HTPC tradeoffs

[bastian74]

Some things I'm noticing about using a HTPC to view tv is that the TV usually does a better job upconverting video and deinterlacing than the video card software does. I wish there was a way sage would operate in the native resolution so that the tv could handle the video processing. As it is, the computer is always operating in 1080p, and the video card software manages all the scaling and processing which means all the advanced real time hardware processing the tv is built to do is never utilized.

Flipping between stb->tv and htpc->tv for non native resolution shows I see much better quality on the stb->tv

[Djc208]

Are the STB and HTPC running in through the same type of connection? The TV may do minimal (or no) picture modification from certain inputs. So no change in the HTPC would get the same results.

Otherwise the scaling of the TV will be based on the input signal (resolution and video type). You might be able to set the HTPC output resolution lower which would let the TV upscale all of it, but what looks good with SD TV usually looks bad with computer graphics, and the TV won't know the difference. The computer graphics tend to get soft and blurry rather than crisp and sharp.

You can usually get similar or superior results with good hardware/software setup on the HTPC. Check the video drivers to make sure you're using all their video features, make sure you're doing a high quality capture of the video, and set the video resolution to match your TV's native resolution.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by bastian74

Some things I'm noticing about using a HTPC to view tv is that the TV usually does a better job upconverting video and deinterlacing than the video card software does. I wish there was a way sage would operate in the native resolution so that the tv could handle the video processing. As it is, the computer is always operating in 1080p, and the video card software manages all the scaling and processing which means all the advanced real time hardware processing the tv is built to do is never utilized.

Flipping between stb->tv and htpc->tv for non native resolution shows I see much better quality on the stb->tv

Just curious, what TV do you have, and what video processor is in it?

What video card, and video decoder are you using in Sage?

In what way is the quality better?

[bastian74]

Samsung current model 67" DLP. It has anti-interlacing and upconverting that seems to do a very good job handing 480 images from the STB, where the same content from the hd pvr is pretty soft.

The STB would be sending 480 to the tv, and the tv upconverts it to 1080 and the HTPC upconverts it first, then sends it to the tv in 1080p.

[stanger89]

"soft", sounds like a decoder issue. What decoder, and video card do you have?

[bastian74]

See my thread titled "Which codec do you use" posted today.

In short,
Arcsoft, CoreAVC, Cyberlink, ffdshow
ATI HD 3870 (hardware and software decoding)

HTPC set to 1920x1080@60

That's the other thing about HTPC, it wont automatically scale down to 24p for blu-ray movies, they will be upconverted to 60p

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by bastian74

See my thread titled "Which codec do you use" posted today.

In short,
Arcsoft, CoreAVC, Cyberlink, ffdshow
ATI HD 3870 (hardware and software decoding)

Well I've read Arcsoft is "soft", CoreAVC I wouldn't expect good deinterlacing from (since it's software), same with ffdshow. I'd expect, Cyberlink, if you've got it configured for hardware deinterlacing should do a good job though. Seems to work pretty well on mixed-content DVDs at least.

That's the other thing about HTPC, it wont automatically scale down to 24p for blu-ray movies, they will be upconverted to 60p

No, it won't automatically but you can set it to 24Hz, and I think reclock+powerstrip can actually auto change framerate based on format.

[bastian74]

Thats the other thing, the tv has purpose built hardware to do deinterlacing but since we're processing it up to 1080p beforehand that tech is never used.

[Ryokurin]

Originally Posted by bastian74

Thats the other thing, the tv has purpose built hardware to do deinterlacing but since we're processing it up to 1080p beforehand that tech is never used.

If ATI's software is like Nvidia's you can set it to 1080i and see if it can process that. And while we are at it, it may have an option to tell the video card to let the tv handle the scaling.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by bastian74

Thats the other thing, the tv has purpose built hardware to do deinterlacing but since we're processing it up to 1080p beforehand that tech is never used.

That "purpose built hardware" isn't always very good. And I'd say perhaps rarely (save stuff like Reon/Genum/HQV) is it better than ATI or nVidia's hardware deinterlacing.

[Jesse]

Hi,

I would have to agree that the arcsoft decoders are sub-par for SD. I use them for playback of HDPVR recordings and I am satisfied with the results. For SD I am still using the nvidia decoder. On my 720p plasma SD PQ from sage very closely rivals the output directly from the STB.

Tuners do make a difference. I am very happy with my ATI 650 analog tuners.

Jesse

[myoung84]

Originally Posted by bastian74

Samsung current model 67" DLP. It has anti-interlacing and upconverting that seems to do a very good job handing 480 images from the STB, where the same content from the hd pvr is pretty soft.

The STB would be sending 480 to the tv, and the tv upconverts it to 1080 and the HTPC upconverts it first, then sends it to the tv in 1080p.

OT: How do you like that TV? I am considering purchasing either the 61" or 67" Samsung LED DLP very soon. I record in SD from DirecTV boxes and output to the TV with an HD Extender. Do you think I will be happy with the picture quality? I am also worried about the TV not being bright enough, does yours appear to be dark?

Sorry to threadjack, back OT now.

[bastian74]

Originally Posted by myoung84

OT: How do you like that TV? I am considering purchasing either the 61" or 67" Samsung LED DLP very soon. I record in SD from DirecTV boxes and output to the TV with an HD Extender. Do you think I will be happy with the picture quality? I am also worried about the TV not being bright enough, does yours appear to be dark?

Sorry to threadjack, back OT now.

Mine is soft in the upper left corner and red convergence seems to be off by a pixel or two which from what I read is within tollerance for samsung. It's not something that is adjustable by software either. However each one is unique as it's a physical charecteristic of the alignment of the mirrors and lenses etc.

I only see the effect with computer text at 1080p in the upper left area, as it appears fuzzy. It doesn't affect video quality at all. Like I said though, that's just mine.

It's plenty bright for me, colors are great, lots of inputs and adjustments. By default the PC display will be "too big" to see the edges. You can adjust that in your video card drivers usually, and if not the tv can do it for you if you hook it up to the port designated for PCs, the the tv tends to alias text pretty bad when you let it do the scaling so I prefer the video card drivers.

Oh, the last complaint is that the PIP tunner is SD Analog only, it won't show any of the line-in sources or DTV channels which makes it pretty worthless. That said I never use PIP.

For the price these minor issues don't bother me. The picture quality is great for movies and it's freakin huge.

FYI, that tv has a "official" thread at http://www.avsforum.com/

Oh and that blue ring light under the tv can be turned off in the tv setup menu.