What is wrong with TV these days!

[heffneil]

I just don't get TV these days! Rant begins here but I think I have lost it totally after just reading that Lights Out on FX was cancelled. I just can't believe it. Some of the best shows on TV are going away. The Cape is going away which I thought was very good. It needed work but given the choices that show was excellent. I usually have better hope with choices on FX and the cable networks since they have lower viewership to begin with.

Ultimately NBC's line up is flushed down the toilet. Even Outsourced which was funny and I recorded and watched is said to be going away. V which I thought was ok but moving a little slow is going away. Scyfy or however you spell it now has more wrestling than science fiction. How many whos about a giant snake and lizard fighting can you watch. I miss the good Star Gates, Star Treks and Battle Stars! Scifi on major networks as said above doesn't get the viewership needed. The Event is going to be gone. Flash Forward was just awful.

If you are reading this much and involved with Sage as much as me you probably record and view enough TV. I wonder what your opinions are on television these days.

I feel like I am working harder than the networks these days for a few lousy programs that aren't worth the trouble!

Neil

[Spectrum]

I agree. It's gotten so bad that if a show doesn't have x million viewers (where x is defined by some function involving last weeks reality series crap) then they pull the plug. I don't know if the same group is in charge at FX as at Fox, but Fox is the parent company and those are the fools that canceled Firefly and Family Guy what like 3 times nowk?

Don't get me started on SciFi. They sold whatever vestiges remained of their soul when the "rebranded" to SyFy. The one thing that really stuck with me recently was when they dumped Caprica and aired Star Trek TNG re-runs in it's time slot. Whether or not Caprica was a good show is debatable, but I refuse to believe TNG re-runs would in more viewers than a new series.

I think it boils down to 2 things:
1. The networks are enamored with the ROI for reality series. They cost little to nothing to make and rake in viewers. Why spend millions on effects, costumes, and writers when you can hire a few has beens or minor celebs to critique and insult people they find off the street.

2. The Nielsen rating system is so out of touch with reality the numbers they provide aren't accurately reflected across all demographics.

[pjpjpjpj]

I'm probably in the minority here but I don't care for SciFi, I'm more of a sitcom guy. I've found quite a few funny new sitcoms this year, but, as with every show, they'll only survive if people watch them. Look no farther than "Arrested Development", which was winning friggin Emmys and had a huge support group of Hollywood A-list celebrities, but still got canceled because not enough people were watching it as opposed to whatever it was up against (I don't recall... it was Sunday nights... either "60 Minutes" or "Extreme Home Makeover"??)

I liked "Outsourced" at first but it ran out of ideas about a month ago (BTW, did you know it was based off a movie of the same name? Look on IMDB). I really like the new show "Traffic Light", and it's getting better every week, but sitcoms on Fox don't seem to do well - hopefully they can parlay the "American Idol" lead-in into some viewers. I have been amused by "Better With You" (old couple and young couple = hysterical, middle couple = meh).

But, going to the overall topic here, yeah, reality TV has pretty much ruined TV.

[drewg]

Originally Posted by pjpjpjpj

I'm probably in the minority here but I don't care for SciFi, I'm more of a sitcom guy. I've found quite a few funny new sitcoms this y

I'm pretty much the kiss of death for a series. If I like it, it will be cancelled in 2 seasons or less. Networks should pitch shows to me, then if I like them, kill them immediately.

Even the sitcoms I like tend to get cancelled ($% My Dad Said, is in trouble for example). Pretty much every SciFi show I've liked in the last few years has either been cancelled, or is about to be cancelled (SGU, Event, FlashForward, Dollhouse, Journeyman, Life On Mars, Terminator, Jericho, Defying Gravity etc). About the only shows I like that are going strong are Big Bang and the immortal Law And Order franchise.

Drew

[reggie14]

I think writers have really struggled to come up with good scifi shows recently. Battlestar started off great, but I think it really struggled in the final seasons. I really wanted to like Caprica, but I think the writers didn't quite know what to do with the middle 6 episodes. By the time they got their act together with the final set of episodes (which I thought were great), the show was already cancelled.

Part of the problem is that networks don't always give new shows a chance. Caprica is probably a good example of that. Maybe if they actually ordered a block of 18 episodes and aired them at once the show might have caught on. Instead they seem to order small blocks of episodes, and air them whenever they feel like it. I think ABC really tried to give V a chance, but it just wasn't good enough (or have enough viewers) to justify the production cost.

But I think there's still some good TV on. NBC is keeping around 30 Rock, Parks and Recreation and The Office. Although, the Office won't be the same without Steve Carell. I think the Big Bang Theory is hilarious, as is How I Met Your Mother. And, being comfortable in my masculinity, I'm not ashamed to say I'm a huge Glee fan. Plus, once you throw premium channels into the mix you get Dexter.

I'd like a good scifi show though. I watched Caprica and Dollhouse. I've been watching The Event and V this year. Of those I was really only disappointed to see Dollhouse go, although Caprica had potential.

[jbrandon]

I’ll throw my nickels worth in here also…

I totally agree, TV just plain sucks! I had asked several people what they thought about TV today vs a couple years ago and most responded it was great, liked the new shows but when they told me what they watched I kinka understood. Biggest Loser, Dancing with the Stars – not my cup of tea. I am a SyFy fan or at least was until all the crap wrestling. There was a time when they produced several new movies per year now about all they do is show re-runs of them and usually the worst ones. I’ve not always liked very series they produced but at least I would give them a chance. I did find that AMC has a couple of interesting series which we like, Rubicon (I find intriguing), Breaking Bad and The Walking Dead (take or leave, a little too farfetched). FX also came up with Sons of Anarchy but it even has gotten a little bit out there too.

I don’t care for comedy per say but do like a good laugh now in then, the sitcoms today are just too canned, canned jokes, canned laughter, canned plots. Reality – gosh give me a break. Cop show are getting tiring – again the same plots just different names and actors.

But every once in a while we do find a new show that we enjoy. To name a couple Blue Bloods, The Defenders both have captured our viewer ship. Thank goodness for the History Channel and NGC!!

I’s say one thing though, I am happy I use SageTV that way at least I can watch what I want when I want and skip commercials to boot. Integrated with PlayOn gives us the ability to watch movies from several sources, even TV shows if we feel l like being abused. And all the channels have the most up to date news, just ask them – but you have to endure their adds to see the report at 11 but again you will be lead on for at least half an hour to endure even more commercials. I was forced to watch TV at a friend’s house last weekend (all weekend) while babysitting and let me tell you there is more commercial time than program time anymore – I think I read somewhere they can use up to 22 minutes per 60 minute show during prime time now, have no idea of how much off prime. Not a fact but I did read it somewhere…

Thanks, I know I have used more than your nickel’s worth of time…

[matt91]

My wife and I have a "policy" of not watching any new shows for at least the first 6 months and usually 12 months that they are on.

We have so much recorded that we never have time to watch, it's easily to let some new series just record without us never even paying attention to it. At some point, we'll go back and see if they are getting renewed or at least have good reviews, and then we will start watching them.

We just got tired of starting out on a new series, liking it, only to have it canceled after the first season (or sooner).

[panteragstk]

I'm right there with you. The cape was original, but pretty cheesy. I still liked it though. Outsourced is ok, but I can see it getting crappy. How I met your mother, big bang theory and even rules of engagement are all pretty good. Me and the wife started watching perfect couples and it is pretty funny. I really don't think nbc has a clue when it comes to programming. The middle on abc is good and so is modern family. As for the crime shows castle is pretty good. I'm getting tired of the law and orders out there, although if you don't have anything else to watch they work. I'm a huge dexter fan. I really like burn notice as well. As for shows I like getting canceled. Tbh they usually aren't that good to begin with. Fringe is one of my favorites as well along with house and lie to me. Bones is decent as well. Most of the things I like I can get ota, but there are a few good shows on HBO, showtime and stars too. I guess that is why I haven't missed having a cable/satellite subscription for the last 3 years, because most shows on networks like syfy (what were they thinking?) and whatever else is out there just plain suck or don't get enough funding or whatever.

[jnmfox]

With so many channels TV viewing is getting more segmented, programs that will appeal to a specific group but few that have mass market appeal. I think a lot of TV viewers have gotten more discerning with what they want to invest their time into.

I'm with the other posters, I have a hard time watching a new series because who knows if the network will stay with it even if it is good (ie LoneStar). I just wait and see if it is going to be renewed before I jump in now.

There are some good shows that my wife and I still enjoy:

Breaking Bad (only show we don't get with OTA)
Modern Family
The Office
Parks & Rec (as funny as the old episodes of The Office)
Community
Survivor & The Amazing Race
House
The Mentalist

[heffneil]

Yeah but how uncreative is TV these days? We take a show like Law and Order, CSI or NCIS. Put a couple new main characters change the venue and we have a new show. Seems like TV is plagues with these cop shows. And then wait we cant come up with new stuff so lets revive old shows like Hawaii Five - O or Wonderwoman. These shows are just terrible ideas!

I guess the lack of Scifi does bother me but even the good stuff that I like gets cancelled like Lights Out which required little in terms of set design and special effects.

Mike and Molly is a really cute show that my wife and I really like. Modern Family is another winner but these are head and shoulders above the rest. How much longer will Desperate Housewives go on. I think they will change it to Desperate Grandmothers sooner or later!

The shows I am recording and watching is becoming slimmer and that is a real shame. I used to really like TV. The theme of my Bar Mitzva was TV and the Simpsons had just came on to the block. There is another horse beaten to death!

[panteragstk]

Originally Posted by jnmfox

I'm with the other posters, I have a hard time watching a new series because who knows if the network will stay with it even if it is good (ie LoneStar). I just wait and see if it is going to be renewed before I jump in now.

Lone Star was odd. I only watched 2 episodes before it was gone. Wife was pissed...

[pjpjpjpj]

Another problem is that a good sitcom is usually character-driven - much of the humor has to be from the audience knowing the characters' personalities, not just from dialogue - and these days, networks don't give half the sitcoms enough time to really develop the characters.

The Office, Modern Family, Big Bang, How I Met Your Mother - all funny shows, but you kinda had to get to know the cast before they really hooked you.

We've been watching "Perfect Couples" and it's okay, but I think "Traffic Light" is much better - it's one of the few sitcoms featyuring couples where everything is written from the guys' point of view instead of the women.

[heffneil]

I watched Lone Star and thought the first episode was great! I read the reviews and didn't even keep the first recording, Deleted it and never looked back I knew from the instant I read the reviews it was a goner.

Maybe there are some politics involved in this? People aren't liked and they don't play it properly. The reviews are garbage and its a death sentence.

Did you see they are redoing a new generation Dallas? I mean gosh have all the good ideas died with Aaron Spelling?

The other problems I feel are what people are admitting here: 1. They record about everything and I imagine the recording ratings don't help the actual ratings but I am sure others know this better than me. And 2. People are waiting to see what happens with a show so instead of watching it and helping ratings the show is on its own and doesn't make it....

Neil

[davephan]

TV really went downhill years ago when all the networks came out with "reality" shows. The "reality" shows are dirt cheap to produce, and enough people will watch them. The sitcom shows used to be funny. Now they have laugh-tracks that laugh at things that have absolutely no humor. An example of how TV has declined is the new Hawaii 5-0 show. They try to impress you with the latest technology and have almost no plot compared to the old Hawaii 5-0. A decade or two from now that technology that is pushed in your face will look very dated.

Fortunately, there is still enough good TV that is still left. Netflix helps improve TV a lot. The old Hawaii 5-0 series is available there and many movies. The old Hawaii 5-O lacks the technology, but has decent plots, lacking in the new version. Some network TV shows are still OK, but there isn't much. House and CSI shows are examples of newer shows that haven't been dumbed down. The newer cartoon shows are just horrible. The animation and storyboard is lousy compared compared to the cartoons 40 to 50 years ago. But kids still watch those newer cartoons even though they are dirt cheap to produce.

With all that said, there is still enough good TV for SageTV to record. If your only watching TV live, surfing around, there's usually not much worth watching and TV is lousy. If you can time-shift the good TV to match your TV watching schedule, not the broadcaster's schedule, then TV is still good.


Dave

[matt91]

Originally Posted by heffneil

The other problems I feel are what people are admitting here: 1. They record about everything and I imagine the recording ratings don't help the actual ratings but I am sure others know this better than me. And 2. People are waiting to see what happens with a show so instead of watching it and helping ratings the show is on its own and doesn't make it....

that's absolutely true -- if you had a Nielsen box or equivalent. Otherwise, your viewing habits are unknown to the networks.

[Serra]

Originally Posted by matt91

My wife and I have a "policy" of not watching any new shows for at least the first 6 months and usually 12 months that they are on.

I use the same policy. If a new show comes out and it is something I must watch, then I watch it, but everything that is a 'good' or 'maybe' gets recorded and saved until it is canceled or renewed. If it is canceled and it was worth watching, for example has an actor that I like, then I'll watch it knowing that it is disposable, I will not get invested. If it is renewed, then I'll watch it and if I like it, I will continue to watch it.

I refuse to get invested in shows any more, unless I know they are coming back for at least two seasons.

[Serra]

Originally Posted by matt91

that's absolutely true -- if you had a Nielsen box or equivalent. Otherwise, your viewing habits are unknown to the networks.

The Nielsen people came to my house late last year. I told them that I use a "DVR" and that I hate them for ignoring me and treating me like a second class citizen. They were amazed I knew who they were! Apparently, most people haven't a clue who they are or what they do! They also told me sorry, they don't have the technology to hook up to my DVR...

[heffneil]

When I was a kid growing up we were a nielsen family. My mom made me run around the house to make sure we were recording TV for all the shows she liked on multiple VCR's. My mom had a VCR for all three major networks and Fox which was a joke back then! She had the remote with the wire that plugged in the back! Ahh the good old days!

We had to keep secret that we were a nielsen family so people couldn't influence our watching I guess. I just remember the guy who installed it was cool and he gave me programs for my Apple //e!

[heffneil]

I was driving around Miami / Ft Lauderdale and noticed all these HUGE blockbuster stores with the banners exclaiming going out of business store closing. It seems like another reflection of television and the industry as a whole. Netflix absolutely ruined blockbuster. I guess in/on demand and redbox has some part in it but Netflix was the big game changer.

As a whole TV is going to go away. Look at the soap operas that have folded up after 60 years or however long. The way I see TV is it will all be internet based. Comcast and those other utility providers are going to have to stop providing broadcast tv as we know it and just become conduits to the internet. Look at the numbers of people who cancel comcast for things like netflix and roku boxes for online content.

Someone will get smart and create a company that provides push news and sports for your region to you "live" and then you will watch the good shows you desire. They will be distributed via the major networks but you won't tune to a channel like we currently do today. I just don't see how we will continue to wait for shows to get pushed to the viewers. If I could pay per show on HBO instead of paying a fortune each month for one show I would do that. I could cut out all the other crap and pick what I want.

That my friends is the future of TV.

[davephan]

Originally Posted by heffneil

I was driving around Miami / Ft Lauderdale and noticed all these HUGE blockbuster stores with the banners exclaiming going out of business store closing. It seems like another reflection of television and the industry as a whole. Netflix absolutely ruined blockbuster. I guess in/on demand and redbox has some part in it but Netflix was the big game changer.

As a whole TV is going to go away. Look at the soap operas that have folded up after 60 years or however long. The way I see TV is it will all be internet based. Comcast and those other utility providers are going to have to stop providing broadcast tv as we know it and just become conduits to the internet. Look at the numbers of people who cancel comcast for things like netflix and roku boxes for online content.

Someone will get smart and create a company that provides push news and sports for your region to you "live" and then you will watch the good shows you desire. They will be distributed via the major networks but you won't tune to a channel like we currently do today. I just don't see how we will continue to wait for shows to get pushed to the viewers. If I could pay per show on HBO instead of paying a fortune each month for one show I would do that. I could cut out all the other crap and pick what I want.

That my friends is the future of TV.

I think Blockbuster ruined Blockbuster. The rental fees were very high and the late fees were very annoying. I believe they might have elminated the late fees later, but I haven't returned to a Blockbuster store in years, so I can't be sure about that. When movies transitioned from video cassettes to DVDs, Netflix took off. The DVDs severely reduced shipping costs.

The future of TV is on-demand. If the providers aren't doing on-demand, they will be loosers. The Netflix on-demand has the right price model. A low monthly rate, independent of the number of movies you watch on-line. A lot of Netflix movies aren't on instant streaming, so DVDs are still needed for that. Cable offers on-demand, but charges by the movie at a high price compared to Netflix, so I never order a cable on-demand movie.

I think the days of movie channels like HBO where you have to align your personal schedule to the broadcast schedule will be over in the future. Of course with SageTV you can time shift, but most of the population isn't time shifting. For people that don't time shift, it's the choice of watching movies from the middle with services like HBO or watching them from the beginning with Netflix.

Another alternative might be a-la-carte channels instead of packages. Out of about 200 channels, only about 8 - 10 cable channels are worth watching for most people. But the cable and satellite companies love to sell you packages. Most of the channels in the packages, you never watch.


Dave