A few questions..

[JJarmoc]

I saw the article about your software in this morning's Sun Times, which led me here. I'm a devoted TiVo fanatic, but I've been looking for something a little more suited to my needs, and it looks like SageTV just might be it. I've got a few questions though..

1 - Does the software support multiple capture devices so I can record multiple channels at once assuming I have multiple source feeds?

1a - If so, can the source cards have different channel lineups? IE. Can one be Digital cable (with box) while the other is analog cable (no box) or antennae?

This would be a huge boon, as it's one of the limitations Tivo, Reply, and most other devices have (unless using a satellite feed..) It seems a lot of shows I watch tend to be on Sunday and Wednesday evenings and I'm stuck having to pick favorites.

2 - HDTV support. I saw another thread about this. I'd love for this software to support MyHD, or really any other HD card. I'd get a new card if I could use it in the same application as standard def capture.

I don't have much preference on the software/hardware decoding route, though with all I envision my HTPC eventually doing, hardware might be better. Recording two standard def streams while playing back a high def stream might get to be a bit much. Heck, even dscaler or FFDshow can tax a beefy machine.

3 - Girder support. Does MythTV support Girder? I really have very little desire to sit in front of the TV with a keyboard and mouse.

4 - Storage - When shows are stored is there a set directory/partition they're put in? Can I allocate how much space to use for recordings and have it automatically overwrite my oldest unwatched recordings?

5 - Is there any functionality similar to TiVo's suggestions, whereby the software records shows I may like, but have not scheduled recordings for? I think I might be missing something about how the software works, since it doesn't seem you need to actually schedule recordings.. I'm a bit fuzzy on this though.

6 - The current OSD looks kind of bland. Is their a revamp in the plans? How about a skinnable/customizeable interface? It'd be great to have the graphic style of the program be a little more in line with some of my other HTPC apps.

Sorry to lay all these on you guys at once. It looks like this is a pretty good product and I'm just trying to fill in the gaps in my information. I'm sure I'll try the demo version soon.

Thanks!

[Mark Lamutt]

1. Yes

1a. I don't know - Jeff or Dan will have to answer that one.

2. You and all of us!

3. SageTV fully supports Girder. I don't know what MythTV is...

4. Yes and Yes. You tell it where you want the shows to go, and they go there. And you can tell it to use XX amount of space, or leave XX amount of space free.

5. Intelligent Recording - this feature absolutely blows Tivo away.

6. The interface is something that's being worked on for version 2.0

[edmc]

> 1 - Does the software support multiple capture devices so I can
> record multiple channels at once assuming I have multiple
> source feeds?

With the 1.2.2 Beta, SageTV supports multiple capture devices. As I'm not a SageRecorder user, I'm not the one to answer that part of the question but I believe that was the early-on advantage to using SageRecorder over SageTV. But, as you are a TiVo user, I'm sure you are more interested in SageTV.

> 1a - If so, can the source cards have different channel lineups?
> IE. Can one be Digital cable (with box) while the other is
> analog cable (no box) or antennae?

Sure - indeed one can be a Tuner Card and the 2nd a Capture Card (i.e. something that captures S-Video output from a set-top box). Note that I'm not talking HD Digital here - I'm assuming you are referring to something like Cox/AT&T Digital Cable (or DirecTv/DishNetwork for that matter). HD is a different matter, but one I'm eager to see Sage support as well...

> This would be a huge boon, as it's one of the limitations Tivo,
> Reply, and most other devices have (unless using a satellite
> feed..) It seems a lot of shows I watch tend to be on Sunday
> and Wednesday evenings and I'm stuck having to pick favorites.

Caution here... You could have simply bought 2 TiVo's right? Well, the situation with Sage is the same - you'll need to buy 2 Tuner/Capture cards. Of course, with Sage, the Recording/Tuning of the 2 cards would be integrated - just like in Microsoft's UltimateTV by the way...

> 2 - HDTV support. I saw another thread about this. I'd love for
> this software to support MyHD, or really any other HD card.
> I'd get a new card if I could use it in the same application as
> standard def capture.

As mentioned above, this is not yet supported, but being as that the HD "capture" card doesn't even have to do any H/W Encoding (into MPEG-2), this should be fairly straightforward - and very high quality. As you said, there are already threads on this topic.

> 3 - Girder support. Does MythTV support Girder? I really have
> very little desire to sit in front of the TV with a keyboard
> and mouse.

Two points:

3-1: There is already a Girder Exported Group up on the Girder WebSite. Very handy...

3-2: In addiion, the IR Remote Control's of the Hauppauge PVR 250/350 are supported directy. For me, I prefer to use Girder, but some will find this direct support an easier path...

> 4 - Storage - When shows are stored is there a set
> directory/partition they're put in? Can I allocate how much
> space to use for recordings and have it automatically
> overwrite my oldest unwatched recordings?

Some of the management of the recording space falls in the realm of the "secret sauce" of Sage, so I'll let the Sage folks respond here if they'd like. But basically you can select the directory where the recordings are placed. You can cap how much space is used if you'd like. You can also set it to use all but any amount of space on the partition (this is the setting I like - I simply set it to leave 20GB free on the partition to which recordings go and forget about it). Finally, there are also different levels of recordings. SageTV has a lot of smarts about recording programs you might like (kind of like TiVo as I understand it). So there are some classes of recordings which get deleted first, certainly.

> 5 - Is there any functionality similar to TiVo's suggestions,
> whereby the software records shows I may like, but have
> not scheduled recordings for? I think I might be missing
> something about how the software works, since it doesn't
> seem you need to actually schedule recordings.. I'm a bit
> fuzzy on this though.

This is one of the key selling points of SageTV as I understand it. Personally, I don't use this feature much, so I'm not the best person to respond. But it is there...

> 6 - The current OSD looks kind of bland. Is their a revamp in the
> plans? How about a skinnable/customizeable interface? It'd
> be great to have the graphic style of the program be a little
> more in line with some of my other HTPC apps.

I think it's fair to say Sage has focused on functionality in the initial realease. I'm sure they have plans to spiff things up a bit in the future. The skinable idea is a great one as that lets people vary the interface to their liking. Often, people just want a different color scheme. For me, I need to vary the size of the controls to make them readable on my display from my normal viewing distance. It would be hard for Sage to get that right for everybody... I use a 40" LCD RPTV which isn't the sharpest display in the world. It's also only 480p with a whole bunch of overscan. When that $4000 50" LCD Flat Panel with HDMI-DVI comes out, I'm in - til then I'm squinting :-)

Hope these answers help. I was one of the late-joining Beta Testers (I joined when they added support for the Hauppauge PVR-250), so I'm somewhat practiced with SageTV. But others here are much more adept at each tool.

In the future, you might want to post your specifc questions in the forum specific to the tool in question (e.g. SageRecorder vs. SageTV). It also helps to make separate postings for unrelated questions.

Good luck w/ Sage! I'm pretty sure it will give you all you have with TiVo and much, much more...

[dkardatzke]

To elaborate even more...

1. You can use as many cards as you have open PCI slots to put them in. We've tested it using 4 cards so far. The configuration you ask about is my exact setup - One lineup is Comcast Digital going through my Motorola DCT 2000 Box and my second lineup is Comcast Regular going through straight Coaxial split before the box. I use the IR-200L to change the channels on my Cable Box.

2. Nothing new to add on HDTV from what you saw on the other post.

3. There is a Girder export plugin available and the link to it is on our website. You can also use the remote control that comes with the TV tuner card. Or you can use an IRMan like I do with a Universal Remote. The possibilities are endless.

4. You can even span over multiple drives if you'd like.

5. Our intelligent recording is something new to PVR technology. We learn from your viewing habits what your interests are and base future recordings off those interests. You could never specify recordings and it would most likely record your favorites if you watch them on a regular basis.

For me, I watch Seinfeld a couple of times a week and I don't have to tell SageTV to record it. It knows I like it and it usually keeps and episode or two for me. Now if I wanted to record all the reruns I could do that as well through Favorites recordings.

Another example would be my wife watched the last season of the Bachelor so when the new season came on last week, SageTV automatically recorded it again because it's one of her interests.

I could go on and on regarding this so let me know if this sparks any other questions. You can also setup Favorites to record all first runs, re-runs or both if you'd like, just like TiVo.

6. We will be working on the User Interface for version 2.0.

If you have any other questions, let us know.

Dan

[dkardatzke]

I always cross posts with someone else

I'm also trying to figure out which smiles best exemplify my feelings at given times. Apparantly that's me rolling around laughing.

[JJarmoc]

Wow.. these answers are exactly what I had hoped for. The multiple tuner/capture device thing especially. As someone mentioned, multiple tivos can do the same thing sort of, but there's also multiple subscriptions, and two independent boxes to control (pre-HMO anyhow..)

My interests are primarily in SageTV, sorry for not specifying.

HD and the interface 'prettyness' are really ancillary concerns. HD would be awesome, and would really put SageTV at the head of the pack, but I'm not surprised it's not there now.. the interface thing is really just nit picking. With every other feature I can think of already being supported, it's pretty much the only negative thing I could think of to say :-) Making it skinnable would really help with the flexibility, and give everyone a layout that suits their needs.

I think you've convinced me to check out the trial version. I hadn't really been looking for a TiVo replacement, but if I can have multiple capture cards under one interface, that's a pretty compelling reason to switch.

Ohh, one last thing... any way to schedule recordings from a web interface?

Thanks a lot everyone! I'm really happy to see these detaild responses, and with all the answers I'd hoped for too!

[dkardatzke]

Currently we don't offer a web interface to SageTV. From what I hear some people have got it working with XP Remote Desktop, I know there has been discussions here on this and on avsforum.

[tlimon]

I know this is an old thread, but I was afraid of starting ANOTHER new one. My Question:

I have a lot of SageTV (2.0.20) scheduling conflicts with my single PVR250 (purchased June, 2004) Will adding another PVR250 help?

I only have extended basic cable (All analog). Do I just set up both cards to use the same channel lineup (2-82)?

Can you guide my bad-newbee-self through the setup? Are there any tricks I should know about before I buy the new card?

--tim

[Opus4]

Yes, a 2nd tuner would help alleviate some of the conflicts... unless you still have more than 2 shows it wants to record at the same time when you have 2 tuners.

You can set both to use the same lineup -- that's what I did: split the cable & hook it to both tuners.

- Andy

[tlimon]

Did you ever see Quick Draw McGraw? Thanks for the immediate assistance, I'm on my way to FRY's now!

--tim

[tlimon]

Do I need to install the drivers/Hauppauge apps again? or will it work with the existing set for my original card?

[kny3twalker]

the only thing you need to install is the driver when you get the card into the computer
you only need to run the update if you plan to use the remote from the pvr 250
and then of course the remote.exe

if you are using the hauppauge remote with the first card then just install the system's driver and no need to run the pvr update.exe

[tlimon]

Okay, I added the new PVR250 card (same exact rev as the existing card) It worked well except when I went to the live TV guide and toggled watching two different shows. It switched tuners once, but then each tuner went black. Menus worked, pre-recorded shows worked, but no live tv on either card. I'm using the latest Hauppage drives. Uninstalled and reinstaled the drivers, but no soap. I'll take the card back because the WAF* is really good now and I dont want to mess it up.

(*Wife Affinity Factor)

[kny3twalker]

is your old pvr 250 a model 48xxx and has a heatsink ?
cause if you are mixing an old and new model pvr 250 you need to use the new drivers posted in the hardware section
they called mixed drivers because you are mixing two generations of cards
multi tuner should be a piece of cake

also make sure neither tuner is being ignored in the properties file

does the device manager say the drivers are all cool
you may want to try this as well

if they are the same model
you may want to fresh install the drivers for both and then install the update for both
use the hcw.clear.exe to remove the drivers and software

but I would not return it unless you are planning to get another one cause you think this one is bad though
this relly should be easy to deal with

I do not think your pvr 250 is an older model but just in case
june 2004 <=

well I would definitely give a driver reinstall for both cards a shot
also make sure this is not some decoder issue what are you using?

also you can post what IRQs the pvr 250s are using

system tools => system information

[tlimon]

Nope, Both boards are identical and have "32032, Rev B326" on the RF enclosure. The Conexant chip says "CX23416-12, G4022170, 0408".

The device manager reports no conflict in IRQ's.

Both cards showed up in SageTV and were configured to use the same cable, service level, and channel lineup.

[tlimon]

Okay, It works now, Here's what I did:

Run Hwclear.exe
Uninstall SageTV
reboot, wait for autodiscovery of the first card
point the installer to the new Hauppauge drivers
repeat for second card
run PVR250_18_22037.exe
run ir32_235_2105.exe
run WinTV2000 application version 4.3_22033
Install SageTV
Run restart IR from the hauppauge menu
Edit sage properties to remove the ignored encoder
Reboot

Dance the "Dance of Joy"

So far it switches fine, I can record one, watch another, record both, watch each. I only pray for long term stability because, as we all know:

Stability is directly proportional to the WAF, Right?

Thanks for the advice

--tim

[tlimon]

Sage Client now complains when I try to watch live TV from one of the cards. I get an error: "Unable to find the specified audio renderer filter, ErrCode=0x80070057" Sometimes its 0x80040207. Any Clues? I've already reinstalled and blown away the sageTVClient preferences on my PC.

[mls]

What decoder are you using? Your list of installation items doesn't seem to show having installed the Hauppauge (Intervideo non CSS) decoder.

If you have that installed, in SageTV settings set it to be used for both the video and audio decoders.

The renderers would normally be set at default (unless you've got some specific need to do otherwise).

I've had 2 PVR-250's running together for quite some time and have no real problems with them. I also have a USB-2 and it usually works pretty well (seems to be some minor klinkerS, maybe need new drivers for it, but that's just my USB-2).

It wasn't until I later added a Roslyn that I started having problems. I do NOT have anything good to say about the Roslyn cards, so I won't comment further on those here.

[tlimon]

I figured it out.

I reinstalled Java on the Client PC. All is well now with the wm9 decoder and the Sonic Renderer. It's like addign a card means you have to reinstall *everything* from the driver level up. Is that common with video apps like this?

[kny3twalker]

oh by the way you od not need to install winTV
or the decoder
but glad it all worked out
the stablity should be awesome
I never have a problem