Running Freeview and Freesat tuners within single EPG

[emotionnotion]

Folks,

been very happy with my 2 HD Homeruns for DVB-T transmissions.

Decided to bite the bullet as add a DVB-S/S2 Dual tuner to my system so I can receive HD channels and one or two channels which are weaker on DVB-T

At present I run the tuners using XMTV/Digiguide all using the same channel line-up.

How do I add the new HD-specific channels into my Sage EPG in the simplest manner without confusing my EPG import and the family when using the Sage Guide?

Thanks

[matterofrecord]

sorry totally messed up first post ( below ). I assumed HD homeruns had UK HD tuners but they don't. My mistake.


for your satelite only channels

Your best bet is probably to add them with sage tv throught the usual method ( if there are more than one then use the epg from the first tuner for the second tuner ie in "setup video sources" click on the epg line up and select "use or copy an existing channel lineup for this source" select " use the same channel line up " but you probably already know this ). you'll have to get rid of all the rubbish you don't need ( almost all of satellite imo) and to give the dvb-s2 channels and the satellite only channels a seperate a unique number in the line up.

for the dvb-t and satellite channels IF you are getting rid of the dvb-t channels and replacing them with the same channels from satellite then just use the method above. give each an easy to use unique logical channel number.

However if you are planning on using the same channels from satellite and from dvb-t then you will have to remap your satelite channels to your dvb-t channels. the method is outlined below.( you can ignore the rest and just start at step 1)


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edit number 2 - just realised you posted asking for info on sandy heath - sandy heath has HD freeview. you could get free view from dvb-t2 however it sounds like your recpetions is a bit rubbish. maybe satellite is the way forward perhaps it is you tuners though?? I know from experience that my usb tuners have not been as good as my pci and pci-e tuners.
http://www.ukfree.tv/shutdowndetail.php?tx=TL204494 will give you a map so you can figure out how far from the tuner you are.







sorry I don't know but I can take a guess

I would suggest remapping the HD channels to the HD channels already in the tv guide.

but first a warning
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( NOTE: because dvb-t2 and dvb-s2 are different channels they may ,because of regional variations, have different line ups. the freesat is a one size fits all for britian ( as far as I know ) the dvb-t2 channels may have some regional variation. I honestly don't know as I don't have a dvb-s2 tuner or the time to compare. this may mean that while your regional bbc HD is showing a rugby match in HD on the dvb-t2 the freesat channel dvb-s2 bbc HD is showing a film for all of the UK on the ) . I may be wrong on this and stand very open to corection. It's just a thought I'm putting out there.
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heres a very rough outline to remapping channels

STEP 1

go to video source setup and make sure your satellite HD channel does NOT have the same "logical" channel number as the "logical" channel number for your HD from your dvb-t2.
eg
if your bbc hd dvb-t2 tuner has a logical channel number of 4
make sure that the bbc hd dvb-s2 tuner has a logical channel number that is NOT 4. any other number will do.
( they probably won't share the same number but if they do then it will make step 2 will be very difficult )

Step 2

next you've got to remap you HD channels from your dvb-s2 to the the HD channels on your dvb-t2 line up. In this example I'm going to use "bbc hd" just for claritys sake.

so in "setup video sources" go to your dvb-s2 tuner and then "channel setup". In your dvb-s2 lineup find the HD channel you want to remap select "remap this channel" on the right hand plane.

On the next screen you then want to select "remap Station:bbc HD". On the right is a massive list of all the possible channels it could be remapped to complete with name and number. you will have to scroll through this list and find the dvb-t2 version of the HD channel you are remapping to. So in this example you are looking for the dvb-t2 version of bbc hd. once you have found the dvb-t2 channel you want to highlight it and select "yes remap the logical channel XXX on this line up"

This should mean that you have added a dvb-s2 source to the already existing line up for the dvb-t2. As long as they always broadcast the same programs you should be alright. It might be an idea to check that it is working firstly. you then repeat for all the channels - simples

HOWEVER IF YOU ARE JUST INTERESTED IN ADDING MORE HD CHANNELS THERE IS ANOTHER WAY

I only have 1 usb HD tuner but I can record as many programs as I like from that tuner as long as they all come from the same frequency. Currently all the HD channels come from the one frequency. I do this using a brilliant peice of software called LM DVB Smart Recorder from http://www.lmgestion.net/. Its the same company/ guy that brought us the sage xmltv importer. so you know it's going to be useful


the short version is that LM gestion you can configure physical tuners as network tuners. the beauty is that you can make as many network tuners out of just one physical tuner as long as you use the same physical frequnecy. this is because the tuner hardware just tunes to the the frequency not the actual channel so you can configure your tuners to get all the channels broadcast on one frequency by making multiple network tuners from one physical tuner.

eg I can make 8 Freeview HD tuners ( as far as sage see's them ) from 1 physical HD tuner. It is a complicated and time consuming to setup if you have a lot of tuners. But as long as your methodical and check your work you should be able to get as many HD channels as you want from one HD tuner. you can of course use LM DVB Smart Recorder with any type of tuner dvb-2 dvb-s2 dvb-t dvb-t2. this enables you to get all the channels from all 6 freeview tuner groups with just 6 tuners. npvr and terratecs bundled software can also do this BUT they are not as easy or pleasant to use as sagetv.

I should point out that I have physical tuners already connected to my computer. HD-homerun tuners are different and may already work as network tuners ( i do not know I do not have an HD home run tuner ) he offeres a demo but it's limited to one tuner.

I should also point out that A) you may need quite a few restarts etc, B) once a network tuner is added to sage with LM DVB Smart Recorder it isn't obvious how to remove it - so label clearly c) network tuners tend to take about a minute to start up so it can seem a long wait if your wanting to surf the channels. d) It is probably best to sand box it in another installation so you get the hang of it ( then gain you might no tmake the mistakes I made )

I highly recommend LM DVB Smart Recorder . at 15 euros or pounds or what ever it really adds a lot to sagetv ( imo)

Any Hope this helps. No guarantees post back if you need any other pointers. I'll see what I can do.

j

[emotionnotion]

Phew! that's a response and some

I will work through this.

I have purchased the TBS 6981 PCI-e dual tuner S2 card. as you say, I already have the HDHomerun tuners pooled using a single XMLTV lineup.

It seems to me, if I just use the Freesat tuner for the HD and EXTRA channels, assign a different number in the lineup I should be fine as long as SageTV see both tuners and, will accept an identical channel lineup (XMLTV 2 HD) for each I should be gold?

The question remains whether I need to install the LMGestion tuner pool utility to utilise both tuners in Sage. I guess I will not know until I install the card at the weekend.

Thanks

[matterofrecord]

Lm dvb smart viewer should not be necessary for any sage installation.

I have just personnally found it a useful addition for allowing multiple channels from 1 frequency on 1 physical tuner.

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The reason I suggested Lm dvb
The reason I suggested Lm dvb was because I wrongly thought HD homerun could tune to HD dvb-t2. so I wrongly assumed you already had dvb-t2 hd channels and just wanted to add some more HD tuners. that is why I suggested LM gestion dvb smart recorder.
had the HD homerum been able to recieve dvb-t2 channels you could have used £15 LM gestion software to get all the hd channels you wanted from one physical tuner and hence save yourself a lot of money. However seeing as the HD home run cannot get any HD channels in the uk the software would be a waste of money.
( I have NO idea why and this would seem to go against all logic however I have found that signal reception is sightly better with lmdvb smart recorder. I can't explain but that is what seems to be happening )

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Although sage should find both your tuners if it doesn't you may find you need to use dvblogic DVBLink TVSource if the tuners don't work. DVBLink TVSource acts as a bridge between tuners that don't natively work with a media application and the application itself. a tuner set up to dvblogic cannot provide multiple channels from one frequency (like lmgestion dvb) but can be tuned to any frequency you like. so it would work much more like a native sagetv tuner except with a driver bridge for compatability.

again you'd only need DVBLink TVSource if you didn't get all the tuners working with sage. the only reason to use it is if you are having trouble with sage recognising you tuner and even then theres no guarantee of it working ( personnally I would sandbox it first )

other people have written guides about it on the forum so use them for advice I've never needed to use DVBLink TVSource before.

on thing I don't understand is

I should be fine as long as SageTV <snip> will accept an identical channel lineup (XMLTV 2 HD) for each

if your using a dual tuner which sage sees as tuner0 and tuner1. you scan for channels in both. each time you select "do not use program guide data with this source". so you now have two tuners with identical duplicate line ups in the epg. both have an epg source as their own tuner. tuner0 epg source is tuner 0 and tuner1 epg source is tuner1. you then go to one of your dual tuners ( lets say tuner0) and set up the logical ( or guide ) channel numbers and enable the channels you want and dsable the channels you don't want. you then goto the setup page for the other tuner ( tuner 1 ) and change the epg source from tuner1 to tuner0 ( tuner0 being the tuner that has been ordered correctly and has only the channels you want ) . so you have two tuners tuner0 and tuner1 and they both use tuner0 as their epg source. so in the epg you now have two tuners using one line up. If its dvb-t there will be guide data. If the tuner is dvb-s there will be no guide although the channels names and numbers should be visible and two tuners will be using only one epg lineup.

you then configure your xml importer to assign the right info to the right channel. and you should be okay.

It only gets complicated if you want to have a channel from your dvb-s sources also tunning to channels that are in your dvb-t sources. Its easier to explain with an example.
say you have 2 dvb-t tuner tuning to
bbc1,2,3,4 itv1,2,3,4 chanel4 more 4 e4 film 4
and you have your new dvb-s/s2 channels from you 2 dvbs/s2 sources
if your dvb-s/2 sources tune purely to "satellite only" channels and NOT to any of the already existing dvb-t channels in your dvb-t lineup then you should already be setup to start importing guide data

however if you decide that you would like to have not only the dvb-t tuners but also the dvb-s/s2 tuners tuning to
bbc1,2,3,4 itv1,2,3,4 chanel4 more 4 e4 film 4
giving you 4 sources tuning to these channels ( 2 from dvb-t and 2 from dvb-s ) then to eliminate duplicate epg entries you will have to remap you dvb-s sources to your dvb-t line up. by remapping a channel ( say channel number 70 ) to a different channel ( say channel number 24 ) you are telling sage that this physical channel ( channel number 70) will now use the epg line up from ( channel number 24). this eliminate duplicates in the epg

so if you remap your 2 dvb-s bbc1s to your 2 dvb-t bbc1s you will only have one epg line up for bbc1 however there will be 4 tuners that can use it now ( your 2 dvb-t and your 2 dvb-s)


As long as you remapp the correct channels you should be fine.
however if you make a mistake and remapp your itv1 dvb-s to your bbc1 dvb-t then when you try and record the news at 10 on bbc from 10pm to 10:30pm if sage happens to pick the mistakenly mapped dvb-s tuner sage will think " this is a tuner I can use for bbc1 because someone remapped this tuner to the bbc1 epg line up". Sage will then record whatever is on itv1 (dvb-s) from 10pm to 10:30pm thinking its recording bbc1. However this only happens if you make a mistake. get it right and it is possible to have dvb-s and dvb-t tuners all working for a channel and only have one line up.

however if you keep your satelite for your satelie channels and your dvb-t tuners for your dvb-t channels then there is no need for complicated remapping. Remapping tuners is a hassle but it is useful option in some circumstances.



I'm not very good at explaining things so feel free to ask support or someone else. but I've probably made it sound more complicated that it really is.

ps - sorry for the lm gestion confusion