Is it legal to placeshift cable TV?

[jal]

I thought about installing PlaceShifter at my Dad's house so that he could remotely use my SageTV software installed at my apartment. Then it occured to me that I am thereby cheating my cable TV company of a potential account at my Dad's house.

How could this possibly be legal? If I owned a cable TV company, I suppose I would be outraged if people were using the internet to share my content in homes all across the country.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by jal

I thought about installing PlaceShifter at my Dad's house so that he could remotely use my SageTV software installed at my apartment. Then it occured to me that I am thereby cheating my cable TV company of a potential account at my Dad's house.

SageTV Placeshifter is intended for your personal use so that you can watch your shows while away from your house, not for providing cable access to someone else. Similarly: recordings are for your personal use -- TV shows are copyrighted, so you would have the same copyright issue if you were to record a show & put it onto DVD or VHS tape and give that to someone else.

- Andy

[devinteske]

First: I am NOT a lawyer.

I agree with what he said. As a customer of the cable company, is it illegal for you to use a VCR and a VHS tape to record television? NO! Is it illegal to duplicate that tape and distribute it? YES!

In short... you MUST read the contract that you negotiated with your cable company (that thing that you probably didn't read before signing).

I can imagine that most, if not all, cable companies are aware that PVR software, DVRs, VHS, etc. exist. If you want to know what your cable company's policy on using them is, then I suggest you check out your contract and any online agreements.

For all legal matters, read the EULA for all the products involved in your dealings.

Cheers,
Devin

"Correct or incorrect, right or wrong, inside or outside,... progress in any direction is still progress."

[jal]

Thanks very much for the clarification. Previously I couldn't understand the legality of placeshifter. Obviously my Dad will have to buy cable TV for himself.

Since I really don't have much interest in watching TV away from home, I suppose I should have bought Client instead of placeshifter. No big deal, though.

[gplasky]

Originally Posted by jal

Thanks very much for the clarification. Previously I couldn't understand the legality of placeshifter. Obviously my Dad will have to buy cable TV for himself.

Since I really don't have much interest in watching TV away from home, I suppose I should have bought Client instead of placeshifter. No big deal, though.

Especially if you want to play a DVD disc on your machine with the Placshifter client. Placeshifter CAN'T play DVDs. SageTV client CAN.


Gerry

[jbarr]

I too am certainly not a lawyer, but I really think a lot goes into "intent". Say you recorded a show that you want your dad to see. I personally see no reason why he couldn't just fire up PlaceShifter and watch it. For one-off type stuff, this really shouldn't be any big deal. You know, kind of a "wink, wink" situation. On the other hand, if the intent is to replace a cable connection, then I would say that would not be legal. The think that the whole point is to enable as well as ensure fair use. Use it, just don't abuse it.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by jbarr

I too am certainly not a lawyer, but I really think a lot goes into "intent". Say you recorded a show that you want your dad to see. I personally see no reason why he couldn't just fire up PlaceShifter and watch it. For one-off type stuff, this really shouldn't be any big deal.

I don't believe that such intent would make much difference if someone somewhere wanted to complain. Looking at this comment from the question of what difference does one little thing make...

But officer, I wasn't going to keep that guy's car. I was just using it to run an errand and then I was going to put it back. I can't afford a car of my own. I've done this before & he didn't even notice, so what's the big dea?

Hey, I didn't take the entire pack of gum. I only took one piece. No one would miss one stick of gum and the store can afford it, so what's the big deal?

If you aren't allowed to take something, you aren't allowed to take any of it.

- Andy

[devinteske]

Originally Posted by jbarr

You know, kind of a "wink, wink" situation. On the other hand, if the intent is to replace a cable connection, then I would say that would not be legal.

I completely agree. Also, there's an aspect that you aren't looking at here. You are far more likely to be pushing your father towards getting a cable connection and sagetv for himself. You're basically advertising the amazing abilities of PVR software to your father. My theory is that the more often that he uses it, the more he's probably going to like it and eventually purchase cable + sage... no?

Kind of like the age-old argument of software pirates... "I want to try it out before I buy it." LOL

Cheers,
Devin

[ke6guj]

A friend of mine was commenting on the Slingboxes and how he and a friend both have slingobxes at each others houses in diferent states, just to get around the NFL blackout rules for their own local games. If it is blacked out, he will watch the game on his slingbox that has the game.

And there have been articles about the practice, http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/..._id=1000973572

[jbarr]

Originally Posted by Opus4

I don't believe that such intent would make much difference if someone somewhere wanted to complain.

Andy, I absolutely understand your point, and you are absolutely correct. Rules are rules are rules. Theft is theft. stealing is stealing.

But I think the point is that there are so many technological "conveniences" that are intended to be just that: conveniences. Unfortunately, they are so prone to abuse, and they will eventually either fall victim to the abuse, or they will be altered to prevent abuse (DRM, etc.)

I guess things like copyright laws, licensing agreements, and such simply wouldn't be needed if everyone had a reasonable respect for others' property. And while I believe that MOST people do have that reasonable respect, the problem is the minority who don't. And it's those who make such laws and policies necessary...

Originally Posted by ke6guj

A friend of mine was commenting on the Slingboxes and how he and a friend both have slingobxes at each others houses in diferent states, just to get around the NFL blackout rules for their own local games. If it is blacked out, he will watch the game on his slingbox that has the game.

...case in point.

[tmiranda]

Seems to me that if the OP is using placeshifter to watch TV and recordings while at this father's house, that is not stealing. If he has installed placeshifter at his father's house so his father can watch TV and recordings, that is stealing.