Will Dynamic Customisable Main Menu import be updated for v7?

[Fuzzy]

Honestly, I think 'most' people who are wanting to rearrange their menu's, would find that bit of Studio rather simple.

[wado1971]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

Yeah, but what features do you need? The dynamic main menu did quite a bit more than most people used. Is it the ability to move menu items around? Is it the calling of external apps? Is it the StaticContexts allowing menu's to jump to folder-filtered views (which, BTW, was in SageMC only)?

For me it's the ability to link a specific folder view to the main menu; which btw was available in the original default DM by neilm. So when is your release date Fuzzy?

[Tiki]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

Yeah, but what features do you need? The dynamic main menu did quite a bit more than most people used. Is it the ability to move menu items around? Is it the calling of external apps? Is it the StaticContexts allowing menu's to jump to folder-filtered views (which, BTW, was in SageMC only)?

Yes, yes, and yes. I make use of all 3 of these (and I don't use sagemc). My iMovies plugin for v6 of sage also used the static context calls.

[dinki]

Waiting for the external program launch myself. I use it to call a program that turns off the lights when I press the power button.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by dinki

Waiting for the external program launch myself. I use it to call a program that turns off the lights when I press the power button.

That was kind of my point.. if it's a single simple thing like that, that's the perfect task to utilize to learn studio with. It would probably take about 3 lines in studio to do what you are wanting.

[RetroBox]

I've been following this thread attentively because, as a good majority of SageMC users in v6, I am anxiously awaiting for customizable menus to surface for v7.

Fuzzy makes a good point about getting into Studio and helping yourself. I have fumbled around in it to see if I could figure out how it worked and had mixed results. After all, I do not have a strong programming background an am just trying to learn Java. It certainly seems a little daunting to get into Studio and actually do something productive that will actually work and not cause a re-install. Other than the thick Studio guide, what resource(s) would you recommend for accomplishing task-oriented customizations in Sage?

[tmiranda]

Originally Posted by RetroBox

Other than the thick Studio guide, what resource(s) would you recommend for accomplishing task-oriented customizations in Sage?

When I was learning Studio I found the best way to learn how to do something was to look at the code in the default STV to see how it works. Think about what you want to do, then think of an example in the default STV that more or less does what you want to do, then go see how the default STV does it. Most times you can find something in the default STV close to what you want to achieve and use that as a guideline.

Second, have a goal in mind. Pick a small project that you find interesting and then go figure out how to do it. Reading manuals is boring but trying to solve a real problem is fun and challenging.

If you have questions post them in the Studio section of the forum. Most people are very helpful and will give good advice.

Tom

[disco340]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

That was kind of my point.. if it's a single simple thing like that, that's the perfect task to utilize to learn studio with. It would probably take about 3 lines in studio to do what you are wanting.

Can you create filter's to link to specific folders in Studio as well?

[Fuzzy]

Anything can be done in studio. If dynamic menus were to be created, they would be done in studio. (the menu.xml files from nielm's menu import were basically parsed into studio widgets). You could just create the widgets.

[dinki]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

That was kind of my point.. if it's a single simple thing like that, that's the perfect task to utilize to learn studio with. It would probably take about 3 lines in studio to do what you are wanting.

Thanks for the reply. I've looked into using studio before but amongst other things, I've run into logistical problems even pulling up the interface (headless server and no SageTV client licenses). On top of that, I was pretty bewildered with the documentation.

While I do realize what I'm requesting could be seen as very trivial, it's kind of like saying 'Oh, you want to open that safe? It's as easy as turning the dial to three numbers and then pulling on the handle'. Without doing a lot of investigation and research my goal remains elusive. I just don't have the free time that I had before the kids came along. Besides, I thought I was replying to the request for more information on what people were looking for in dynamic menus.

Thanks to all that are looking into making an easy solution for folks like me. Hopefully it'll be as easy as with SageMC.

[RetroBox]

Originally Posted by tmiranda

When I was learning Studio I found the best way to learn how to do something was to look at the code in the default STV to see how it works. Think about what you want to do, then think of an example in the default STV that more or less does what you want to do, then go see how the default STV does it. Most times you can find something in the default STV close to what you want to achieve and use that as a guideline.

That is actually a really great suggestion. I did look behind the scenes of SageMC and that was really intimidating - taking cues from the default STV sounds like the best approach. Perhaps this is the inspiration I needed to define a small project and actually do it. Thanks!

[tmiranda]

Originally Posted by RetroBox

That is actually a really great suggestion. I did look behind the scenes of SageMC and that was really intimidating - taking cues from the default STV sounds like the best approach. Perhaps this is the inspiration I needed to define a small project and actually do it. Thanks!

SageMC is really great but it relies on a lot of custom code that is not available in the default STV or in Studio. That will only serve to confuse you if you are just starting in Studio. Once you do get more comfortable with Studio you can take a look at SageMC and see alternative ways of implementing functionality.

I really think the key is to have a project in mind and then figure out how to "get er done'. Pick something small to start so you are not overwhelmed.

Good luck.

Tom

[pjpjpjpj]

I don't think this thread should detour into a "you can do it yourself" discussion (that probably should be a thread in the Studio forum), but since it sorta has...

I should start by saying that I have absolutely no background in any programming... I don't know anything about XML, java, or any of that. I'm an engineer by trade. I'm not afraid of computers, and if given a decent enough explanation, I'll try things. But, being an engineer, I need it to be pretty step-by-step. For example, if any of you ever installed the old v6 MovieTimes plugin without using nielm's DCM, and did it manually with Studio, I thought that the instruction PDF for that was fantastic. It really walked you through every step.

Back to the topic, I tried doing a little Studio work in v6 (stock STV). I found it very confusing. I read the Sage Studio manual and some of it seemed to make sense, but I found that it started out very well ("for dummies") and then seemed to slide into a format where you had to know some stuff already in order to understand what it was saying. I think that's the hardest part of writing a technical manual when you fully understand something - often you forget that, with regards to certain things you are talking about, not everyone understands. You suddenly end up throwing about terms that you are so accustomed to, that you don't realize a lot of people go "huh?". I find that a lot in my work, too, so I understand that it's hard. That's probably why the line of "...For Dummies" books sells millions.

Anyway, there were items, and terminology, that started to confuse me. All these "calls" and "hooks" and such began to go over my head. So I thought I would try it practically, by actually looking at Studio. And there seemed to be a lot of stuff there that didn't jive. It may have been due to the fact that there may have been some "extra stuff" in there (maybe things from plug-ins that weren't needed, or whatever), or maybe I just didn't understand. I did a little basic fiddling with some stuff, but it was purely based on (as mentioned above) looking at what had been done on a similar action, and copying it. I found it extremely tedious and confusing. And, to make things worse, every time I updated Sage with a new release, I had to do it again.

So, at this point, I'm just waiting on people smarter than me to help me out. While I would like to have a few of the functions that I created back again, none of them are deal-breakers that I can't wait for.

[Tiki]

Obviously demand is very high for dynamic menus or something like it. I know Sage prefers not to make promises or publish road maps, but there are times when a little bit of information really would be helpful.

Personally, I wish they would respond with a statement like one of the following:
(1) Yes, we are working on it. We can't make any promises on when or if it will be complete. but if we can get something working that we are happy with, we will release it before version 7 gets out of Beta.
(2) No, we have no plans to implement this feature at this time
(3) Undecided. We are evaluating it for possible inclusion in a future release, but it would be a fairly large undertaking, so it is unlikely that it will make it into the next official (v7.x) release.

If the answer were a firm "no" it is possible that one of the many talented developers that frequent this forum would take it upon themselves to create a plug-in (like Nielm did many years ago). But as it stands now, with hints that Sage may or may not be working on something, I would imagine that most developers would prefer to wait for Sage rather than spending a lot of time developing their own solution.

[bialio]

I haven't seen any hints that Sage might be working on this - they have been resoundingly quiet on this front as far as I can see.

I don't expect Sage to have dynamic menus in V7. That's just me though.
btl.

[jaminben]

I doubt very much they will leave something out like this which has been requested quite alot....... I expect it will come pretty soon, well thats my gut feeling anyway.

Cheers

Ben

[pjpjpjpj]

Originally Posted by jaminben

I doubt very much they will leave something out like this which has been requested quite alot....... I expect it will come pretty soon, well thats my gut feeling anyway.

Cheers

Ben

But certain other STV plugins that are currently in development will have such functionality.... right?

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by pjpjpjpj

But certain other STV plugins that are currently in development will have such functionality.... right?

thats the reason im not optomistic for dynamic menus to come about any time soon. all the major 3rd party devs are working on total replacements..

[hemicuda]

Makes sense from a time/effort stand point for Sage. Why go through the hassle of building in DCM (though it would be easier for them to do it than a 3rd party to reverse engr) when if the community wants it badly enough someone will write the plugin.

I agree that it would be nice to know if they are even considering it. Would cut down on any duplication of efforts. I for one am in the same boat as others. No time to spare to learn the Studio lingo. I'll be lucky if I can make time to format the server any time soon. Some of my apps are having issues and as it's been 2yrs on an XP box. It's time for a fresh build. I'll likely not move to 7 until a DCM plugin is available however.

[mightyt]

The ease of use related to nielm's Dynamic Menus clearly outweighs the Studio alternative for the general Sage community. I've used his plug in/import from the moment it became available and loved it ever since. With age, it only got better. Completely agree that this great capability "should" be added to a major release like 7.