Playback Stutters, Pauses, Speeds up, then it's fine?

[tangfj]

Hello,

This may be a bit confusing but here is what's happening to me on my Sage system.

Every once in a while, when I'm watching a show, the playback will start to stutter (meaning video and audio will stutter). Then if I hit a couple buttons on the remote like info or just wait a little while, the sage spinning icon will come up then playback will completely pause for a little bit... then after waiting for a little while the playback will resume again and start playing really fast like it's trying to catch up to where you should be. Then playback will resume as normal.

Is this or something similar happening to anyone else? It seems as if there is something else going on in Sage like downloading the EPG or clearing a cache or something that is causing it so slow up and stutter. When this happens I usually look to see if my HDD led is going crazy but it never is when this happens to me. Any ideas? Sorry I can't post more detailed information at the moment since I'm not in front of my HTPC.

Specs:
Processor: AMD XP 2200
Ram: 1 GB
HD: 1 hard drive with 2 partitions, 1 for OS and other for video
1 more hard drive with other media and storage for sage videos
Sage version: 4.1
Tv Tuners: 2 mce 150's


I'm also runnning ORB right now, but this problem was on my system long before installing ORB. Could it possibly be Sage downloading the EPG or something like that??? Any advice would be appreciated... also if anybody could explain where and how to capture logs in Sage that would be great so I could figure out where there may be errors. Thanks in advance...

[dflachbart]

Originally Posted by tangfj

also if anybody could explain where and how to capture logs in Sage that would be great so I could figure out where there may be errors.

You can enable debug logging by setting debug_logging=TRUE in Sage.properties (note that 'TRUE' has to be upper case).

Hope this helps,

Dirk

[tangfj]

I opened my sage properties file but I didn't see a debug_logging line. Can I add it? If so where? Also, while I'm on the subject, anyone know where I can modify my recording settings? I used to be able to see it in the properties file but now they aren't there in v4. Thanks... I know I know, I should do a search, just figure since I'm posting anyway I might as well ask in case somebody can point me in the right direction quickly.

[dflachbart]

Originally Posted by tangfj

I opened my sage properties file but I didn't see a debug_logging line. Can I add it? If so where?

Yes, you can simply add this line. It doesn't matter where, all properties will get sorted alphabetically anyway next time the file is saved by SageTV.

Originally Posted by tangfj

Also, while I'm on the subject, anyone know where I can modify my recording settings? I used to be able to see it in the properties file but now they aren't there in v4. Thanks... I know I know, I should do a search, just figure since I'm posting anyway I might as well ask in case somebody can point me in the right direction quickly.

Not sure if I can help here, but which recording settings do you mean ?


Dirk

[tangfj]

By recording settings I meant recording qualities, ie - DVD, VCD, MPEG, etc...

[DFA]

If using anti-virus software, try turning it off.

DFA

[tangfj]

no anti virus software here... i tried changing audio decoders for now to see if that helps. from what i've seen on my pc, i see the cpu usage spike up to 99% or so for about 2-3 mins and it will be choppy the entire time. then the pc usage will go down and the screen will pause during this process, then you see the video catch up really quickly to catch up to the audio (which has been playing fine almost the entire time). i'll have to wait and see but hopefully changing the audio decoder does the trick. before i had it set to the default but i changed it to direct sound or something like that for now to see what happens.

[tangfj]

Ok, so I've tried several different settings and nothing seems to make the problem go away so I finally decided to activate debugging... Here's what I see when the problem happens:

Thu 2/23 20:30:01.201 VF thread is now waiting for 2:13:22.306
Thu 2/23 20:30:01.424 needFreeSize = 0.3213 GB currFreeSize=0.558263296 GB
Thu 2/23 20:30:01.441 needFreeSize = 0.3213 GB currFreeSize=0.3597968 GB
Thu 2/23 20:30:01.443 Seeker waiting for 24 mins.
Thu 2/23 20:30:13.909 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:30:42.697 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:31:12.695 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:31:42.618 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:32:03.428 Ministry is waiting for 180 sec
Thu 2/23 20:32:12.712 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:32:42.710 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:33:12.703 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:33:42.694 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:34:12.696 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:34:42.704 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.232 Seeker awoken
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.233 MARK 1 currRecord=A[8224176,8224111,"NBA Basketball",11164@0223.19:00,150] enc=Hauppauge WinTV PVR PCI II Capture #2 clients=[UIManager:localhost@@SAGETV_PROCESS_LOCAL_UI] ir=true
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.233 Seeker in AUTOMATIC mode nextRecord=A[8220782,8209113,"The Daily Show With Jon Stewart",10149@0223.22:00,30] nextTTA=5099767
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.233 FORCE WATCH abandoned because it's currently being recorded clients=[UIManager:localhost@@SAGETV_PROCESS_LOCAL_UI]
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.233 newRecord=A[8224176,8224111,"NBA Basketball",11164@0223.19:00,150]
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.233 Keeping record just the way it is.
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.234 MARK 1 currRecord=A[8220736,579842,"South Park",10149@0223.20:30,30] enc=Hauppauge WinTV PVR PCI II Capture clients=[] ir=true
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.234 Seeker in AUTOMATIC mode nextRecord=A[8226792,2511406,"That '70s Show",11795@0223.21:00,30] nextTTA=1499767
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.234 newRecord=A[8220736,579842,"South Park",10149@0223.20:30,30]
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.234 Keeping record just the way it is.
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.235 RootFile=D:\ fstype=NTFS fileLength=2115364800
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.235 RootFile=E:\ fstype=NTFS fileLength=111165376
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.240 VF processing job null nPlayin=true
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.241 isRec=true rd=5639030 base=1235492
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.244 VF thread is now waiting for 2:08:23.046
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.481 needFreeSize = 0.3213 GB currFreeSize=0.445017088 GB
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.493 needFreeSize = 0.3213 GB currFreeSize=0.2486928 GB
Thu 2/23 20:35:00.493 DISKSPACE MANAGEMENT: freeSpace=248MBsafeAirs=[A[8220736,579842,"South Park",10149@0223.20:30,30], A[8224176,8224111,"NBA Basketball",11164@0223.19:00,150], A[8222667,8222531,"50 Hottest Vegas Moments",10989@0222.23:00,120]]
Thu 2/23 20:35:03.454 Ministry is waiting for 180 sec
Thu 2/23 20:35:12.717 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 848
Thu 2/23 20:35:13.480 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 1611
Thu 2/23 20:35:14.245 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 2376
Thu 2/23 20:35:15.023 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 3154
Thu 2/23 20:35:15.769 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 3900
Thu 2/23 20:35:16.532 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 4663
Thu 2/23 20:35:17.217 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:35:17.356 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 5487
Thu 2/23 20:35:18.105 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 6236
Thu 2/23 20:35:18.885 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 7016
Thu 2/23 20:35:19.648 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 7779
Thu 2/23 20:35:20.443 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 8574
Thu 2/23 20:35:21.209 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 9340
Thu 2/23 20:35:22.001 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 10132
Thu 2/23 20:35:22.768 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 10899
Thu 2/23 20:35:23.545 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 11676
Thu 2/23 20:35:24.337 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 12468
Thu 2/23 20:35:25.132 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 13263
Thu 2/23 20:35:25.893 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 14024
Thu 2/23 20:35:26.658 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 14789
Thu 2/23 20:35:27.427 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 15558
Thu 2/23 20:35:28.313 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 16444
Thu 2/23 20:35:29.062 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 17193
Thu 2/23 20:35:29.840 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 17971
Thu 2/23 20:35:30.590 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 18721
Thu 2/23 20:35:31.480 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 19611
Thu 2/23 20:35:32.240 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 20371
Thu 2/23 20:35:33.032 AWTThread Hang Detected - hang time = 21163
Thu 2/23 20:35:47.224 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000
Thu 2/23 20:36:07.848 Added:Wasted[id=8267227 Airing=A[8226778,1870260,"King of the Hill",11795@0223.18:30,30]]
Thu 2/23 20:36:07.890 Deleted media segment file E:\Sage_Videos\KingoftheHill-NinePrettyDarnAngryMen-8226778-0.mpg dtime=40 len=675047360
Thu 2/23 20:36:07.933 DISKSPACE MANAGEMENT COMPLETE FreeSpace=897
Thu 2/23 20:36:07.945 Seeker waiting for 18 mins.
Thu 2/23 20:36:08.089 Carny got a Wasted job of A[8226778,1870260,"King of the Hill",11795@0223.18:30,30]
Thu 2/23 20:36:09.563 CARNY Processing 5269 Agents & 5977 Airs
Thu 2/23 20:36:17.235 PM currState=3 wakeupTime=Thu 2/23/2006 21:58:00.000

Anyone else see similar stuff in their logs and what does it mean? Thanks..

[amac]

I have similar symptoms and have similar entries in my log. I've just been living with it for now because I don't have the cycles to investigate it. Would be nice if someone could explain it though. FYI, I sent a similar log to Sage 3 weeks ago but it was with regard to a power management issue. I assumed at the time that the hangs were related but now I see perhaps they are a different issue.

[DJD]

Being new to HTPC, I started using Sage about two weeks ago. After about a week, I began experiencing the stutter-pause-FF issue, and it became so bad that Sage was unusable.

Last night, though, I disabled 3D acceleration and enabled overlay, which removed 95% of the audio and video stuttering. The other 5% was removed by setting the 'scan library' property to 'false'. Now, Sage works perfectly, and all of my video input looks excellent.

I don't know much about your setup, so this may not apply, but if it does, I hope that it works for you.

Other major suggestions I've seen have included updating or rolling-back your version of Java/JRE, and updating or rolling-back the drivers for your motherboard, video card, tuner card. I'm glad that I didn't have to bother with any of that.

'AWT' stands for Abstract Window Toolkit, and if I remember correctly, it's the portion of Java that developers use to create and manipulate windows and graphics. By inference alone, I would say this indicates that you need to reduce the display load of Sage.

My setup:

Sage 4.0 w/ included JRE version
XP Home SP2
Nvideo Purevideo Decoder for Video
AC3 for audio (yeah, I know)
P4 2.6
512MB RAM
160GB HD (100GB for Sage, for now)
ATI Theater 550
Nvidia 6200
Sony 32" SDTV


- DJD

[tangfj]

Ok, so I've tried almost every combination of decoders/renderers on my pc and nothing has helped. Since I've been using Sage since v2.0 and I've never really done a clean install, I figured now would be a good time. So I reverted my Java version back to the one that ships with Sage, then I installed the latest beta of Sage as a clean install (I uninstalled my previous version and backed up my current sage directory). Then I brought back my old wiz.bin file to my new installation and re-installed dynamic menus and a few other enhancements...

Anyway, after doing all this, I still get the stuttering problems... I've read about other people having the same problem and they found out that their problems were coming from scanning of their import directories. Now, my logs don't seem to indicate that I'm having the same problem but just in case it is, does anyone know if there is a fix for this?

Just in case anyone is having the same problems, about every 20-30 mins Sage starts stuttering, then when I check what's going on I see that Sage has eaten up over 90% of cpu usage and has over 200MB of ram usage. If I wait a little bit (usually a couple of minutes), the cpu usage drops down and then the video and audio go back to playing normal. If anybody is experiencing the same problems or might know how to get rid of this let me know!! Thanks.

[domc]

All of a sudden my system starting doing this too. I believe I fixed it but will need to watch to see if the fix sticks.

I defragged the recording drive and changed my audio settings to Default.

Who knows...

[DJD]

Domc, that's interesting. Since defragging, have you tried setting your audio back to your previous configuration? Let us know what happens (or better yet, doesn't happen).


Tangfj, sorry to hear that none of the above solved the problem you're experiencing. When you did a clean install of Sage with the included version of Java, did you experience stuttering before restoring your configuration files, or only afterwards? If you didn't check for stuttering before you restored your files, I would definitely recommend going through the process again.

You can reportedly disable automatic scanning of your media directory/ies by setting the following property in the 'sage.properties' file:

seeker/periodically_scan_library=false

It's set to 'true' by default.


Since my last post on this topic (above), we've experienced exactly three stutters, but none of the stutter-pause-FF issue. Sage is actively used (TV recordings or DVD playback) for about 8-10 hours per day in our household, so three stutters within a week or two are quite tolerable.

Update: My wife called me at work to tell me that Sage stuttered about five times during playback of her soap today. She reported that it has not stuttered otherwise today.

What caused that stuttering? Now I'm worried that it will become more frequent. My system ran perfectly for a while, and the only thing that may have changed is the condition of my Sage-dedicated drive partition, and that would only have been caused by Sage itself. I'll probably work with the JRE, if the stuttering persists.

[tangfj]

Well, I am going through a defrag of my video partition right now so I'll report back to see if that helps.

I was wondering, though, does this have anything to do with the fact that my recordings, O/S, and Sage are all on the same drive? Basically I have a 160 GB drive and I split it into a 100 GB partition for video and the rest for system files and programs. I'm wondering that since both are on the same physical drive that maybe this is why Sage has the lockups and stutters? Anyway, I'm gonna try to see if I can get by with using another physical drive for recording to see if that clears up the issue.

[amac]

Could have something to do with Sage using java and how its garbage collection is configured. We don't here much from the developers and their home experience but here are a couple of links (one very recent and one older) that indicate they too experience stuttering issues.

http://forums.sage.tv/forums/showthr...9&postcount=18 and
http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/show...89&postcount=4

I recently upgraded to Java 1.5.0_06 and SageTv 4.1.9. I still get stutters, but seemingly not as pronounced.

[DJD]

Since my last post, my system has only stuttered a handful of times, mostly during the EPG update (11:00am, need to change this). I even re-enabled Direct-X 9 and 3D Acceleration two days ago, and have had only two stutters since. I didn't make any other changes, but it's been running smoothly. I'm confused, but not complaining.

Please do let us know whether or not defragging has any effect on the stuttering.

[GTwannabe]

What size clusters are you using on your TV drives?

[DJD]

My TV storage drive is on the same physical drive as my OS (XP Home SP2) and other data. It's formatted in NTFS with 64k clusters.

My stuttering gradually returned after a few days of using VMR9 with 3D Acceleration. At that point, Windows reported the TV drive to be 42% fragmented, and the files on the TV drive to be 92% fragmented. Of course, I then defragmented the TV drive, and the stuttering disappeared. If weekly defragmenting is all that's required, then so be it.

One important thing to note is that some of my recordings became partially distorted after defragmenting. At certain points in the recording, about once every 20 minutes, a 3-second portion of the file would be repeated about 1-3 times. I'll try searching these forums to see if there's a remedy for this.

[DJD]

Found it. Here's a good topic on defragging:

http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/show...ghlight=defrag

I've seen Diskeeper recommended a few times, for defragging. It costs $29.95 from the manufacturer's site. I'm not pleased about the idea of spending more money to iron out all of the details, so I'll try defragging with the standard Windows tool a few more times, to see if more shows get messed up.


Also, check this out:
http://www.diy-pvr-dvr-htpc.com/inde...Still_Stutters

I might try that as well.

[tangfj]

Has anyone heard or learned anything else about stuttering?

I defragged my hd but I'm still having the problem come up about every 20-30 mins. I e-mailed support a few weeks back and sent them log files and debug log files and they couldn't figure out what it was either... anyway, if any of you have learned anything new, let us know! It's starting to get really annoying when it stutters because I can't do anything on my system for a few minutes until it stops stuttering. Thx in advance...