Placeshifter streaming problem

[chrysek]

Ok, I have a problem and I would like to find out solution for it. I did purchase Placeshifter to have fun with watching TV over the net. So I had cable service where my upstream did suck, I had like 40KB/sec transfer rates upstream so my video was choppy... Over the weekend I did upgrade to Verizon FiOS service where I have 30mbit downstream and 5mbit upstream, my upstream now I can reach speeds around 600 KB/sec. I though that this would improve my qideo quality and also would at least get rid of this choppy video stream.. Well it seems like sage Placeshifter does not work as I expected. It does take advantage of my line but it did adapt to it this much that if line is not that great it then just does try to pass data at the higher rate. Is there any way to limit stream? I mean lets say my line can pump over 600KB/sec, can I limit stream to take advantage only of 250KB/sec sreatm? or maybe even 500KB/sec and not so sage does try to max out the available bandwith and then choke on it?

I think sage should never maximize connection speed becasue it cant always keep it and in most cases it is a result of a choppy video even that it does take advantage of buffers... Please remember that at higher quality video buffer does run out quicker of line is not that great...

Thanks for suggestions.

Chris

[MrApollinax]

Just a quick question, if you are streaming locally on the same subnet do you have the same performance? How are you connected to the net when you hook into your Placeshifter server? WiFi? LAN? WLAN (EDVO)?

[chrysek]

no localy it works just fine since I have 10/100/1000 network, so I do nto see any problems with sreaming on a local network...

What I did notice though is that if I go to settings menu and I change streaming to manual and change it to 300kbps it seems like then sage is trying to stream at this rate and never is able to take advantage of my faster link to fill up my buffer. So no matter what speed I set it up the same results I get. What there should be is the video stream rate and then maximum stream rate setting where I could set it up to max and then sage could take advantage of the best available conenction but at the same time limit video quality to something that can actually play well...

Just my opinion on that.. and beleive me it sucks to pause my video every 10-15 seconds so that my buffer can fill up and be able to eatch it a bit longet, other wise I get second of video/audio, then it does stop, fills up buffer a little and does it again and again and again..

Chris

[Narflex]

Could you submit a bug report on this please? http://sagetv.com/bugs.html

[chrysek]

ok, I just did, just to add when I am downloaing video to my work computer usint remotelyanywhere file manager I am getting around 500k/s transter rates (that is ashowing up as around 4.5% in task manager of my local nic card. Now when I do start placeshifter video stream/buffer fill up etc it does drop down to around 420k/s. When I stop transfer of my remotelyanywhere files and only placeshifter video stream is running it only takes advantage of .5% of that NIC interface. While it could easily go up since nothing else is utilizing that connection.

Somehow placeshifter is not taking advantage of the full bandwith that is provided for it... must be some limitations of some kind...

Regards,

Chris

[reggie14]

Can you post a screenshot of the statistics window from the placeshifter? That will show how much bandwidth Sage is seeing, and at what bitrate it is encoding video.

Since you're able to download at full speed from remotelyanywhere, I would guess your workplace doesn't do any packet shaping. But, its still certainly possible. Have you asked anyone if they do anything like that?

[chrysek]

no, they do not do packet shaping, I've just asked them. Also for a moneht, maybe like 1 minute earlier today I was able to get video without stoppage... I guess somehow line quality did improve or something. But how does sage actually communicate? If remotelyanywhere can take advantage of the speed why wouldnt sage be able to do it either? Maybe the way its streaming? maybethat would need to be revisited? maybe there could va variations depending on a conenction to send bigger packets or something? yet again, I do not know much about how both sage and placeshifter is comunicating together but certainly in my opinion there is a way to improve that...

[reggie14]

I still don't quite understand what exactly is happening to you.

When you have it set to use Sage's dynamic streaming system, what speed does it choose? Open the statistics window (by right clicking on the title bar of the placeshifter client) and see what it says. I think target bandwidth is what the video/audio stream is being encoded at, and stream bandwidth the rate that you are recieving it.

Also, in the statistics window, look at the graphs shown. If they are very jagged, that might be an indication that your connection isn't very steady. The buffer size might not be big enough to make up for this, at the bitrate that you are probably streaming at. If Sage is trying to use all of your available bandwidth, the buffer is probably less than 5 seconds long.

Also, you said above that you tried using the placeshifter with a manual bitrate set to something lower. What happened? Was it the exact same effect? 10 seconds bursts? Did it work, but you simply weren't happy with the quality? What did you mean by it wouldn't fill your buffer? Recall that the buffer on a 300kBit stream seems to be about 25 seconds long.

Have you tried using the placeshifter on your LAN at home? By default, Sage will not transcode the video stream if the placeshifter client is on the same LAN at the server. So, use the manual setting to force it to transcode at something like 1000 kBit, or whatever bitrate you saw when you looked at the statistics window. If the same thing happens, then its definitely not a connection issue.

I'm starting to wonder if its not a connection issue at all, but a CPU issue. I have an Athlon XP 2400+ in my server, and transcoding is pretty rough on it. What processor do you have in your server?

[archie658]

Originally Posted by chrysek

Somehow placeshifter is not taking advantage of the full bandwith that is provided for it... must be some limitations of some kind...

I've done some testing and tuning to use PlaceShifter wireless (only 11MB/s) on a laptop (PAL settings by the way):

main_window_width=1024
main_window_height=576
enable_video_postprocessing=true
streaming_mode=fixed
fixed_encoding/video_resolution=CIF
fixed_encoding/key_frame_interval=10
fixed_encoding/use_b_frames=true
fixed_encoding/video_bitrate_kbps=750
fixed_encoding/fps=25
fixed_encoding/audio_bitrate_kbps=64

My laptop is pretty busy (Pentium M, 1.5 GHz), but things go wrong when the recorded stream is not "clean" (DVB) of when SageTV starts a recording on a second tuner. But my SageTV server is only a Pentium 4 1.6 GHz.

BTW my wireless router is outside my Linux firewall, so NATing/port forwarding is done to reach the SageTV server.

[reggie14]

Have you had any luck chrysek?

[chrysek]

Originally Posted by reggie14

Have you had any luck chrysek?

No, I did change the settings and no luck. Still have the exact same issue. I cant understand since my FiOS is 20mbit downstream and 5mbit upstream. So transferring back to work at 5mbit should work just great since at work we have 45mbit internet pipe...

I have to pause video to get buffer filled in and again do that when buffer does get empty...

[chrysek]

when I am using above settings I must say my streaming is slightly better than if I do it automatic way, first in automatic way it does choose better video quality which then buffer gets smalled because of the amount of data that is beeing placed in there.. so if I reduce it I get muchbetter results but still have to pause video so that the buffere can fill up and I can have like 10 or more seconds of video play..

Chris

[chrysek]

So, anyway this realy does suck big time. I am trying to watch 30 minute show since morning.. it seem slike I get around 20 seconds of video (max) then wait 30-35 seconds for buffer to fill and then again, over and over... this does suck big time.. I did not purchase placeshifter for that kind of streaming. Its so much easier just to connect to my server and just download this video which takes less than 30 minutes and I get full video mpeg quality....

can I return my placeshifter license? or will anyone try to look into this problem for me please? I realy need help in solving this issue. My PC at home has 3ghz processor and 1 gb of ram. I am running sage 5.0.1 at home. I have upstream connection of 5mbit. At work I have also 3ghz processor and 1gb of ram. I also have 45mbit pipe that is shared between other people but I know I can download at high speed...

Please help!!!!

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by chrysek

will anyone try to look into this problem for me please? I realy need help in solving this issue.

Contact SageTV directly. I think you said you submitted a bug report, but follow up w/tech support to see what they might suggest.

- Andy

[billvan]

I was having trouble with Streaming videos as are many people. I tried different settings in the PlaceShifter Client with no luck. Then, just for the heck of it I installed the Client on a different machine (XPpro). It worked GREAT. So then I went back to the original machine (Win98se). I updated to the latest DirectX, and WaLa, it works great now. I recommend considering updating your directx and see if that helps.

Bill

[chrysek]

Originally Posted by billvan

I was having trouble with Streaming videos as are many people. I tried different settings in the PlaceShifter Client with no luck. Then, just for the heck of it I installed the Client on a different machine (XPpro). It worked GREAT. So then I went back to the original machine (Win98se). I updated to the latest DirectX, and WaLa, it works great now. I recommend considering updating your directx and see if that helps.

Bill

I just did update my directx from MS, I think it did say something april 2006 so I guess now I am up to date with that.. I also installed sage client, but I think I wont be able to connect unless i open proper port to my home computer.. but anyway after starting up placeshifter it works exactly the same as before, I do not see a difference to be honest..

Thanks.

Chris

[chrysek]

Originally Posted by Opus4

Contact SageTV directly. I think you said you submitted a bug report, but follow up w/tech support to see what they might suggest.

- Andy

Thank you Andy, I will try to contact tech support. I do appreciate your help.

Chris

[billvan]

Originally Posted by chrysek

I just did update my directx from MS, I think it did say something april 2006 so I guess now I am up to date with that.. I also installed sage client, but I think I wont be able to connect unless i open proper port to my home computer.. but anyway after starting up placeshifter it works exactly the same as before, I do not see a difference to be honest..

Thanks.

Chris

Have you tried the PlaceShifter Client? It is far better then the SageClient software for streaming over the net. I tried the SageClient a while back but could never get it to work but PlaceShifter worked great once I updated the DirectX drivers.

The default port is 31099 but this can be changed in "Detailed Setup / Advanced Options".

Bill

[chrysek]

Originally Posted by billvan

Have you tried the PlaceShifter Client? It is far better then the SageClient software for streaming over the net. I tried the SageClient a while back but could never get it to work but PlaceShifter worked great once I updated the DirectX drivers.

The default port is 31099 but this can be changed in "Detailed Setup / Advanced Options".

Bill

I am only using placeshifter client, I do not use SageClient itself using remote connection ebcause it has no autjentication. I have sage client license that i was using in the past on my laptop but I was unable to upgrade it over to placeshifter license and that is why I had to actually purchase it.

Chris