HDTV Feature Requests

[Snuffy2]

I just did a rather major upgrade to my system, including adding a Plasma TV and an OTA HD Recorder (VBox USB). Additionally, we just added a MVP for watching in the bedroom.

With these upgrades, I've noticed a couple key features missing from Sage that could hopefully be considered for the next release. I guess some of it may be possible in Studio, but I have no idea.

1. A setting where you can make a Source (or specific channels, but source is just fine) only Record HDTV shows as specified by the TV Guide (basically hiding the SD shows in that source from shoing up, even in the guide). This would eliminate the SD recordings @ ~7gb/hr I'm getting because they're being recorded OTA instead of 3gb/hr through the SD cable inputs.

2. A setting in the Favorites that has 4 options (this option would only have any effect if the episode existed in both HD & SD in the Guide):
A. Record SD Episode Only
B. Record HD Episode Only
C. Record Both Formats
D. No preference
Reason for C: the MVP can't play HD data (as I'm sure other people have SD & HD setups off of one server), but I'd rather watch HD on the plasma, so being able to record both would allow us to watch it wherever we wanted.

Anyone else think these would be good? Anyway to currently achieve these with 5.0.4?

I've messed with encoder merit for the Recommendation 1, but it only worked marginally well.

Thanx

[Deadbolt]

Originally Posted by Snuffy2

I just did a rather major upgrade to my system, including adding a Plasma TV and an OTA HD Recorder (VBox USB). Additionally, we just added a MVP for watching in the bedroom.

With these upgrades, I've noticed a couple key features missing from Sage that could hopefully be considered for the next release. I guess some of it may be possible in Studio, but I have no idea.

1. A setting where you can make a Source (or specific channels, but source is just fine) only Record HDTV shows as specified by the TV Guide (basically hiding the SD shows in that source from shoing up, even in the guide). This would eliminate the SD recordings @ ~7gb/hr I'm getting because they're being recorded OTA instead of 3gb/hr through the SD cable inputs.

2. A setting in the Favorites that has 4 options (this option would only have any effect if the episode existed in both HD & SD in the Guide):
A. Record SD Episode Only
B. Record HD Episode Only
C. Record Both Formats
D. No preference
Reason for C: the MVP can't play HD data (as I'm sure other people have SD & HD setups off of one server), but I'd rather watch HD on the plasma, so being able to record both would allow us to watch it wherever we wanted.

Anyone else think these would be good? Anyway to currently achieve these with 5.0.4?

I've messed with encoder merit for the Recommendation 1, but it only worked marginally well.

Thanx

Will the server transcode the HD to SD if you try to watch an HD show on the MVP?

[Snuffy2]

Originally Posted by Deadbolt

Will the server transcode the HD to SD if you try to watch an HD show on the MVP?

It might, but I'd rather watch SD on an SDTV and HD on an HDTV. I'd also bet the transcoding involved would be ugly on an underpowered machine.

[jlabrue]

Originally Posted by Snuffy2

2. A setting in the Favorites that has 4 options (this option would only have any effect if the episode existed in both HD & SD in the Guide):
A. Record SD Episode Only
B. Record HD Episode Only
C. Record Both Formats
D. No preference
Reason for C: the MVP can't play HD data (as I'm sure other people have SD & HD setups off of one server), but I'd rather watch HD on the plasma, so being able to record both would allow us to watch it wherever we wanted.

I've messed with encoder merit for the Recommendation 1, but it only worked marginally well.

Thanx

This is Definitely something that should be added! I have desired this type of functionality myself for a long time but I really like you're ideas of implementation better than what I had thought of. That would be great! I have also had no luck with encoder merit. It always worked fine for SD stuff but won't work for me if I have both HD and SD in the same server.

Yes, it would definitely be a necessity to record BOTH HD and SD for MVP support. I cannot get it to transcode for my MVP so I sometimes settle on SD for full compatability. It would be great to have both. Jeff did post somewhere that if you set Sage to encode HD to a TS stream instead of the default Program Stream it would transcode for the MVP but I have not tested this and probably will not unless someone can suggest a good reason to do that.

[Deadbolt]

Originally Posted by jlabrue

This is Definitely something that should be added! I have desired this type of functionality myself for a long time but I really like you're ideas of implementation better than what I had thought of. That would be great! I have also had no luck with encoder merit. It always worked fine for SD stuff but won't work for me if I have both HD and SD in the same server.

Yes, it would definitely be a necessity to record BOTH HD and SD for MVP support. I cannot get it to transcode for my MVP so I sometimes settle on SD for full compatability. It would be great to have both. Jeff did post somewhere that if you set Sage to encode HD to a TS stream instead of the default Program Stream it would transcode for the MVP but I have not tested this and probably will not unless someone can suggest a good reason to do that.

Well I guess one good reason is that if it works, and you have a powerfull enough machine...then you don't have to settle on SD for compatibility. You can watch the show in HD on your HD set and still have full compatibility for you MVPs through transcoding.

[jlabrue]

Originally Posted by Deadbolt

Well I guess one good reason is that if it works, and you have a powerfull enough machine...then you don't have to settle on SD for compatibility. You can watch the show in HD on your HD set and still have full compatibility for you MVPs through transcoding.

Yes that is true but that is a lot of "ifs" and a LOT of horsepower on the user end. The options mentioned allow much more flexibility and practically zero additional horsepower from my current configuration.

I guess I would much rather have the "option" to choose how I want to view my TV rather than be forced into a position (transcoding, HW upgrades). If I wanted inflexibility I guess I would have stuck with Tivo or a commercial DVR like I have had for the last 6 or 7 years

The BEST option will be when Sage has an all-purpose HD extender that will work with an HD or SD monitor and I can put one on every TV. (Might as well dream when I can )

[Deadbolt]

Originally Posted by jlabrue

Yes that is true but that is a lot of "ifs" and a LOT of horsepower on the user end. The options mentioned allow much more flexibility and practically zero additional horsepower from my current configuration.

I guess I would much rather have the "option" to choose how I want to view my TV rather than be forced into a position (transcoding, HW upgrades). If I wanted inflexibility I guess I would have stuck with Tivo or a commercial DVR like I have had for the last 6 or 7 years

The BEST option will be when Sage has an all-purpose HD extender that will work with an HD or SD monitor and I can put one on every TV. (Might as well dream when I can )

Yup...HD extender is in my dreams too! I guess the tradeoff with the two options (transcoding vs. double recordings) is that you have to have more horsepower for transcoding vs. lots more drive space for double recordings. I guess you could also just recording everything SD...but that defeats the purspose of that sweet HD set.

[Snuffy2]

Was thinking a little more..... anyone have any clue if either of these would be possible to implement in Studio?

If someone said it could be done, I'd definately try.

I can program, just haven't done it in a little bit (opted to persue Medicine and let the Comp Sci degree goto waste).

I just don't know how powerful studio is.

Thanx

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by Snuffy2

anyone have any clue if either of these would be possible to implement in Studio?

Probbaly not w/o writing your own type of scheduler... the schedule is created completely in the core & the STV just gets to see the 'report' of what is going to be recorded. And, the core doesn't take HD vs. SD into account when it creates the schedule. Any customization attempting to change this would probably have to check the schedule for shows meeting your criteria, then search for HD/SD versions of the show and mark them as Manual Recordings to force both to be recorded. Removing a show from the schedule is probably a bit harder if you don't replace it with another airing of the same show.

I have no idea what SageTV's plans are in this regard, but I always say that suggestions are better sent via email to SageTV than just posted on the forum.

- Andy

[Jesse]

Hi,

Maybe I am misssing something, but would'nt just specifing one channel only when setting up favorites get you most of the way there? Obviously it would not be as nice as all the options you listed.

This is how we do it: Some shows are set up to record only from HD channels and others only from SD channels. We have a few shows set up as favorites twice, one to record from the HD channel and one from the SD channel. Not very elegant but it works.

HTH

Jesse

[Snuffy2]

Originally Posted by Jesse

Hi,

Maybe I am misssing something, but would'nt just specifing one channel only when setting up favorites get you most of the way there? Obviously it would not be as nice as all the options you listed.

This is how we do it: Some shows are set up to record only from HD channels and others only from SD channels. We have a few shows set up as favorites twice, one to record from the HD channel and one from the SD channel. Not very elegant but it works.

HTH

Jesse

I had tried that before and I couldn't get that to work as you described.

I set up 2 favorites for, lets just say, American Idol. 1 on the HD channel and one on the SD Channel. It would only record one or the other for me. I'd assume because they both had the same ShowID it didn't see the need to record both.

I'll give it a try again in a week or so after I move, but I had tried that before.

Thanx

[jlabrue]

Originally Posted by Snuffy2

I had tried that before and I couldn't get that to work as you described.

I set up 2 favorites for, lets just say, American Idol. 1 on the HD channel and one on the SD Channel. It would only record one or the other for me. I'd assume because they both had the same ShowID it didn't see the need to record both.

I'll give it a try again in a week or so after I move, but I had tried that before.

Thanx

I did the same thing and that is the same result I got as well. I would lock a HD favorite to a channel and an SD favorite to another. Sage would record both episodes but when they would complete it was intelligent enough to know that they were the same show and it only needed to keep one and got rid of the other.

As was stated earlier it is far from an eligent solution or for that matter a very useful one since there a re so many variables just waiting to mess something up As we all know anytime you try and outsmart an app and make it do a trick is is not completely designed for it has as way of outsmarting itself!

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by jlabrue

I did the same thing and that is the same result I got as well. I would lock a HD favorite to a channel and an SD favorite to another. Sage would record both episodes but when they would complete it was intelligent enough to know that they were the same show and it only needed to keep one and got rid of the other.

Since some people say that dual Favorites does work for them, it makes me wonder what settings might be different between the systems. If not using Intelligent Recordings, see if it makes a difference to go to Detailed Setup -> Customize & turn off "Delete Live TV files when not using Intelligent Recording".

- Andy

[Deadbolt]

Originally Posted by Deadbolt

Will the server transcode the HD to SD if you try to watch an HD show on the MVP?

Has anyone done this? I know it would take plenty of horsepower...what is your system and how successful have you been?

I thought I read that if you record HD as .PS it would transcode? Can all the cards record as .PS?

Thanks!

[chrisc16]

Originally Posted by Deadbolt

Has anyone done this? I know it would take plenty of horsepower...what is your system and how successful have you been?

I thought I read that if you record HD as .PS it would transcode? Can all the cards record as .PS?

Thanks!

I transcode .ts files to my MVPs - but it is only partially successful. If nothing else is running, and I have rebooted fairly recently, Sage will transcode 1080i and SD .ts files flawlessly. However, I just tried this morning, and it was transcoding correctly, but I was getting regular audio skips every 5 seconds. I can't reboot right now to test though. Also, FWIW, I have several recordings that are PS files (this is changeable via a line in the Sage ini file) and these will NOT transcode to my MVPs.

My server is an AMD X2 3800 dual core with 2GB RAM. These files were recorded with an Avermedia A180.

[jlabrue]

Originally Posted by chrisc16

I transcode .ts files to my MVPs - but it is only partially successful. If nothing else is running, and I have rebooted fairly recently, Sage will transcode 1080i and SD .ts files flawlessly. However, I just tried this morning, and it was transcoding correctly, but I was getting regular audio skips every 5 seconds. I can't reboot right now to test though. Also, FWIW, I have several recordings that are PS files (this is changeable via a line in the Sage ini file) and these will NOT transcode to my MVPs.

My server is an AMD X2 3800 dual core with 2GB RAM. These files were recorded with an Avermedia A180.

I concur. I had the exact same experience with .ts vs .ps files and MVP transcoding. I used a Vbox. Transcoding HD files is such a processor intensive task that it is going to have some issues on just about every system. I have a AMD 64 2800 and 1GB memory and I would consider that at least a mid to upper mid range system. It will transcode SD for placeshifting and record 2 HD streams and 2 SD streams over the network and ALL at the same time with zero problems. However it always chokes at some point when even trying to transcode HD. I do not consider this to be a problem of SageTV's at all it is just the nature of the task it is trying to perform.

[jlabrue]

Originally Posted by Opus4

Since some people say that dual Favorites does work for them, it makes me wonder what settings might be different between the systems. If not using Intelligent Recordings, see if it makes a difference to go to Detailed Setup -> Customize & turn off "Delete Live TV files when not using Intelligent Recording".

- Andy

I did not try that Andy but I could give it a go. It may work in retaining the file. Another problem I had with doing this is that the scheduler would not schedule the two programs at the same time unless I set up a static recording (not very practical) If I left both as favorites, it would pick one to record (this is what I would expect) and not record the other since they are the same show.

I definitely agree with your earlier post about sending this request through official channels. I have seen this issue or a derivitive of it pop up on many other occasions.