Thinking of buying dual tuner SageTV setup, have questions...

[pawn]

Thanks in advance for any help offered.

I was thinking of picking up the system shown here:

http://www.freytechnologies.com/foru...=&threadid=412

I have some questions first...

1. The XMLTV listings: is it a tedious process to import into SageTV? Can it be automated (downlaoded and importing)? Are they fully functional listings allowing point and click recording, etc.?

2. Aspect ratio: is there custom aspect control over all TV windows (fullscreen or not)?

3. Is the television quality excellent? I think the quality on my RAdeon AIW 7500 tuner is disapointing. (see next question)

4. Dual Tuner: is this "ready for primetime"? Is it usable or just a toy? I think ATI's MulTVIew is absolute garbage.

5. Most importantly: can absolutely everything be controlled by hot keys in SageTV? It's very important to me to be able to operate all functionality, hopefully even recording, etc., with a remote control using my IR receiver and IRAssistant (an alternative Girder type program).

[edmc]

> 4. Dual Tuner: is this "ready for primetime"? Is it usable or just a toy? I think ATI's MulTVIew is absolute garbage.

Absolutely RFPT in my opinion. I also have a ReplayTV and, until I got the 2nd PVR-250 in my HTPC, used it to handle the rare Overlapped Recordings issue (1 of the 2 often being me doing the Pause-LiveTV thing). After getting the 2nd PVR-250, I don't even use the ReplayTV at all!

> 5. Most importantly: can absolutely everything be controlled by hot keys in SageTV? It's very important to me to be able to operate all functionality, hopefully even recording, etc., with a remote control using my IR receiver and IRAssistant (an alternative Girder type program).

More importantly for the WAF is getting my Pronto/Girder programmed to use SageTV from the Pronto. Haven't done that yet :-( So, for now, my Wife "owns" the ReplayTV - she's hooked on DVRs, too, but frowns at using my wireless Kybd.

There are lots of things one can control from the Kybd, but not everything apparently. For instance, if I want to go to the EPG while viewing a program, I use the mouse to bring up the toolbar and select the EPG/Guide Icon. To do this from the Kybd, I can't seem to get any hotkey to do this. So, I use the Home key to get to the Home Screen and then Arrow/Enter keys to navigate to the EPG "from the Top". It works for me...

[Lester Jacobs]

Originally posted by pawn
Thanks in advance for any help offered.

I was thinking of picking up the system shown here:

http://www.freytechnologies.com/foru...=&threadid=412

I have some questions first...

1. The XMLTV listings: is it a tedious process to import into SageTV? Can it be automated (downlaoded and importing)? Are they fully functional listings allowing point and click recording, etc.?

...

The xmltv process can be completely automated. Essentially you set up all of the necessary commands in a batch file then use Windows Scheduled Tasks to run the whole thing once a day to download listings and populate the SageTV guide.

I can't comment on the quality since I've never seen the output from a PVR-250 card. However the output of my Creative card can be described as a bit 'soft". However a lot of the quality variance can probably be controlled by adjusting the capture settings.

Cheers
Lester

[mlar]

1. It can be done. It's not supported, and it requires that you understand the concept of scheduled tasks, batch files etc. In fact, the EPG import plugins are not supported at all. It would be possible for someone to write a completely automated XMLTV plugin if they wanted to. But with what's currently available, it is possible as well.

3. It depends on alot of factors. Personally I think the video generated by my PVR-250 is excellent.. Produces very sharp and nice pictures when burnt to DVD and played through my Sony DVD player. Having said that, the TV output from my SageTV box does leave alot to be desired, and the picture does feel a bit soft due to interlacing issues (basically, the lines blur vertically). I'd say that the way you output the video FROM the SageTV box would be the determining factor here.

4. Yes, it works great. I'd recommend it to anyone. The dual tuner feature is the number one reason I got Sage TV.

5. Yes, everything can be controlled with the keyboard or girder. On one of my sageTV clients I use a Logitech Wireless Gamepad to control SageTV through Girder. On my main box I use IRMan, that works great too. You can configure exactly what keys to use for what in SageTV.

[Mark Lamutt]

3. This does very much depend on how you get the video to your television. I'm using an Audio Authority tanscoder to covert VGA output to component video input and run that into my HDTV at a resolution of 848x480p. My output from SageTV this way looks almost identical to the output of my satellite receiver hooked directly to my television. If you're just running svideo out at 480i to your television, the picture will probably be a little softer than a direct connection.

[sshapiro63]

I am using the Svideo out of a Radeon 9000 (Sapphire brand actually) into a Sharp 36" (not hi def) TV. I found that by using the Elecard decoder I got the best results.

I enabled Dscaler and the Greedy 2 Frames plug in, along with Double Refresh Rate. I don't understand why, but these settings look excellent on my TV. I have not tested all the Dscaler filters so there could be better settings; still I am satisfied enough to not use my Xcard for SageTV. I still use Xcard for DVD though.

It would be nice to have more complete SageTV documentation about the various output options, as well as recommended settings for various setups.

[Narflex]

Ed, Go into Setup->Detailed Setup->Commands. You can link any keystroke to any Sage command. One of them being Guide. Enjoy!

[pawn]

Originally posted by Mark Lamutt
3. This does very much depend on how you get the video to your television. I'm using an Audio Authority tanscoder to covert VGA output to component video input and run that into my HDTV at a resolution of 848x480p. My output from SageTV this way looks almost identical to the output of my satellite receiver hooked directly to my television. If you're just running svideo out at 480i to your television, the picture will probably be a little softer than a direct connection.

This is exactly my setup (i.e., the AA), except I use 856x484. So...how's the quality? Compared to other TV apps/tuners?

Thanks.

[Mark Lamutt]

Like I said, the quality is excellent - except for some sporting events, I literally don't see a difference between output coming from SageTV and the output coming from my dish network receivers. It's harder for me to compare it to other tv programs, because it's been awhile since I've even looked at them. Been running SageTV for 7 months now, and haven't ever looked back. With the ability to mix and match video and audio filters in SageTV, the quality is somewhat dependent on what filters you're using. I go back and forth between the Ravisent filter from the ATI DVD player version 7.6 and the Intervideo filter from WinDVD 4.0. Both produce really, really good results.

[pawn]

Originally posted by mlar
1. It can be done. It's not supported, and it requires that you understand the concept of scheduled tasks, batch files etc. In fact, the EPG import plugins are not supported at all. It would be possible for someone to write a completely automated XMLTV plugin if they wanted to. But with what's currently available, it is possible as well.

I'm assuming it can be done easier, then, using Sean's Macro Scheduler, which I would suggest to anyone with scheduled task needs, especially since it can be controlled by hotkeys as well.

[pawn]

Originally posted by Mark Lamutt
Like I said, the quality is excellent - except for some sporting events, I literally don't see a difference between output coming from SageTV and the output coming from my dish network receivers. It's harder for me to compare it to other tv programs, because it's been awhile since I've even looked at them. Been running SageTV for 7 months now, and haven't ever looked back. With the ability to mix and match video and audio filters in SageTV, the quality is somewhat dependent on what filters you're using. I go back and forth between the Ravisent filter from the ATI DVD player version 7.6 and the Intervideo filter from WinDVD 4.0. Both produce really, really good results.

Two comments:

1. The "except some sporting events" is a somewhat troubling comment, since I watch a lot. I find hockey is the most demanding due to constant panning, which is what I watch the most. How bad?

2. I didn't know it used DirectShow filters. That's unbelievably cool. I use Sonic 1.5 filters for ZoomPlayer and I can only assume they would be just as good for Sage.

Well....I'm swayed. in the words of Rafiki: "It is time."

One other thing: is there custom filtering ala Dscaler deinterlacing filters, etc.?

Thanks again.

[Narflex]

You betcha there's support for the custom DScaler deinterlacing filters.

[Mark Lamutt]

Pawn - I'll be honest with you. Hockey and some basketball games aren't the greatest, but my source material pretty much sucks as well. Watching a hockey game off of dish network is almost painful, so it's almost painful to watch it through SageTV as well, as my dish network receiver is the source I use. The fault isn't SageTV's, but the source that I input into SageTV. I suppose that I could add an antenna line into my SageTV mix that would solve most of the problem, but I haven't gotton around to that yet.

I believe the Sonic filters should work just fine for you. I'm one of the few that's not a big fan of them - on my setup in zoomplayer, I still prefer the older ravisent filters. They just give me a more pleasing picture.

[pawn]

Originally posted by Mark Lamutt
Pawn - I'll be honest with you. Hockey and some basketball games aren't the greatest, but my source material pretty much sucks as well. Watching a hockey game off of dish network is almost painful, so it's almost painful to watch it through SageTV as well, as my dish network receiver is the source I use. The fault isn't SageTV's, but the source that I input into SageTV. I suppose that I could add an antenna line into my SageTV mix that would solve most of the problem, but I haven't gotton around to that yet.

I believe the Sonic filters should work just fine for you. I'm one of the few that's not a big fan of them - on my setup in zoomplayer, I still prefer the older ravisent filters. They just give me a more pleasing picture.

1. Yeah, sports are kinda crappy on SAT due to the compression.

2. You never had trouble with the AC3 sound (DD or DTS) woth the Ravisent Cinemaster filters? I always had a problem where the sound was muted until hitting "play" in the root menu. The PQ was always good though.

[corykim]

Any reason why you guys don't use 960x540? It works very well for me.

[pawn]

Originally posted by corykim
Any reason why you guys don't use 960x540? It works very well for me.

Huge overscan on my television.

856x484 is based on 540 timings, without the overscan.

[Mark Lamutt]

Same reason for me as well, although 848x480 fits my screen a little better than 856x484.

I don't use the ravisent cineplayer audio filters. I stick with the powerdvd xp audio filter with the ravisent cineplayer video filter. That combination has been the best for me in zoomplayer.