on my STB I was seeing: AAC@48khz stereo.

HIH

B

[sdsean]

OK so I noticed that in my realtek audio manager, I have no tab to choose my speaker setup. Both in windows, and in the realtek audio manager, all I can select is 2 channel / stereo.

I saw a post on the net, with an imagethat looks like this:



But I have no tab like that for "Speakers" at all, and there does not appear to be anywhere I can select 5.1.

I have the absolute latest "Audio Codec" Drivers from realtek.

I'm not sure if I should have this tab or not, but it seems wrong that I can't select 5.1 output anywhere.

Perhaps this is b/c I do in fact need this magic "L Bracket" (even though the connection is directly to the Mobo, and its an EVGA X58 SLI Classified, so I have a hard time believing it doesn't support 5.1)?

Or perhaps just messing with AC3filter will solve my problem?

(Or maybe I need to just buy/connect another optical cable).

[Spectrum]

Sorry, the speaker config was a red herring but as an FYI, to get to that screen you should have a "Realtek HD Audio Manager" in the Hardware and Sound section of the control panel. I posted that from memory and what I was actually thinking of was if you open the Sound config from the control panel then select the digital output device and click properties, there is a supported formats tab where you can select the different encoded formats and sample rates available. Other than that it's just dinking with the settings in AC3 filter or the ffdshow audio codec to get things working. You have to enable SPDIF passthrough otherwise the signal will get decoded on the PC rather than the receiver.

If you have a coax SPDIF connector on your motherboard there is no need for a "Magic L bracket." The only reason you would need some sort of expansion port like that is if there was no connector on the motherboard but there was a header. Kind of like hooking up USB ports to a header on the board.

Also don't try to troubleshoot capture and playback at the same time. Make sure you know what kind of source you are sending so you know can get the result you are looking for

[sdsean]

Will do as far as the capture / playback. . .I'll let you know.

So indeed I have a "Realtek HD Audio Manager" that I can open up in the control panel.

What I was trying to point out is that I have no tab labeled "Speakers". Mine only has 2 tabs ("Digital Input" , "Digital Output"). Futher when I click "properties" and do try to select the different encoded formats and sample rates, all formats work (DTS, WMA, etc), and all sample rates work (all the way up to max studio quality), but only work in 2 -channels. Nowhere in here can I select 5.1 anything. . .

I don't know why this is. . . and I'm trying to figure out if this is a red herring or not. . .

I have read some posts on AVSForms that suggest the realtek codec/drivers have an "auto-sensing" feature, and therefore remove that tab.

But I know the stereo should support whatever it wants to output via SPDIF, so I'm a bit confused. It kinda made me think perhaps I do need to switch from coaxial to optical. . . but i'm not sure and don't wanna have to get that dirty unless I have too. . .

On the other hand, I'm also wondering if perhaps messing around with AC3 Filter will also solve this problem inside the Realtek HD Audio Manager / windows sound console

[Spectrum]

LOLS. Want me to strip out some small samples for you to play with so you know what your source is?

I'm betting you have the hardware in place, you just have to get the settings write in (Windows && (AC3Filter || ffdshow) && receiver) How's that for boolean logic!

OK Screenshots shamelessly stolen from Softpedia because I don't have AC3 Filter installed on anything anymore.



1. Set your output to 5.1 or however AC3 labels it (3/2 or something maybe)
2. Check use SPDIF
3. During playback if you open the config you can see what the audio decoder chain looks like here.


Make sure you have checks in the boxes you want to use AC3 Filter for and put checks in the AC3 and DTS checkboxes under SPDIF passthrough if your receiver can decode both. I can almost say with certainty it will do AC3, most will, but DTS is another matter.

Things may look a tad different in your version, but the main points should still be there.

[sdsean]

Wow, you didn't have to go and do all that. . .but hey since we using code:

sdsean_happy = (screen_shoot_a && screen_shot_b)

I'll let you all figure out whether or not that's true or false (i almost did some bitwise math, but i thought that'd be too geeky).

OK anyway as for the update.

1.) You were right about ac3 filter, or at least partially. . . that solved my problem for Windows Media Player outputting 5.1, but not for SageTV

2.) So then I went into ffdshow audio config and did this. . .



and



and then I had to go into SageTV Detailed setup and force selection of AC3Filter for MPEG2 content and ffdshow for HD Audio content.

But then. . .

Most of the files that I have which are encoded as 5.1 (using the info from the details of a recording / import), sure enough once I did this started working. Surround sound goodness!!

But of course the one I was testing with, recorded from ShowtimeHD (Inside the NFL), which says its 5.1, is only outputting Stereo, while others seem to be just fine. . . .not sure why this is. . . any hints there would be appreciated.

I also seem to have a lot of recordings in Stereo (according to Sage), but I checked all my HD-PVRs, and they are all outputting 5.1. . . but hey at least I got somewhere. . .

I very much dislike the fact that the "Real HD Audio Manager" is not doing this (allowing 5.1, etc). After all it is an "Audio Codec + Driver". Pretty freaking ridiculous. . .


Does anyone know if I can toggle some settings in ffdshow / ac3 filter to have it toggle to 5/7 Channel stereo mode, when stereo data is encountered? Or at least to Dolby Pro Logic. . . ?

[bcjenkins]

Have you confirmed that your DirecTV receiver has Dolby Digital turned on in the setup menus? The sound will still output over the digital connections even if it is off.

B

[sdsean]

yup dolby digital is on on all the receivers (verified in the menus, and via the output display on my stereo receiver).

like i said, the fact that some say they are 5.1 when they are not doesn't bother me too much. . i only found one recording like this so far. ..

i just need to figure out how I can get my stereo to switch to 5/7-channel stereo mode when a stereo signal comes in. . . I tried having ffdshow and ac3 filter set to "Expand stereo to center/surround" but that doesn't seem to have an effect. . .