SageTV Recorder as only tuner server?

[GollyJer]

I'm looking to create a purely distributed setup but am worried about live tv network traffic.

Can I have a machine running Recorder and use the drive on it as the only drive a Sage machine uses for recorded tv?

The goal is minimal network activity. Let's say I start up live tv on the machine running Sage. Ideally the show would record directly to the drive on the Recorder machine and stream to the Sage machine. I'm worried it will encode on the Recorder machine, push to the Sage machine which will use it's UNC path to push back to the drive on the Recorder, then stream back to the Sage machine to be displayed.

Can someone shed some light on this for me. Thanks.

[stanger89]

Well firstly Recorder is a legacy product that's not been updated for a long time (doesn't support newer tuner cards). You don't need it to do recording, SageTV handles that. If you wish to setup an "encoding server", the recommended way is to use a second SageTV instance configured as an encoding server.

With the latest versions of SageTV it can be configured to "try" I'll say, to record to a local drive vs a network drive, but that can be overruled.

Also, if the Client can access the media file directly, it will, if not, then it gets streamed through the server. Same is true of recording I believe, recordings are made directly from encoder to recording directory.

[GollyJer]

Originally Posted by stanger89

Well firstly Recorder is a legacy product that's not been updated for a long time (doesn't support newer tuner cards). You don't need it to do recording, SageTV handles that. If you wish to setup an "encoding server", the recommended way is to use a second SageTV instance configured as an encoding server.

Thanks for the info stanger89.

It seemed like Recorder was old, but I had hoped it was meant for exactly what I want to do. Paying for a whole SageTV Media Center license seems like overkill to set up an "encoding server" (which is a good term for what I'd like to do). However, if Placeshifter can be used on the client machine then things look slightly more reasonable.

Does Placeshifter have the same customizable as Media Center or would I need Media Center on the client machine to use something like SageMC 16x9 skin?

Sorry if these seem like ridiculous questions. Things aren't perfectly clear on the Placeshifter product page and I'm Sage newb in the making.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by jgollehon

Thanks for the info stanger89.

It seemed like Recorder was old, but I had hoped it was meant for exactly what I want to do. Paying for a whole SageTV Media Center license seems like overkill to set up an "encoding server" (which is a good term for what I'd like to do). However, if Placeshifter can be used on the client machine then things look slightly more reasonable.

If you'd explain what exactly you want to do, we might be able to make better suggestsions. For example, I'm not sure how you'd have a recorder machine without a SageTV machine to control it. Or what you want to do where.

[blade]

You may already know this, but I'll explain it anyway because you've just recently joined the forums and I want to make sure you understand how everything works in a typical server/client setup.

You setup a copy of SageTV on your "server" that contains your storage and capture cards. All the recordings are made locally and of course you can play them back on the local machine. You can install client licenses on other computers on your network. When you watch liveTV on a client the show is recorded locally to the server's hard drive and streamed to the client for playback.

Network encoders are typically used when you can't add anymore tuners to your current server or need the additional server to be near a stb.

Placeshifter is sort of like a regular client license except it is designed to be used across the internet instead of a local network. If you intend to use it on your local lan you're better off with the client license.

As stanger said a little more explanation is necessary to figure out what you're trying to do.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by blade

As stanger said a little more explanation is necessary to figure out what you're trying to do.

And I was really trying to to be snotty like it sounded

[GollyJer]

Originally Posted by stanger89

And I was really trying to to be snotty like it sounded

No biggy. I don't read too much into tone on a forum. The way it sounds in your head and the way I read it are almost definitely different. For example, you sound exactly like JarJar Binx in my head.

Anyway, I'm trying to figure out the most cost efficient way to do client/server (a term with a loose interpretation in the PVR world) with Sage products.

Originally Posted by blade

You can install client licenses on other computers on your network. When you watch liveTV on a client the show is recorded locally to the server's hard drive and streamed to the client for playback.

When you guys say "client" you mean full SageTV Media Center correct?

Originally Posted by blade

Placeshifter is sort of like a regular client license except it is designed to be used across the internet instead of a local network. If you intend to use it on your local lan you're better off with the client license.

As stanger said a little more explanation is necessary to figure out what you're trying to do.

I'm stuck in BeyondTV conceptually, which is probably where I'm going wrong. With BTV, you can have a "server" running the full BTV software, and a "client" machine running BTV Link (basically a full version of the software without local tuner functionality that uses a BTV client as it's "server").

What I'm hoping for is a true client/server solution. The server would only be used for recording/encoding and storage. Multiple clients would be running the 10ft UI allowing for playback and recordings scheduling. However, recording is managed at the server, so if all client machines were turned off recordings would still take place. All clients see the same set of recordings, show the same amount of available recording space, resolve recording conflicts the same, and provide the exact same 10ft UI experience.

Is this doable with Sage?

[tmiranda]

I came from BTV as well and the topology is basically the same.

BTV (full license) = SageTV (full license) = server
BTV Link = SageClient = client

So yes, the server contains the capture cards and storage that is accessed by all of the clients. All of the clients see the exact same interface and recorded shows. This is exactly how I run my system.

I have a dedicated server that contains 2 capture cards and 2 drives. (I also have shows stored on a NAS, but that is another topic.) The server runs headless (no KB, mouse, or monitor). That machine runs a full copy of SageTV (about $80.) I then have 2 MediaMVP clients ($30 media extender license) and and two PC clients ($30 SageClient license).

Tom

[GollyJer]

OK, now I'm feeling a little stupid. I didn't see the SageClient license in the online store.

I guess the only question left is is SageClient fully customizable in all the same ways as SageTV?

And so I have your guy's terminology down:
SageTV Media Center = SageTV = client & server.
SageTV Client = SageClient = local area client only.
SageTV Placeshifter = PlaceShifter = WAN client only.

Am I on the right track?

[blade]

Originally Posted by jgollehon

I guess the only question left is is SageClient fully customizable in all the same ways as SageTV?

Yes

And so I have your guy's terminology down:
SageTV Media Center = SageTV = client & server.
SageTV Client = SageClient = local area client only.
SageTV Placeshifter = PlaceShifter = WAN client only.

Am I on the right track?

Pretty much; however, PlaceShifter can be used on a local network it just has some limitations. Some people use it on their home network because it works better on their wireless connection or because it is a "floating license" and can be installed on multiple computers, but only one of those can connect at a time where as the client license can only be installed on one computer.

[GollyJer]

Originally Posted by blade

Yes

Pretty much; however, PlaceShifter can be used on a local network it just has some limitations. Some people use it on their home network because it works better on their wireless connection or because it is a "floating license" and can be installed on multiple computers, but only one of those can connect at a time where as the client license can only be installed on one computer.

blade, thanks for all the great info.

One more. Is PlaceShifter customizable like SageTV?

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by jgollehon

Is PlaceShifter customizable like SageTV?

The way SageTV works allows any SageTV UI to select and use any STV -- which is the definition file that codes what the user interface can do & how it looks.

There are limitations regarding what various clients can do, for example: the Placeshifter client cannot play a DVD. So, there may be various UI features that are not available on certain clients, but the UI is customizable on each.

- Andy

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by jgollehon

No biggy. I don't read too much into tone on a forum. The way it sounds in your head and the way I read it are almost definitely different. For example, you sound exactly like JarJar Binx in my head.

And at least you read that like I intended, not as I typed it

Anyway, I'm trying to figure out the most cost efficient way to do client/server (a term with a loose interpretation in the PVR world) with Sage products.

Sounds like most of us. And I'm sure some of this has been covered by posts above/below, but I'm going to type anyway....

When you guys say "client" you mean full SageTV Media Center correct?

We mean SageClient:
http://store.sagetv.com/Merchant2/me...tegory_Code=SS

An "interface only" version, a "frontend" for SageTV.

SageTV Media Center is made up of the backend (sometimes referred to as "core") functionality, this does the recording (but is NOT SageRecorder) plus frontend functionality equivalent to SageClient.

I'm stuck in BeyondTV conceptually, which is probably where I'm going wrong. With BTV, you can have a "server" running the full BTV software, and a "client" machine running BTV Link (basically a full version of the software without local tuner functionality that uses a BTV client as it's "server").

Same here, SageTV Media Center is akin to BeyondTV and SageClient is akin to BTV Link. I say akin, because Sage includes the functionality of BeyondMedia as part of SageTV Media Center.

Sage provides, in addition, the SageTV Placeshifter, which is a somewhat streamlined version of SageClient, that is designed for streaming over the internet, and the SageTV Extender, which is a license for fully-functional software that runs on the Hauppauge Media MVP.

All of the above provide the same UI (well the Placeshifter/Extender have some N/A features disabled in the included STV), they can run the same STVs, and for the most part can access all the features.

SageTV Media Center and SageTV Client are the complete, full-up SageTV options, MC being the server, and Client for additional networked computers.

What I'm hoping for is a true client/server solution. The server would only be used for recording/encoding and storage. Multiple clients would be running the 10ft UI allowing for playback and recordings scheduling. However, recording is managed at the server, so if all client machines were turned off recordings would still take place. All clients see the same set of recordings, show the same amount of available recording space, resolve recording conflicts the same, and provide the exact same 10ft UI experience.

Is this doable with Sage?

Absolutely, that's how I have mine setup:

I have a headless server running SageTV, it's independent of everything else. It contains my tuners* and my storage, everything is recorded by and recorded to, this machine. It's an Athlon XP 1800+ with a Geforce MX video card FWIW. It's got an Avermedia A180 ATSC tuner and a PVR 250 (controlling a Dish 211 via a USB-UIRT).

I have my HTPC in my theater, that runs SageClient, and has all the bells and whistles hardware wise, Geforce 6800, Athlon 64 3400, nVidia "PureVideo" setup. I do my primary viewing on this. Anything that can be done on the server, I can, and do, do here.

I've also got an Extender on my TV in the family room, I use this for more casual viewing.

Now, here's where the * came in, and where you threw most of us. I've also got a "network encoder" setup. I've got a tuner in my desktop PC (separate from my server) that SageTV controls and uses just as if it were a local to the server. I happen to use one of the user-created network encoders, but you can use a second copy of SageTV Media Center.