Stutter During Playback - only when Recordings start

[jptaz]

I started to notice an unusual anomalie.

On my SageTV Server / Living Room Playback Box I get a stutter whenever a recording starts. The Stutter is worse when it is starting a recording on my PVR-500 (It doesn't matter if it is recording with TV Tuner input or S Video and tuning my Cable box with the Actisys IR 200 ). It also doesn't matter if I am playing back from Hard Disk or DVD.

Here is my configuration:

AMD Athlon XP 3200+
1 GB Memory
Giga-Byte GA-7N400Pro2 - NVidia Chipset

AGP Slot - > PNY 6600GT -> Connected to HD Set with DVI at 1280x720
PCI Slot 1 -> 3Ware 9500-12s -> 7 x 250GB Seagate in RAID + 1 x 250 GB Hot Spare ( Partitioned into a 30GB C: and 1.3TB M: for media files )
PCI Slot 2 -> Hauppauge PVR 500 -> Coax Cable + Svideo to Digital Cable box
PCI Slot 3 -> Hauppauge PVR 250 -> SVideo to Digital Cable Box
PCI Slot 4 -> Hauppauge PVR 250 -> SVideo to Digital Cable Box
PCI Slot 5 -> Hauppauge PVR 250 -> SVideo to Digital Cable Box

COM1 -> Actisys IR 200L for controlling PVR 500 Digital Cable Box
COM2 - Disabled
LPT1 -> Old Okidata OL800/PS Printer
USB 1.1 -> USB UIRT 1 used by SageTV with Multizones to control 3 Digital Cable Boxes.
USB 1.1 -> USB UIRT 2 - used by Girder to control All Living room AV equipment
USB 1.1 -> ATI Remote Wonder Receiver - Used by Girder with Plugin
1394 -> Sony External DVD-R - Used for playing DVDs
100BT -> Linksys 8 Port 100MB Swith.
I have the following software installed:

Windows XP Pro SP2 with all latest hotfixes
Java 1.5 - Latest release.
Java 1.4 - Latest release - not being used / Tested briefly with this since Jeff posted that it worked better for VMR9+FSE than 1.5.
SageTV 4.1 - Current release not beta - Configured as a service.
2 X Media MVP Licenses for 2 Media MVPs run by SageTV
SageTV 4.1 Client - Used to watch TV - used to be for Matts MVP Plugin.
ATI Remote Wonder Driver 1.5
Girder 3.2 - Old Free Version
Current USB-UIRT Driver and Special Girder Plugin for 2nd USB-UIRT
Current NVidia Driver set for Motherboard
NVidia Video Driver 78.XX ( Can't remember exactly...I need it to be able to use the Component dongle for my projector which is currently not connected).
3Ware 9.3.1 Drivers.

I had Norton Antivirus, but discovered that it totally impaired smooth playback even excluding the media drive and SageTV directories from scans.

The Stutter is not as bad if the recording that starts is on one of the 3 PVR 250 cards, Video only hiccup. But if either of the PVR 500 Encoders start recording audio and video skip, like the audio is repeating.

I Have tried the following:

1. Using SageTV.exe instead of SageTVClient.exe for playback
2. Using Overlay with no FSE - with Current NVidia Pure Video Decoders.
3. Using VMR9 with FSE - with Current NVidia Pure Video Decoders.
4. Starting SageTV.exe with Above Normal Priority.
5. Starting SageTVClient.exe with Above Normal Pirority.
6. Increasing the NumBuffers registry setting to above 40 ( 200 and 400 ).

Normal CPU Utilization during playback with VMR9 FSE is 20 to 30% at worsrt even when playing a Demo 1080i 19Mbs file.

Normal CPU Utilization during playback with Overlay is 10 to 20% at worsrt even when playing a Demo 1080i 19Mbs file.

I did some tests doing the same thing with one of my 2 client PCs and I don't see the stutter nor do I see it on the 2 Media MVPs.

I always record at DVD Standard Play ( 3.25 GB/HR ).

It does not seem to matter what the Recording Level(Even with Max MPEG2) is or how may recordings start at the same tieme...1 to 5.

I think when I did some testing in overlay with the Taskmanger the CPU seems to spike to 100% Briefly.

Any suggestions or help would be appreciated. It is not the end of the world, but it is annoying to be watching a show or DVD and have the stutter occur.

Thanks,
John

[aperry]

This happens to me as well. I have three PVR-500's in my system and another system I maintain with a PVR-150 and a PVR-500. Whenever a recording starts while you are watching something else, I get the audio stutter and video freeze (the audio stutter goes for about 1 second).

I can also get this to happen if I'm watching live TV and change channels.

[jptaz]

I have not tried it with changing channels in livetv since I do not really do that.

I will have to.

How fast is your computer(s)? Is this maybe a processor speed issue? It does not seem like it should be.

I did submit this to support. If you have the issue submit the problem to support if you have not that way hopefully it will get higher priority with more than one person complaining.

John

[aperry]

My system is a Athlon 64 3700+, and the other is a Pentium Dual Core (2.8 GHz), so no, it definitely is not a processor speed issue.

[BBCritical]

I have a pvr 150 and a pvr 500. If have more than 1 show recording at a time the stuttering happens approximately once every 5 minutes. If I am recording 3 programs its downright unbearable (resulting in a low WAF). I am running an AMD 3200+ processor and I just installed 2.5 Gb of RAM and it did not seem to help matters...

Anyone have any other ideas because I need to add another pvr 500 ....

BTW.. my cpu shoots through the roof when recording 3 shows as well..... (96 - 100%)

[jptaz]

Well that is definitely different from what I am experiencing, my problem only happens when the recordings start. I can record 5 shows at 5.9 GB/HR and if I am not watchin it is at 20% peak and usually more like 5% ( I don't usuallly recrod it this rate, usuall 3.2 GB/HR) and it is fine. Do you have antivirus software? I had to completely uninstall mine to get rid of those problems?

An Extreme solution to backing up all your settings and wiz files and uninstall SageTV, Java, all the Encoder card drivers and use HWClear. Reboot. Install with the drivers from the latest pvr cd image found at hauppauges website. Install the the latest version of java ( 1.5 or 1.4 .. there is some debate over which is better). Reinstall SageTV, but do not restore any setting or wiz files until you have configured and tested the setup and made sure that when recording 3 shows it is not using that much CPU.

John

[jptaz]

Originally Posted by aperry

My system is a Athlon 64 3700+, and the other is a Pentium Dual Core (2.8 GHz), so no, it definitely is not a processor speed issue.

This is definitely a SageTV related issue since I had to install BeyondTV to use my new HD Tuner until support can help me figure out what is going on and I was watching an HD show when 2 shows started recording and it had no issue.

John

[BBCritical]

No antivirus installed on the sage server

[jptaz]

Does it use 96%to 100% CPU when just recording and not watching?

[BBCritical]

I saw something somewhere about how the mvp is pings the server and raises the cpu level on the server... that may very well be apart of what is going on because when it is working correctly it uses low cpu. I am going to do a full blown test when I get home.

Full blown test =
Record two programs
Play recording on server
Play recording on mvp
Watch live tv on client

[jptaz]

I retract my statement earlier that this doesn't happend when playing back video with another application. SageTV maybe causing the problem.

John

[BBCritical]

Any progress on this... ???

[jptaz]

Nope...I did send a followup email to support.

If I had the time and patience I would uninstall SageTV and install the trial of BTV 4.0 and see if it gets the same behavior...but that would require some tweaking of the ir blaster files and what not to make it usable.

For now I am just hoping that SageTV support gets back to me.

John

[ben_95sl1]

I get cpu spikes to 100% numerous times for various reasons with no visible effect on the running video; I can imagine having that many recording starting at once with all that hardware could cause problems. If its hardware related/limited, I'd suggest offloading sagetv server/pvr card, hard drives to another pc (lower end) and just run sagetv client on your "good" htpc. My understanding is that most people don't have problems though.

BTW, you've got a lot of stuff on the pci bus! don't know if that has anything to do with it?

[jptaz]

I suspect this is a PVR-500/150 issue seeing as I am not the only one with the issue. Either SageTV is not doing something right with the PVR 500 / 150 or it is a problem with the way the drivers work. The problem is not so bad If I don't record anything on the PVR-500. I have contemplated pulling it out and seeing if things are better.

I hope all the stuff on the PCI bus isn't problem. I kind of doubt since the problem happens if I start a recording on one of the PVR 500s only...that is hardly any load on the PCI bus...but then again I can start and HD recording and 3 recordings on the PVR 250s with next to no problem.

I am really curious if I were to install BTV and configure it with all 6 tuners if it would work without the problem...BTV was a hell of a lot easier to install than SageTV and frankly designed alot more intelligently. They have a seperate recording service that only records...not schedule...not server clients...just record...and it is set to above normal priority so no dropped frames during recording...something I still in rare circumstances happens with SageTV.

John

[ben_95sl1]

I don't get frames dropped with my pvr150 starting a rec, not that I notice anyway. Do you notice any ill effects on the mvps playback? I think seperating the server from the playback is ideal; I hope to implement it soon so I can just leave a really weak/cheap/low power via c3 system running 24/7 instead of my "good" setup.

I've previously had such severe high cpu usage problems that the recordings were absolutely ruined for 5min periods. Don't know what was wrong, but after moving from 2.2.8 to 4.1.3 incl using the new built in canada epg, haven't had that happen once.

have you tried using winxp's built-in performance logs (may be only prof. ed) and track cpu usage over time? helped me figure out when cpu went nuts and how often.

[jptaz]

Ben,

I am pretty sure it is not a CPU issue...I don't see the playback probelms on my clients. I really don't want to go back to 2 boxes running 24x7. For now the problems are rare...dropped frames...and for now when a recording starts I just jump back 10 seconds and move on with my life.

Also if you notice that aperry has this issue on a dual core CPU and 3700+ so I am fairly certain CPU is not the issue. I think you may be right and it is some sort of PCI issue and I may just try moving the PVR 500 to a different slot and seeing if the issue goes away...and maybe just go to an external USB2 Encoder...maybe a convertx...maybe another HD tuner

John

[aperry]

One other thing to note here is that this sound stutter did not happen to me until I upgraded the 3700+ to version 4, and happened immediately on the dual core Pentium and all it has ever had was version 4.

[jptaz]

Hmmm....

I am wanting more and more to try to install BTV 4 trial and see how it behaves...now I just need to find the time to do it.

Apperry,

have you submitted a bug report to Sage on this?

I have a laundry list of issues open with them right now and have not heard back on any of them. Sadly this falls 3rd on the list as I want to get correct HD support before worrying too much about a problem that can be corrected by skipping back 10 seconds.

John

[aperry]

No, I have not yet, but I am going to submit a bug report.

I recorded the symptom I am hearing. About 6 or 7 seconds into the clip you'll hear what is happening. It happens multiple times as I had multiple other tuners all start up at the same time.