Conficts, when there shouldn't be?

[crarbo1]

Hello,
I'm having a bit of a problem. I have 3 recordings set for tonight. A manual recording of a football game in 3 hours, and two shows for the wife that are set are Favorites/Series. The football game is on a different channel but the wifes programs are on a different channel but back to back. All 3 of these programs are analog channels. I have two Hauppauge PVR-500's that give me the ability to record 4 analog channels at one time. I also have one HDHomerun that gives me the ability to record 2 clear QAM channels. I have just tested to make sure that I can record on all 6 channels at once, and I can. So, I don't know why I have a recording conflict for just 3 channels. Any ideas? I do have SageMC but I don't think it is related to that. I think it may have to do with record order setting but I have no idea where to find or change something like that. Please help.

On a side note. In my Source Wizard Summary it has my 6 tuners listed the folllowing way:
1. Hauppauge WinTV PVR PCI II Capture #4 TV Tuner: Comcast - Harrisonburg
2. Hauppauge WinTV PVR PCI II Capture #3 TV Tuner: Comcast - Harrisonburg
3. Hauppauge WinTV PVR PCI II Capture TV Tuner: Comcast - Harrisonburg
4. Silicondust HDHomeRun Tunner Device ID-0 Digital Tuner - Comcast Digital - Harrisonburg
5. Silicondust HDHomeRun Tunner Device ID-1 Digital Tuner - Comcast Digital - Harrisonburg
6. Hauppauge WinTV PVR PCI II Capture #2 TV Tuner: Comcast - Harrisonburg

Why were they added in this order? I did the Hauppauge's first and then did the HDHomeRun's last but it came up in this order. Could this be part of the problem?

Please help me as soon as possible.

Thanks,
Chuck

[Conejo]

When you select the RECORDING CONFLICTS, what programs are in conflict?

[crarbo1]

It says the conflicts are with the two shows that are my wifes favorites. My wifes shows, show that the both will use tuner #1. I can't tell what channel it is actually trying to use for my football game but I'm guessing it is trying to use tuner #1 and that is why there is the conflict. Just guessing though.

Thanks for the reply,
Chuck

Originally Posted by Conejo

When you select the RECORDING CONFLICTS, what programs are in conflict?

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by crarbo1

I do have SageMC but I don't think it is related to that.

Until you revert to the default STV, anything could be SageMC related; there are too many variables involved. SageMC handles conflicts differently & handles settings differently (that's why there is a sticky about it here & in the SageMC forum), thus check your conflicts in the default STV and change your settings in the default STV.

Check your results in the default STV before posting in this section of the forum or your posts may be moved.

That said, there are settings in the default STV that can affect scheduling: there is an option to remove padding on back to back Favorites on the same channel & there is an option to enforce recording quality settings for Favs.

There is also a parallel schedule view that can help you get a better picture of the schedule and the conflict system shows what shows are in conflict in a grid type of view.

- Andy

[crarbo1]

I should have stated in my original post that I did try the default STV as well and have same issue in the default. That is why I said I didn't think it was SageMC.

I don't understand how removing padding on back to back favorites or enforce recording quality settings for favorites could be causing my issues but they are both set to Yes.

I just looked at the parallel schedule view but the manual recording of my football game doesn't show up at all but both of my wifes favorites do. If there is something else I need to do please direct me and I will check it.

Thanks,
Chuck

Originally Posted by Opus4

Until you revert to the default STV, anything could be SageMC related; there are too many variables involved. SageMC handles conflicts differently & handles settings differently, thus check your conflicts in the default STV and change your settings in the default STV.

Check your results in the default STV before posting in this section of the forum or your posts may be moved.

That said, there are settings in the default STV that can affect scheduling: there is an option to remove padding on back to back Favorites on the same channel & there is an option to enforce recording quality settings for Favs.

There is also a parallel schedule view that can help you get a better picture of the schedule and the conflict system shows what shows are in conflict in a grid type of view.

- Andy

[Conejo]

How did you 'verify' that all tuners were available? Did you 'schedule' six different recordings for the same time?

Sage *sometimes* places capture devices in the dog house, usually because the device wasn't ready when SageTV launched and initialized settings.
You can check for this by exiting SageTV and viewing the sage.properties file and look for your tuners on this line:

mmc/ignore_encoders=NVIDIA DualTV YUV Capture|Realtek AC97 Audio|NVIDIA DualTV YUV Capture 2|

Your active tuners should not be in the list

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by crarbo1

I should have stated in my original post that I did try the default STV as well and have same issue in the default. That is why I said I didn't think it was SageMC.

I don't understand how removing padding on back to back favorites or enforce recording quality settings for favorites could be causing my issues but they are both set to Yes.

Are you sure you reverted to the default STV? You have to do it manually & load SageTV3.xml

SageMC comes with a customized default STV that is obsolete.

The enforce quality setting should be defaulting to false now because the property name changed & will only be used correctly in the v6.4 default STV. Unless you manually set it back to true, it should have been false. (Unless you aren't using v6.4...?)

I just looked at the parallel schedule view but the manual recording of my football game doesn't show up at all but both of my wifes favorites do. If there is something else I need to do please direct me and I will check it.

Make sure manual recordings aren't filtered out.

The parallel schedule view should show a column for each tuner. How many columns are there? (You may need to scroll left/right to see everything.)

Check out the conflict screen & see what is scheduled around the conflict(s).

- Andy

[crarbo1]

I didn't really schedule 6 different recordings. I went to the guide and selected the record button for 4 different analog channels and did the same thing for 2 different digital channels. I recorded them for about 10 minutes and then watched them to make sure they recorded. They did. I would think that is would verify that all 6 tuners are recognized and works correctly.
I'm not sure what you want me to try but I will look at mcy sage.properties file.

Thanks,
Chuck

Originally Posted by Conejo

How did you 'verify' that all tuners were available? Did you 'schedule' six different recordings for the same time?

Sage *sometimes* places capture devices in the dog house, usually because the device wasn't ready when SageTV launched and initialized settings.
You can check for this by exiting SageTV and viewing the sage.properties file and look for your tuners on this line:

mmc/ignore_encoders=NVIDIA DualTV YUV Capture|Realtek AC97 Audio|NVIDIA DualTV YUV Capture 2|

Your active tuners should not be in the list

[crarbo1]

I'm almost certain that I loaded the default STV (SageTV3.xml) correctly. I have made all configuration changes in that screen always and then loaded the SageMC STV after the changes. I am using the latest version of SageTV downloaded last weekend.
Should I set enforce quality setting to "No" instead of "Yes", if so, what does this do? I have not manually set anything up in the files. All changes has been done from the user interface.

Manual recordings was not filtered out.

There is a column for each of my 6 tuners in that view.

When I went to the recording conflicts icon and selected the program that is in conflict it did show both channels now. I have attached a screenshot. This should not happen since I have 4 analog tuners and only 2 programs are needed at any given time.

Thanks for the replies,
Chuck

Originally Posted by Opus4

Are you sure you reverted to the default STV? You have to do it manually & load SageTV3.xml

SageMC comes with a customized default STV that is obsolete.

The enforce quality setting should be defaulting to false now because the property name changed & will only be used correctly in the v6.4 default STV. Unless you manually set it back to true, it should have been false. (Unless you aren't using v6.4...?)

Make sure manual recordings aren't filtered out.

The parallel schedule view should show a column for each tuner. How many columns are there? (You may need to scroll left/right to see everything.)

Check out the conflict screen & see what is scheduled around the conflict(s).

- Andy

[Conejo]

There are TWO ways to check the tuners...
Scheduling simultaneous recordings OR manual recordings . Since the four simultaneous manual recordings worked then it's not a tuner issue.

Something is wonky in the scheduler...

How MANY tuners show up on the screen when you select PARALLEL in the schedule view using SageTV3.xml?
EDIT: cross posted, I see you answered this question.

[crarbo1]

I think I have answered that question when I replied to Opus4. All 6 do show up.

Thanks,
Chuck

Originally Posted by Conejo

How MANY tuners show up on the screen when you select PARALLEL in the schedule view using SageTV3.xml?

[Conejo]

Your programs should *at most* utilize three tuners simultaneously.

I might suspect corrupt files in your SageTV/SageTV directory, or a corrupt wiz.bin file. There's only one way to test this theory...

[crarbo1]

I would agree to this if I set remove padding on back to back favorites on the same channel to No but I have it set to yes and if I understand this feature correctly, that should mean that it doesn't need 2 tuners.

Originally Posted by Conejo

Your programs should *at most* utilize three tuners simultaneously.

Don't tell me I need to uninstall and reinstall everything What is the best way to do that and make sure no settings are retained?

Thanks,
Chuck

Originally Posted by Conejo

I might suspect corrupt files in your SageTV/SageTV directory, or a corrupt wiz.bin file. There's only one way to test this theory...

[Conejo]

You can do a 'quick' test by:

- Shut down SageTV (or SageTV Service, if running)
- BACKUP or otherwise make copies of your Sage.properties and wiz.bin files.
- Rename the Program Files/SageTV directory to SageTV_TEMP
- Run the SageTV installer (this will create a fresh install of SageTV, no sched's or prior recordings)
- ADD just your FOUR analog tuners
- Schedule your three shows, see if the conflict still exists.

If this works OK, EXIT SageTV
- Move a copy of you previous wiz.bin into the new SageTV/SageTV directory. (This file contains schedules and pointers to prior recordings)
- Check for conflict

If this works OK, then the wiz.bin is probably OK and the problems was with the SageTV files. At this point you'll need to repeat all your setup process... recording directories, other tuners... you know the drill.

[crarbo1]

I'm not sure if I can do this tonight but if I can I will try.

Thanks,
Chuck

Originally Posted by Conejo

You can do a 'quick' test by:

- Shut down SageTV (or SageTV Service, if running)
- BACKUP or otherwise make copies of your Sage.properties and wiz.bin files.
- Rename the Program Files/SageTV directory to SageTV_TEMP
- Run the SageTV installer (this will create a fresh install of SageTV, no sched's or prior recordings)
- ADD just your FOUR analog tuners
- Schedule your three shows, see if the conflict still exists.

If this works OK, EXIT SageTV
- Move a copy of you previous wiz.bin into the new SageTV/SageTV directory. (This file contains schedules and pointers to prior recordings)
- Check for conflict

If this works OK, then the wiz.bin is probably OK and the problems was with the SageTV files. At this point you'll need to repeat all your setup process... recording directories, other tuners... you know the drill.

[crarbo1]

That was the problem. I followed your procedures and it worked fine. I overwrote the wiz.bin file and everything stayed and the confict was not present. Not sure how/why it got corrupted but does that happen often?

Thanks for all that helped,
Chuck

Originally Posted by Conejo

You can do a 'quick' test by:

- Shut down SageTV (or SageTV Service, if running)
- BACKUP or otherwise make copies of your Sage.properties and wiz.bin files.
- Rename the Program Files/SageTV directory to SageTV_TEMP
- Run the SageTV installer (this will create a fresh install of SageTV, no sched's or prior recordings)
- ADD just your FOUR analog tuners
- Schedule your three shows, see if the conflict still exists.

If this works OK, EXIT SageTV
- Move a copy of you previous wiz.bin into the new SageTV/SageTV directory. (This file contains schedules and pointers to prior recordings)
- Check for conflict

If this works OK, then the wiz.bin is probably OK and the problems was with the SageTV files. At this point you'll need to repeat all your setup process... recording directories, other tuners... you know the drill.

[Conejo]

I have no idea why your system had that issue. Replacing the application space was a drastic but ultimately quicker solution than doing a weeklong diagnostic that may have lead to the same requirement.

No, this isn't a frequent occurrence but corrupt files can occur when a dependency crashes SageTV or the Operating System while a file change is taking place.

Some people take these events as an omen to frequently back up critical files to make recovery, like the one you just did, possible.

[Opus4]

Now that I'm back in, I see you've resolved it. I don't think you really needed to reconfigure everything, but it looks like that cleared it.

Originally Posted by crarbo1

Should I set enforce quality setting to "No" instead of "Yes", if so, what does this do?

The dialog shown when you select the option pretty much explains it.

The default setting is "No" and I would leave it that way.

When set to "Yes", it means that when a Fav or Manual Recording has a recording quality setting, that recording cannot be assigned to a tuner where the quality is not available.

I had a strange conflict recently & it all came down to this setting -- there were tuners available for use, but they couldn't use the Favorite's quality setting.

I'm not sure how you would have gotten a quality setting on your system that those tuners wouldn't work with, but IF this had anything to do with your issue, then it could have to do with SageMC's process of setting up a Manual Recording, if you were using SageMC when you set up the recording.

- Andy

[crarbo1]

It wasn't too big of a deal to do this but I would rather not have to do it in the future. I'm glad to hear that this doesn't happen often.

Thanks for your help,
Chuck

Originally Posted by Conejo

I have no idea why your system had that issue. Replacing the application space was a drastic but ultimately quicker solution than doing a weeklong diagnostic that may have lead to the same requirement.

No, this isn't a frequent occurrence but corrupt files can occur when a dependency crashes SageTV or the Operating System while a file change is taking place.

Some people take these events as an omen to frequently back up critical files to make recovery, like the one you just did, possible.

[crarbo1]

I'm sure I didn't but it was probably the fastest and since I had a recording coming up soon, I just decided to go that direction.
I had setup the quality of the default to what I wanted as well as the defaults on each tuner to be the same. So, it shouldn't have been that but I guess now after I understand it better, I will set it to No so it won't possible mess things up.

Thanks for your help,
Chuck

Originally Posted by Opus4

Now that I'm back in, I see you've resolved it. I don't think you really needed to reconfigure everything, but it looks like that cleared it.

The dialog shown when you select the option pretty much explains it.

The default setting is "No" and I would leave it that way.

When set to "Yes", it means that when a Fav or Manual Recording has a recording quality setting, that recording cannot be assigned to a tuner where the quality is not available.

I had a strange conflict recently & it all came down to this setting -- there were tuners available for use, but they couldn't use the Favorite's quality setting.

I'm not sure how you would have gotten a quality setting on your system that those tuners wouldn't work with, but IF this had anything to do with your issue, then it could have to do with SageMC's process of setting up a Manual Recording, if you were using SageMC when you set up the recording.

- Andy