UNC paths and mapped drives??

[JUC]

Hi all, in a few weeks I am moving into a new house and will be setting up a wired network with sagetv and only 1 client. I currently have a shuttle running sagetv with 2 HD's crammed in with no client. To eliminate some of the heat, i was thinking of just taking one out and putting it in my client machine. This is my first time setting up/using a wired network as well. Would I just need to map the drive in my client machine then add that mapped drive to the video import section? I have read in other threads to use UNC paths (which I don't even know what they are) to save headaches later. One more thing to note, in a little while I will probably be adding another tuner to the client machine and will need to purchase sagerecorder to go along with that (didn't know if that matters with having me either map the drives or use UNC...).

-also, if i just take out one of my drives in the shuttle that has most of my sage recordings on it and move it to my client---will all the information still be there and accessible?
Thanks
JUC

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by JUC

Would I just need to map the drive in my client machine then add that mapped drive to the video import section? I have read in other threads to use UNC paths (which I don't even know what they are) to save headaches later.

I would use UNC paths, as they will work with the SageTV service, if you decide to use that. Page 15 of the v2.1 manual comments a very short blurb on UNC paths; essentially you share the drive/dir & use: \\computer's network name\share name\directory name as the path.

Remember: The downside to using network storage is that you have to keep that client running all the time too.

-also, if i just take out one of my drives in the shuttle that has most of my sage recordings on it and move it to my client---will all the information still be there and accessible?

This FAQ entry mentions moving recordings from one location to another, which is essentially what you are doing. I would use the latest version of SageTV to do this, back up your data files, and make sure SageTV is not about to do an EPG update when it gets restarted.

- Andy

[jptaz]

Based on what you are doing you are best off using UNC paths as opposed to mapped drives since you will not have to worry about the mapped drives being disconnected by windows. For some strange reason if a mapped drive has not been accessed for a while it will disconnect it.

A UNC Path is in this form:

\\<PC NAME>\<Drive>$
or
\\<PC NAME>\<Share Name>

I prefer using the <Drive>$ form my PC will appear not to have any open shares when looking in the network browser.

So to add the H: on my pc named media-beast I type the following as one of my video directories.

\\media-beast\h$

To allow the other pcs in the house to acces this path I have to make sure that they have the same user name and password as on my pc named media-beast. to make my life easier all my pcs have the same user name and password defined.

John

[mdmint]

Originally Posted by JUC

I currently have a shuttle running sagetv with 2 HD's crammed in with no client. To eliminate some of the heat, i was thinking of just taking one out and putting it in my client machine.

IMO based on 20+ years computer field experience two HDs in almost any box shouldn't cause a heat problem. If it does, the box is way under cooled. Add a back exhaust fan and maybe also HD cooler fan.

[JUC]

Andy, what exactly would the 'share name' be? I am a little confused as to what else to do other than making sure the drive is shared. Lets say it is drive: E, and my client PC is called 'bedroom' and I am recording to the 'sagerecordings' folder. Would the path I set up be:
\\bedroom\E\sagerecordings ? and if so, what makes that a UNC path.
thanks
JUC

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by jptaz

I prefer using the <Drive>$ form my PC will appear not to have any open shares when looking in the network browser.

FWIW, I think you can put a $ behind any share name and make it hidden.

[JUC]

sorry about the last post---you guys are quick. Do i need to place the $ after the drive name and what does that do. What if i have no password set? can the other pc's access the drive still?

-also, it is a shuttle and does get hot---not hot enought to damage the drives but hot enought that it makes the fan kick on and off more frequently than it would without the drive there. So if i remove it, it will make the shuttle quieter. I will probably be adding more HD's too down the road.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by JUC

sorry about the last post---you guys are quick. Do i need to place the $ after the drive name and what does that do. What if i have no password set? can the other pc's access the drive still?

The $ signifies a hidden share. Windows 2000 and XP (Pro, not home though) create a default share of <drive_letter>$ for each permanent disk in your setup, so c$ is always there, d$ if you have a D: drive. These shares are there for maintinence and require a Username/password with Administrative privilages. I don't know what happens if you have an admin account set up without a password though as I've never tried that.

The '$' is part of the share name so yes, you have to specify it if you want to use a share like c$. But if you're creating a share, the '$' isn't necessary it's just a way to make it not visible when browsing computers (note that Samba can see and will display hidden shares just fine).

[JUC]

alright--thanks, i think i have it but may have to resurrect this thread once i get things set up in a few weeks.
JUC

[sleonard]

Originally Posted by JUC

Andy, what exactly would the 'share name' be? I am a little confused as to what else to do other than making sure the drive is shared. Lets say it is drive: E, and my client PC is called 'bedroom' and I am recording to the 'sagerecordings' folder. Would the path I set up be:
\\bedroom\E\sagerecordings ? and if so, what makes that a UNC path.
thanks
JUC

Close. What you would do is:

On the server, open the E: drive, go to the Tools menu and choose Folder Options and then the View tab. On the view tab, scroll down and make sure "Use Simple File Sharing" is checked. Close.

Back in the E: drive, right click the "SageRecordings" folder and choose "Sharing and Security" from the list. Check "Share this Folder on the Network" and the share name text box is enabled with SageRecordings as the share name by default. This is the name that will be shown in Network Neighborhood. You can change this or leave it as is.

*Note: There is 2 ways to change the name. You can simply rename the share and/or you can add a $ after the name (Called a hidden share). The local path will remain E:\SageRecordings. The default UNC would be \\Bedroom\SageRecordings. If you were to change just the share name to TVShows, the new UNC would become \\Bedroom\TVShows. If you were also to add a $ then the UNC would become \\Bedroom\TVShows$ and the shared folder would not appear in Network Neighborhood.

Next, click "Allow network users to change my files" and then OK. Needed so Sage can record to the share.

To access the folder from a client you can open My Network Places on the Start menu and you will get a list of all shared network folders. Sometimes you have to run the "Add a Network Place" wizard to get it to show up (required for hidden shares). If so you can browse for the share or just type the UNC (\\Bedroom\SageRecordings).

When setting up the share as a Sage library also use the UNC for a path.

[sixdoubleo]

As a network guy (as Im sure there are plenty here) let me advise AGAINST using the c$, d$, e$ shares for several reasons.

1. These are administrative shares and require that the user you use to access your "server" have administrative access to that system. From a security standpoint, you are better off creating a specific user just for Sage. I call mine "mediaservice". Create a dedicated share for your recordings....say
"PVR" and access it like this: \\server\pvr (add the "$" if you like it hidden). Then give "mediaservice" the appropriate rights.

2. You are bound by the physical path within "c$". So \\server\c$\videos\pvr if your videos are at c:\videos\pvr. Create an actual "PVR" share at c:\videos\pvr so that you mask the path from the sage server. This way you can phyiscally move your pvr directory to other drives, and directory trees without affecting Sage's path.

Just general network sharing best practices.

[foolio]

i like using ip address. for some reason, using server name causes slow initial access.

\\192.168.2.140\sage

[mls]

Originally Posted by foolio

i like using ip address. for some reason, using server name causes slow initial access.

\\192.168.2.140\sage

Of course that requires you either set the machine up with a static IP or set up the Router to always assign the same IP to that computer's MAC with the Router's DHCP server.

Personally, I prefer setting up static IP's on the computer/device itself so as not to have problems later if ever having to replace the Router, since not all Routers have the option of assigning the same IP to a specific MAC (and could forget to set that up correctly again correctly even if it does).

When setting up a static IP on the computer/device, be sure to use an IP that is outside the range the Router's DHCP server would assign, or disable the DHCP server all together if DHCP is not needed for other computers/devices.

However, doing all of this may be a bit outside the range of knowledge of the average home computer user (although it really isn't all that hard to do).

[sixdoubleo]

Originally Posted by foolio

i like using ip address. for some reason, using server name causes slow initial access.

\\192.168.2.140\sage

Well, to each their own, but honestly you have other problems if that's the case. NetBIOS name reoslution should be just about instant. If you're not running Active Directory, then your computers are going to broadcast and use master browsers to do NetBIOS name reoslution. To avoid these issues, you can create a file and call it lmhosts. Put it in %windir%\system32\drivers\etc. Format of the file is :

192.168.2.140 sage #PRE
192.168.2.141 musicsrv #PRE

and so on.

Drop to a command line and type "nbtstat -R" to activate.

To test it, type "net view \\sage" it should come right back....no lag. If there is still an initial lag then it sounds like you have some other TCP/IP or name resolution problems.

[jcato]

On the networking topic, I added a new share at the root of my C: drive, not the C$, but a new one. I was hoping to be able to access all the folders on the C: drive of my server. But, it wouldn't let my access the 'Program Files' (or Windows) folder. So, I went to the server to specifically share it, and the option is grayed out. I tried to find an answer on google, but couldn't. Is it possible to share the 'Program Files' or 'Windows' folders? I'd like to access several different folders under Program Files and don't won't to share each one individually.

This is with WinXP Pro, BTW.

Thanks!

[AndyS]

Originally Posted by jcato

On the networking topic, I added a new share at the root of my C: drive, not the C$, but a new one. I was hoping to be able to access all the folders on the C: drive of my server. But, it wouldn't let my access the 'Program Files' (or Windows) folder. So, I went to the server to specifically share it, and the option is grayed out. I tried to find an answer on google, but couldn't. Is it possible to share the 'Program Files' or 'Windows' folders? I'd like to access several different folders under Program Files and don't won't to share each one individually.

This is with WinXP Pro, BTW.

Thanks!

It's probably a security thing. Sharing the root of your boot drive is a very dangerous thing to do and I highly advise against it. In fact sharing the root of any drive can allow access to any hacker that gets to the share. You are much better off just sharing at the folder level. That way you can be sure that a hacker can't get to files that might affect the integrity or performance of your PC.

So as an example, if you have the following file structure on machine 'SageServer':
D:\
\SageData\
\TVData\
\Library\
\Music
\Video
You may wish to share the <SageData> directory as 'SageShare' and then use a path such as '\\SageServer\SageShare\TVData' for your video directory, and '\\SageServer\SageShare\Library' for your Library directory.

Andy.

[AndyS]

As alluded to above, security is a risk whenever you have shares. If you are using simple file sharing (default for XP) you are pretty much limited to being shared or not shared, but if possible you should set up Read/Write/Create (or Full) access to the share for the user that will run the Sage process, and Read-Only for the user(s) that will run the clients. At a pinch you could give 'everyone' read-only access - it's not a big risk because they're just data-files that have no security implication.

Andy.

[jcato]

Yeah, I know there are security issues. I guess I feel that being behind a hardware firewall, I'm not at much risk. Maybe I'm wrong.

But, still, WinXP will not let me share the Program Files folder. I want to access files the Sage, myHTPC, Girder, and other folders under Program Files. I'd rather not have to explicitly share each of those folders. Is there anyway to share the Program Files folder? I haven't been able to find one yet.

[sleonard]

Originally Posted by jcato

Yeah, I know there are security issues. I guess I feel that being behind a hardware firewall, I'm not at much risk. Maybe I'm wrong.

But, still, WinXP will not let me share the Program Files folder. I want to access files the Sage, myHTPC, Girder, and other folders under Program Files. I'd rather not have to explicitly share each of those folders. Is there anyway to share the Program Files folder? I haven't been able to find one yet.

If you really want to you must first disable simple filesharing. In any Explorer window go to Tools/Folder Options and choose the View tab. Scroll to the bottom of Advanced Settings and UNcheck "Use Simple File Sharing".