Sage Server build question

[iammike]

Hi all,

I've been running Sage for a couple years now. My current setup is 3 hd200's and 1 hd100 with my server residing on a desktop PC with a q6600 CPU. My Sage sources on the server are an HDHomerun, an HDPVR, and the MyTheatre network encoder. There are about a dozen USB attached external drives, an external sata drive and several internal sata recording drives. Besides Sage I use it for video editing, controlling my Cband satellite dish with MyTheatre, light MS-Office use and the Internet. Unfortunately the motherboard is going bad in my desktop. I'm thinking of splitting off my Sage server onto a dedicated box that will still have the HDPVR and HDHomerun sources as well as all of the USB attached drives and of course the recording drives. I don't run comskip and very sparingly run placeshifter.

Money is a little tight right now so I was thinking about buying this combo from Newegg to use for the basis of a new server build:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboB...t=Combo.311365

It seems like this should be sufficient but wanted to get some second opinions before making the purchase. What does everyone think?

Thanks,
Mike

[cansat]

If you Build it from scratch do it right and use:
http://www.supermicro.com/products/s...YS-7046A-3.cfm

Started out doing the same as you. but buy the time I thought I was done I did realize I was only half there. Ended up spending more than I had to.

Like Mike Holmes says ...
If you're going to do something, do it right the first time.

[iammike]

Originally Posted by cansat

If you Build it from scratch do it right and use:
http://www.supermicro.com/products/s...YS-7046A-3.cfm

Started out doing the same as you. but buy the time I thought I was done I did realize I was only half there. Ended up spending more than I had to.

Like Mike Holmes says ...
If you're going to do something, do it right the first time.

Thanks for the reply. I've been earning a living with PC's for about 20 years, so I'm not too worried about the actual build. I just want to be sure the new server isn't underpowered. I'd be going from a 2.4GHz quad-core to a 2.5GHz dual-core. Since there won't be much placeshifting and no comskip, I'm pretty sure I'll be okay. I may actually see a very minimal performance improvement. I was just hoping someone with a similar build would chime in to confirm.

[cjalphonso]

Have you read the reviews on that motherboard??? They don't look so good. I've recently built a stand alone Sage server and I used the E5200 and have had no problems with speed. The cpu never reaches 50%. I run two hd200's, with comskip active at all times. Another words by the time the program is finished recording, commercial skip is available. So far (3 months) no issues.

I typically cannot find a bundle with everything I like in it. And I usually find you don't save much.
I'm also not a big fan of neweqq....bad hard drives from poor packaging. I use tigerdirect and have had great service.
This is the motherboard I've been using, it has an onboard HDMI (which I don't use yet) with 3 pci slots for internal tuners, which is getting rare.
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicati...907&CatId=1533

[iammike]

Thanks for the reply. I've actually been a Newegg customer for years. They've always been great to deal with. I've never had any issues. Can you point me to some of the reviews you're referring to? Looking at the Newegg customer reviews, the Gigabyte board seems to be faring quite a bit better than the EVGA.

Originally Posted by cjalphonso

Have you read the reviews on that motherboard??? They don't look so good. I've recently built a stand alone Sage server and I used the E5200 and have had no problems with speed. The cpu never reaches 50%. I run two hd200's, with comskip active at all times. Another words by the time the program is finished recording, commercial skip is available. So far (3 months) no issues.

I typically cannot find a bundle with everything I like in it. And I usually find you don't save much.
I'm also not a big fan of neweqq....bad hard drives from poor packaging. I use tigerdirect and have had great service.
This is the motherboard I've been using, it has an onboard HDMI (which I don't use yet) with 3 pci slots for internal tuners, which is getting rare.
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicati...907&CatId=1533

[big poppa pump]

Originally Posted by cjalphonso

Have you read the reviews on that motherboard??? They don't look so good. I've recently built a stand alone Sage server and I used the E5200 and have had no problems with speed. The cpu never reaches 50%. I run two hd200's, with comskip active at all times. Another words by the time the program is finished recording, commercial skip is available. So far (3 months) no issues.

I typically cannot find a bundle with everything I like in it. And I usually find you don't save much.
I'm also not a big fan of neweqq....bad hard drives from poor packaging. I use tigerdirect and have had great service.
This is the motherboard I've been using, it has an onboard HDMI (which I don't use yet) with 3 pci slots for internal tuners, which is getting rare.
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicati...907&CatId=1533

I have the the EP45-UD3P and I can tell you one thing..this is a kick-a$$ motherboard. Most of the people who write negative reviews at newegg are morons.
I bought this board when it first came out and it's still kicking butt. There is an extremely long thread, which as a matter of fact is still going on at xtremesystems.org on this board's prowess.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...ight=ep45-ud3p

And just as iammike said, I have been a newegg customer for years now and have had nothing but top notch service from them. They have even helped me out when they are not at fault. Yes, they are notorious for their OEM hard drive packaging, but I have yet to have any problems with the hard drives I have received from them this way.

@iammike
That is an excellent combo indeed and I would have absolutely no hesitation if I were to buy it myself.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by iammike

Thanks for the reply. I've been earning a living with PC's for about 20 years, so I'm not too worried about the actual build. I just want to be sure the new server isn't underpowered. I'd be going from a 2.4GHz quad-core to a 2.5GHz dual-core. Since there won't be much placeshifting and no comskip, I'm pretty sure I'll be okay. I may actually see a very minimal performance improvement. I was just hoping someone with a similar build would chime in to confirm.

On the horsepower question. My server is an Athlon XP 1800, and I run an R5000, HD PVR, and an HDHR and don't have any horsepower issues. Any comskip I do is done by my i7 desktop.

[Fuzzy]

I would also agree that you can save some decent money up front, and quite a bit in the long haul, by building a very low powered server. The thing is on 24/7, so power savings really DO make an impact.

Hoestly, something like this would be more than sufficient for non-playback sagetv server duties. http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboB...t=Combo.314706

You can even go single-core, if you are just running sage, and it won't realy impact you that much (and single core semprons are almost free).. 35W FTW...

[cjalphonso]

My bad, I read the first 3 reviews on neweggs site, looks like they got bad copies. Interesting with the EVGA reviews, I've had no problems with both of mine. I noticed on tigerdirect's site the reviews have been bad only after I purchased mine. Perhaps a bad batch. Either way I think your fine. I just liked the HDMI and the DVI outs on the EVGA.

[SWKerr]

I would not by an Intel 775 machine at this point. They are near the end of their run and upgrade options will be limited. You would also need a Video Card as well driving up the price. AMD offers better value at this price point. Also: the combo deal usually include some overpriced items to make them look better. Look for free shipping deals instead.


Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 ST3500418AS 500GB 7200 $54.99
ASUS M4A785TD-V EVO AM3 AMD 785G HDMI ATX AMD Motherboard $91.99
CORSAIR 2GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 Desktop Memory $49.99
AMD Athlon II X2 240 2.8GHz Socket AM3 65W Dual-Core Processor $58.99

$255.96 Total with no Shipping and Includes decent video. Love NewEgg

[iammike]

Stranger, Fuzzy,

I think I may already have an old PC that will meet my needs. It's an old 3Ghz Pentium 4. I'll have to check the memory, I think it only has 1GB but I'd think that would be sufficient since it will be a dedicated server. Do you guys agree?

SWKerr,

That looks like a good option too. I'm a bit of an Intel bigot so if I buy, I'll probably stick with the combo deal. I already have a spare video card I can use.

cjalphanso,

No problem. I think all these manufacturers can get bad runs. I tend to go with the components that have very large install bases though. I figure they've had a larger number of users so hopefully most of the bugs are worked out.

Thanks to all!

[Fuzzy]

the P4 3GHz with 1GB will probably work okay, but it wil be a power hog compared to the newer units. The more modern, efficient processors (celeron, sempron), with integrated graphics will save quite a lot of juice. Assuming you are paying about 13 cents/kWhr, savings 100W on a build will save $114/year in electric. Would easily pay for itself in the long haul, and you'd have newer components. I've given up on building from old components, I've had too many aged components fail over the years, taking down the family's entertainment, that it's worth the up front cost to keep the WAF/KAF up.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by iammike

Stranger, Fuzzy,

I think I may already have an old PC that will meet my needs. It's an old 3Ghz Pentium 4. I'll have to check the memory, I think it only has 1GB but I'd think that would be sufficient since it will be a dedicated server. Do you guys agree?

It's probably fine, especially if you don't run anything (or much) else on the machine.

SWKerr,

That looks like a good option too. I'm a bit of an Intel bigot so if I buy, I'll probably stick with the combo deal. I already have a spare video card I can use.

FWIW, I am again too, they just seem to work better. My AMD systems have generally been fine, but the intel desktop I just built works better all around. Little things like the wireless mouse waking it from S3 work, which I've never managed on an AMD system.

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

the P4 3GHz with 1GB will probably work okay, but it wil be a power hog compared to the newer units. The more modern, efficient processors (celeron, sempron), with integrated graphics will save quite a lot of juice. Assuming you are paying about 13 cents/kWhr, savings 100W on a build will save $114/year in electric. Would easily pay for itself in the long haul, and you'd have newer components. I've given up on building from old components, I've had too many aged components fail over the years, taking down the family's entertainment, that it's worth the up front cost to keep the WAF/KAF up.

You might want to take a look at this thread:
http://forums.sage.tv/forums/showthr...ht=power+study

FWIW, I don't think you'll save 100W with new parts.

[sic0048]

I ran a SageTV server on my P4 3.0 ghz machine for a long time before just recently upgrading. I was only running 1 gb ram I think (I may have upgraded to 2 gb at some point). It worked great and I run a HDHR and a HD-PVR as my tuners.

Obviously with that setup, you cannot use it for playback (I used extenders) or running Comskip, etc. But I was even using the machine to run my home automation software as well. It is pretty lights, so it wasn't a large burden on the system, but I think there was power to spare in that setup.

[cjalphonso]

I tried using an old Dell P4 1.6 originally and it just didn't work for me. I'm pretty sure the reason was the bus speed, it just couldn't handle the traffic. It did really strange things with the tuner as well, I thought I had really bad reception, but come to find out it just couldn't handle what the card was putting out fast enough. I almost dumped sage until I built the sage server. I've been happy ever since.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by stanger89

It's probably fine, especially if you don't run anything (or much) else on the machine.



FWIW, I am again too, they just seem to work better. My AMD systems have generally been fine, but the intel desktop I just built works better all around. Little things like the wireless mouse waking it from S3 work, which I've never managed on an AMD system.



You might want to take a look at this thread:
http://forums.sage.tv/forums/showthr...ht=power+study

FWIW, I don't think you'll save 100W with new parts.

New comparable parts, probably not, but the newer low power processors (like the celeron and sempron), combined with integrated graphics, and most importantly, newer, more comprehensive power management schemes, probably WOULD end up saving quite a bit. Keep in mind, I was recommending possibly going to a Sempron II single-core, whose power load at max power is <40W. Compared to the P4 3.0GHz he's running now at close to 155, with less potential savings from power management, and you can see a significant savings. Include the improvements in the on-board graphics, and the situation improves even more.

[SWKerr]

I have both Intel and AMD and am a slave to price\performance. If you are an Intel only kind of guy I would hold out for a i3 setup.

Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 ST3500418AS 500GB 7200 $54.99
CORSAIR 2GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 Desktop Memory $49.99

Intel Core i3-530 Clarkdale 2.93GHz LGA 1156 73W Dual-Core
GIGABYTE GA-H55M-S2H LGA 1156 Intel H55 HDMI Micro ATX
Combo Price $201.98

Total up to $315 shipped.

The full ATX motherboards are still in the $150 range but a Micro ATX will fit in a ATX case. With 2 PCI and 2 PCIe I bet you are still covered. I have very few cards anymore.

[jpimlott]

I just built a headless SAGETV server with an ATOM 330 processor. It is doing playon as well. Recording from a HDPVR. The board was 90 bucks and draws a whopping 40 watt according to a killawatt meter. I even use it for surfing the web when not trancoding for playon. My I7 desktop was the sage server before is drawing about 190 watts at idle. I figured it was about 13 bucks a month in power and I am on solar rates. I buy power over what i generate at a much lower rate than standard customers.

John

[chrisc983]

Originally Posted by jpimlott

I just built a headless SAGETV server with an ATOM 330 processor. It is doing playon as well. Recording from a HDPVR. The board was 90 bucks and draws a whopping 40 watt according to a killawatt meter. I even use it for surfing the web when not trancoding for playon. My I7 desktop was the sage server before is drawing about 190 watts at idle. I figured it was about 13 bucks a month in power and I am on solar rates. I buy power over what i generate at a much lower rate than standard customers.

John

I've been debating on switching to an ION processor and motherboard but I'm pretty happy with my current build. Its drawing about 150watts idle and around 200watts on load according to killawatt with 7 hds and Q6700. How many hds are you currently using and what expandability do you have? Also what case are you using? I'm also using the EP45-UD3P and have had it for about a year or so and havn't had any issues.

[jpimlott]

Originally Posted by chrisc983

I've been debating on switching to an ION processor and motherboard but I'm pretty happy with my current build. Its drawing about 150watts idle and around 200watts on load according to killawatt with 7 hds and Q6700. How many hds are you currently using and what expandability do you have? Also what case are you using? I'm also using the EP45-UD3P and have had it for about a year or so and havn't had any issues.

update on the atom
It does not seem to able to reliable do playon and sage server. So video work, some work for while then get jumpy. The cpu is 100% during that time.
The ATOM motherboard has 2 sata, 1 ide, and one pci slot slot.

All of my storage is on an UNRAID NAS server I built. It has 6 drives in it and growing. It uses a sudio raid 4 arrangment. one parity drive for all the data drives plus caching driver to speed writing to the NAS. I can copy from the nas as high as 40Mbytes a sec so far.

So the ATOM is only doing sage server and encoding from the HDPVR. It has been very stable so far. a big improvement from when it was running on the I7 with everything else.

John