AVSForum thread about PC PVRs - let your opinion about SageTV be known

[psxjunky]

If you like SageTV (or if you don't), it will be good to express your feelings about it in the following AVSForum thread comparing various PC based PVR solutions.

PVR Software for HTPC : SageTV, SnapStream, MythTV, WinXP MCE, myHTPC, Freevo etc.

Currently SageTV is leading the poll with 54.22% of the votes (SageTV 45 vs SnapStream 27).

There is also official representation from SnapStream in this thread (rkuo - who is the lead developer of SnapStream has replied a couple times), so it may be nice for Jeff or Dan to post in that thread to make some official statements and to provide authentic clarifications to some of the questions in that thread.

With 167 replies and 5505 views so far (as of 11/16/03 7:50pm PST), this thread is getting a lot of attention from HTPC users, especially people interested in trying out a new PVR solution.

[dkardatzke]

I've looked at that thread but it's gotten totally off the subject with the Windows vs. Linux arguement. If you have specific questions that need to be answered let me know here.

Thanks.

[psxjunky]

Hi Dan,

Yes, I agree the thread was diverted for a while on Windows vs. Linux battle ... but I am glad that it has finally come back on track now and discussing what the thread is really about.

In general, I think official representation in a thread like this carries a lot of importance ... especially it helps boost the customer loyalty since it shows that the company cares enough for its customers to come and personally answer questions. Even if it is the same answer that someone else may have already provided, it carries a lot more weight when coming from official representation.

More specifically, this particular post seems to have some inaccurate information that can give a wrong impression about the true capabilities of SageTV ... so it may be good to provide some clarification.

More than anything else, since I started that thread and noticed official representation from SnapStream, I wanted to let you guys know about it so you get a chance to reply if necessary.

Thanks !

[beyond]

no thread seems to stay on track these days..

[Cayars]

Originally posted by psxjunky
Hi Dan,

Yes, I agree the thread was diverted for a while on Windows vs. Linux battle ... but I am glad that it has finally come back on track now and discussing what the thread is really about.

In general, I think official representation in a thread like this carries a lot of importance ... especially it helps boost the customer loyalty since it shows that the company cares enough for its customers to come and personally answer questions. Even if it is the same answer that someone else may have already provided, it carries a lot more weight when coming from official representation.

More specifically, this particular post seems to have some inaccurate information that can give a wrong impression about the true capabilities of SageTV ... so it may be good to provide some clarification.

More than anything else, since I started that thread and noticed official representation from SnapStream, I wanted to let you guys know about it so you get a chance to reply if necessary.

Thanks !

Wow, that was my post you're talking about. It was not my intention at all to post inaccurate information. That is why I also said to respond if any of the information is not accurate and I'd fix it. Which I have done for both Sage and Snapstream. I re-read my post a few times before posting it and still got a few backward (Yes in SS when it should have been Sage) and vice versa.

I do own both SS and all three pieces of Sage Software. I really tried to not show any bias for or against any particular peice of software. Personally, I like features of both software. Each has it's own strengths and week points. There are only a few items that would "demand" a user to choose one software over the other and these items are well known (i.e. Multi-tuner, web streaming, etc).

Every time a new user asks "SageTV or Snapstream" it seems the same very high level items are posted. As we all know there is more to it then just the high-level features. I was simply trying to give a comparison of features that many people haven't thought of or didn't know about.

I have went back and updated the information just as I said I would (and will continue to do so). I have no problem stating that I am more familar with SS then I am with SageTV as you could have probably told if you read the "message in question" before I edited it. It is meant to be as fare as possible with no bias (if possible). Sort of "Just the Facts". If you still see anything that is wrong or leads one to assume something that isn't correct PM here on this board (if you don't have an AVSForum account) and I'll make sure the information is updated accordingly.

BTW, I didn't vote on the AVSForum because I like features from both pieces of software and it would be a tough call for me to pick one over the other. I run two boxes myself (SS was the first and now the 2nd runs SageTV).

Carlo

[psxjunky]

Hi Carlo,

Yes, it was your message I referred to, but honesly I never intended this to mean that you intentionally posted inaccurate information. I myself have not used either SageTV or SnapStream yet (though I have been reading about both of these a lot, and based on my research so far I have decided to go with SageTV), so I myself am not clear about correct answer to some of the details you mentioned in your post.

You have done an admirable job of comparing the two side by side in great detail, and I applaud your effort. However, at the same time I wanted readers of that post to get as accurate information as possible ... which is one of the primary reasons I came to the "source" and asked either Dan or Jeff to clarify the doubts.

Just like you, I am also trying to remain as unbiased as possible and collect as much information as possible about different PVR solutions and present it to everyone that is considering a PC based PVR solution. None of us are immune to making mistakes ... I make mistakes myself often. So by all means please don't think I was thinking your mistakes to be intentional.

I am looking forward to that spreadsheet from you and will incorporate the correct information in my original post once I have it.

Thanks once again and hope you don't misunderstand me !

[Cayars]

Nah, no problem at all. I was just updating the spreadsheet for you right now. I was just checking in here and at the AVSForum to see if anyone had any corrections before I sent it to you.

If you have any specific questions about the SageTV software you came to right place. You can always start a new thread specifically for your questions. Nothing like getting answers from the people who use the software the most.

Carlo

[jmeeks]

Carlo, you indicated that when you switch back and forth between shows in SageTV that they don't start where you left off. Am I reading your other post correctly?

It has always been SageTV's behavior to resume where it was left for that particular if the show hadn't been been played to it's end.

[stanger89]

You know I've been using Sage for months and never realized it saved the position of shows other than the last one you were watching, but I generally don't leave multiple shows partialy unfinised, makes me feel kind of silly as much as I use Sage and all.

Carlo, that was a good list.

psxjunky, glad to see you chose Sage, I was kind of curious which you chose after you didn't say in the AVS Thread, I'm sure you'll be happy with it, I know I am.

[stanger89]

Dan or Jeff,

With regard to the position memory, is there any way to have sage remember it's position in a ripped DVD in the library? I've got a lot of shows-on-dvd and it would be great if I could watch and episode one day, and the next time I go back pick up where I left off. Sage remembers where you were if you don't play anything else.

Just curious, thanks

Chad

ps. any chance of letting 2.0 loose before Thanksgiving, I'd love to play with it over break. Anyway keep up the good work.

[jmeeks]

You know I just checked this again, and it appears that there may be a bug with respect to if the show has it's watched flag on or off for this feature to work properly going to multiple shows and all.

If the show has been previously watched and you shift to multiple shows before going back to it, it appears the show starts at the beginning instead of where you left off.

Maybe Jeff can take a look at this.

[Cayars]

Originally posted by jmeeks
You know I just checked this again, and it appears that there may be a bug with respect to if the show has it's watched flag on or off for this feature to work properly going to multiple shows and all.

If the show has been previously watched and you shift to multiple shows before going back to it, it appears the show starts at the beginning instead of where you left off.

Maybe Jeff can take a look at this.

Thanks Jmeeks, I got a lot of feedback on this one. I tried and tried again and it always starts at the beginning of the file for me in the mutliple shows. I thought I was losing my mind

[Cayars]

As I've mentioned previously, I run two PVR machines. One runs SnapStream (PVR-250 & AIW) and the other runs SageTV (pvr-250 & USB2-PVR).

While SS does have a rather nice GUI I would really love to standardize on one system. At present this could only be done by SageTV because of my multi-tuner requirements (AIW doesn't matter).

Right now I just can't bring myself to replace SnapStream because of a couple "deal-breakers". Maybe, I'm doing something wrong or I could change my setup. if anyone has any ideas please let me know.

The first deal-breaker is what is mentioned in the couple messages right above this one concerning multi-show viewing and the resume feature.

The second deal breaker for me is the way Sage handles timeshifting. I just don't like the fact that it saves shows "I" didn't tell it to record. This clutters up my show list and DOES NOT pass the WAF. I've got close to 2 terabytes of storage on the Sage machine and over 4 terabytes of video storage on my network. My list is plenty bad enough without having shows I didn't request there. I've left SageTV tuned to HBO overnight a couple days and have a few stripper and real sex shows in my library. The wife found them before me and let's just say it didn't have a good outcome

So my question is: Will this functionality every be changed or is there a way to turn this "feature" off. It would be cool for it to record the show like it presently does while it is being aired but then delete the file at the end of the episode if a person doesn't hit the record button on the remote to tell it to "record" or keep the file.

The third big issue I have is the most tolerable of the three. I also believe there is something wrong on my notebook (client) and I'll be re-installing to see if this fixes the problem. The problem is that the client doesn't allow me to delete, move, etc files. I can only view them. The reason this is a killer for me is that I don't have enough quality time to take over the SageTV machine and do routine work on it (kill the files I didn't want ) and manage my library (does take a while).

Any ideas or comments are more then welcome.

Thanks,
Carlo

[jmeeks]

The best solution to handle your issue with recording while leaving SageTV on is to always put it in sleep mode when you are not actively watching.

Your Favorites and Manually Scheduled recording will only be recorded then.

The other solution which would not eliminate your specific problem, because you do have so much storage, would be to limit the recording directory space to a portion of your total and move the shows you want to keep to a library directory.

[Cayars]

Originally posted by jmeeks
The best solution to handle your issue with recording while leaving SageTV on is to always put it in sleep mode when you are not actively watching.

Your Favorites and Manually Scheduled recording will only be recorded then.

The other solution which would not eliminate your specific problem, because you do have so much storage, would be to limit the recording directory space to a portion of your total and move the shows you want to keep to a library directory.

Bingo: This is what I've been doing. It's not optimal but it does work. This is the reason I said #3 wasn't "as" important as the other 2.

Thanks for your input on this. I hope somebody has a good work-around for the other 2 also.

Thanks,
Carlo

[mlbdude]

The first item is how it works. If you watch a show to the end (or set it to watched) Sage is going to treat it as if you have already seen it and not save your position. Otherwise it remembers the position of the show for every file. I like how this works. I just wish there was a one button way to get back to the beginning of a show.

The second probably will not change since this is a great advantage of how Sage works - always lets you go back to what you were watching. However, I think with Sage 2.0 there will be ways to filter these shows out of your normal guide.

[msm]

Not sure if this will help but I'm sure there used to be a setting in the properties file that hid all half recorded programs, those that had been completely watched and those that were recorded through normal viewing of TV from the Sage recordings list. I'm at work at the moment so i can't tell you if that is still there...

Cheers,

Matt

[Cayars]

If this setting if still active it would be a big help.

Carlo

[falchulk]

Cayars, read the sage.properties file it says something like cleanup partial recordings or something.

[mlbdude]

I think that only works for items that are not recode fully. So, I don't think it will hid watched shows or shows recorded from start to finish while watching live TV.