Is anyone still using the mlbdude style SageTV Recordings menu in the default STV?

[Opus4]

Just like the title says: Is anyone still using the mlbdude style SageTV Recordings menu in the default STV?


If so, have you tried using the malore style SageTV Recordings menu lately?

As of the v6.2 release, it can be configured to use double height rows on both the left & right columns, so it is more similar in appearance to the 2-pane mlbdude recording style.

Also: The malore version can use the new icon bar on the left. It has easier access to the customizable alternate views, so you can use one recordings menu to view your recordings in up to 6 different ways. Both of those bars will be able to be independently enabled in the next version. And, the malore menus continue to have many options for how recordings are filtered, grouped, and sorted.


Why am I asking? I am removing some old unused code in the default STV. The mlbdude recording style menu is not one that I maintain nor do I plan to add any new features to it.

So... if you use it, please check the malore menu & use the Options command to see if it can now be configured to your liking. Is there anything the mlbdude recordings menu does that isn't available in the malore menu?


If you really want to keep using the current mlbdude recordings menu, despite the fact that no new features will be added to it, please post now or don't complain later if it gets removed. If there are very very few requests to keep it, I will remove it. If people still want to use it, I will leave it as it is, so I'm not (yet?) saying that I'm definitely removing it.

Alternatively: if you like the mlbdude recordings menu and would like to maintain it as an import and perhaps add new features for it, please say that as well.

- Andy

[CollinR]

I am.

I'll tweak some and see but currently mlbdude's recording style is my style of choice.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by CollinR

I'll tweak some and see but currently mlbdude's recording style is my style of choice.

If by "tweak some and see", you mean you plan to see what the malore menus can do, let me know if there is something that you don't see in the malore menu that you are used to in the mlbdude menu. There may be a setting that can be suggested, or perhaps I could make a change to the STV.

- Andy

[heffe2001]

Could you just make the style you're wanting to remove a unsupported, unmaintained STVi that people could import into the later default STV's if they are wanting to keep it?

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by heffe2001

Could you just make the style you're wanting to remove a unsupported, unmaintained STVi that people could import into the later default STV's if they are wanting to keep it?

If someone else wants to create the import, sure.

- Andy

[sclamage]

I'm still using it too. Not so much because I prefer it, but because it's the least cluttered recording view in the new version. If there were an option to hide all the extra mudflaps and doohickeys that decorate the edges of the default view I'd use that instead.

Yes, the malore view is a bit less cluttered than the default view, but even that presents lots of useless data. For instance, it puts the episode ID before each title - that's the LEAST useful piece of information about the recording. That alone was enough to make me stop using it and revert to mlbdude.

Am I missing an option to declutter the default UI? (Please say yes.)

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by sclamage

Am I missing an option to declutter the default UI? (Please say yes.)

Nope -- feel free to carry on that part of the discussion here.

- Andy

[JREkiwi]

I was a solid user of the mlbdude SageTV Recordings until the left panel wasn't updated as part of the theme changes and it was suggested I re-try the malore view.

I've tried the malore view with double spacing and I've tried to like it, truly I have, but i don't like the way it handles movies and the detail that is displayed in the top panel.

I prefer the detail shown in the default and mlbdude views and I certainly like the left toolbar in the default view. I seem to be switching mostly between the default view and the mlbdude view, until the left panel theming drives me crazy. (not quite enough yet to make a serious attempt at fixing up the theme)

My preference would be for it to stay, but it needs the left panel theme fixed up for it to be of any real value.

John

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by JREkiwi

I've tried the malore view with double spacing and I've tried to like it, truly I have, but i don't like the way it handles movies and the detail that is displayed in the top panel.

What do you not like about how it handles movies? The fact that it puts the movies into the "Movie" group, or what?

- Andy

[JREkiwi]

Originally Posted by Opus4

What do you not like about how it handles movies? The fact that it puts the movies into the "Movie" group, or what?

It's the combined effect of the "Movie" group and the fact that the very poor EPG data that we import using an XMLTV plugin results in an Episode name of movie rather than having an MV prefix on the EPGID as a way of only getting one copy recorded.

So some movies end up being displayed in a group called Movies and the name displayed for all of them is Movie. I then need to highlight each individual one to be able to see the real name. I realize that on "real" epg data there would be no episode name, so it would work well. Maybe coding to ignore any episode name in the Movie group would be the answer.

John

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by JREkiwi

So some movies end up being displayed in a group called Movies and the name displayed for all of them is Movie. I then need to highlight each individual one to be able to see the real name. I realize that on "real" epg data there would be no episode name, so it would work well. Maybe coding to ignore any episode name in the Movie group would be the answer.

I wasn't really sure of any undesirable side effects of coding it to ignore the episode name just in certain circumstances, so I added a per-menu option to configure the right hand side episode listing style. For the double row height more, you can 1) display the extra info, like it currently does, 2) display the title + episode name, if there is an episode name, or 3) display just the title if there is no episode name, or just the episode name.

Option 2 is the same as the default recordings menu in double row height mode.

Single height rows have the same options, though #2 & #3 essentially remove the episode number while leaving most of the rest of it as-is.

What was your other issue?

- Andy

[sclamage]

Originally Posted by Opus4

Nope -- feel free to carry on that part of the discussion here.

Thanks for the pointer. If we can really have a simpler recording view in an upcoming version, then I withdraw my objection - by all means, clean out this old code.

But the current default view doesn't pass the WAF, by any stretch of the imagination. I think there's been enough input around the forum describing what's wrong with both the default and malore views, but I'll be glad to post detailed comments in an appropriate thread if there's a chance that it might directly lead to some improvements.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by sclamage

I think there's been enough input around the forum describing what's wrong with both the default and malore views,

My wife and daughters understand the malore menus perfectly well. And, I currently don't know of anything wrong with the malore menu system or of any bugs in it; it works exactly like I want it to... you simply have different preferences.

but I'll be glad to post detailed comments in an appropriate thread if there's a chance that it might directly lead to some improvements.

In this thread, I only want to hear about what is in the mlbdude menu that can't be done on the malore view & I'll consider making the appropriate changes.

You can always submit suggestions for the default recordings view to SageTV. (Suggestions or questions sent to them for the malore menu will most likely be ignored.)

As usual, making a suggestion doesn't guarantee it will be done...

- Andy

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by JREkiwi

It's the combined effect of the "Movie" group and the fact that the very poor EPG data that we import using an XMLTV plugin results in an Episode name of movie rather than having an MV prefix on the EPGID as a way of only getting one copy recorded.

I forgot to say: if your movies all have a category of "Movie", "Film", or whatever, you could use the category filter to remove all movies from the regular view & create a movies-only alternate view, where they can be grouped by something other than title - perhaps by Category or Star Rating. For now, I think that should help the current STV have the right side show the title instead of just "Movie".

Now that I regularly have over 50 movies recordings sitting there, I find that this helps narrow down what to watch.

- Andy

[JREkiwi]

Originally Posted by Opus4

I wasn't really sure of any undesirable side effects of coding it to ignore the episode name just in certain circumstances, so I added a per-menu option to configure the right hand side episode listing style. For the double row height more, you can 1) display the extra info, like it currently does, 2) display the title + episode name, if there is an episode name, or 3) display just the title if there is no episode name, or just the episode name.

Option 2 is the same as the default recordings menu in double row height mode.

Thanks Andy, sounds like a good solution. You never know what interesting side-effects conditional coding will throw up. I've created a movie view as you suggested and we'll see how long it takes us to forget that that's where all the movies have disappeared to.

Originally Posted by Opus4

What was your other issue?

With the malore menu font size option controlling the font size of all the text on the page and the fact that the panel sizes are based on the font size, I can't get a font that provides a nice balance between the panel sizes and the panel fonts. I like the look of the fonts in the mlbdude view where the font in the left panel is smaller (looks like about -2) than the font in the right panel and to my eyes, the balance between the size of the top and bottom panels of the default and mlbdude views is good.

Related to the fonts and panel sizing, I prefer the amount of detail that is shown in the top panel in the default and mlbdude views.

The malore view displays more information, but it is invariably truncated on most shows (unless I select a small font for the whole page and then the bottom panels are too small), whereas the mlbdude view only shows the detail that I'm interested in to select a show. If I want more detail, I look in the Recording Detail.

I also prefer the way that when scrolling in the left panel of the mlbdude view the top panel displays an episode list when selecting grouped items. I find that much easier to scan than the malore view which shows detail from the top entry of the group. This is the one my wife complains about most, but that's not why it's last.

I appreciate the work you've done already, in catering for us old mldudeans. Thanks

John

[CollinR]

I don't like the default styles single pane and filters, no real good reason just personal preference I guess. I really like having the division.

In mlbdude, selecting the series title brings a menu (with the option to turn off) that allows for delete all and convert all. I think thats a carry over from the new recording style, that menu kicks @ss, mush better then pre 6.2. The only thing I would add is the ability to delete all when there is only one recording.

Malore makes it a royal PITA to delete a single show, if you select something with only one episode left or right pane mine goes into playback with no menu popup. Thats really not desirable to me as most of my favorites I kill after watching, so I often don't ever have more then one of them. Yes, I could memorize the direct delete key on the MVP remotes. Nobody really wants to do that though, having it in the GUI is better.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by CollinR

Malore makes it a royal PITA to delete a single show, if you select something with only one episode left or right pane mine goes into playback with no menu popup. Thats really not desirable to me as most of my favorites I kill after watching, so I often don't ever have more then one of them. Yes, I could memorize the direct delete key on the MVP remotes. Nobody really wants to do that though, having it in the GUI is better.

You should double check the various options available... In this case, use the Options command (or the Options icon), select "Malore Menu Options", then choose "Smart Select", and set it to "Display Options" so you'll see the pop-up menus when you select a group or a single airing.

"Display Options" is the default setting, but it sounds like you currently have that set to "Smart" for some reason -- when you select a show, that one performs some action based on the menu you are in.

While in that Options menu, you could check out some of the other settings.

- Andy

[CollinR]

Yup that fixed it, I wonder how long it has been like that.


Okay some observations about the new features.

It would be nice to allow for 0 or 1 as an alternate view, this way if you don't want any filtering you don't have an "alternate 2" header thats not too useful. This basically just allows for no filtering at all, still some may prefer that. Or the option to remove the alternate views if desired as with only 1 it would needlessly say "Main".

The ability to modify the genre of recorded shows/entire favorites. For giggles I built an alternate view called "Comedy" and then filtered it accordingly. Then I used the new filtered view (which I think is probably superior) to find only a single series listed, this is because Zap2it had botched basically every other comedy series/show I have recorded (the majority of my recordings). If there is means to modify this information (other then web the interface) I don't know about it. It would be handy to allow a manual genre setting during favorite creation and/or favorite managment. This would overcome errors from Zap2it and make the filters much more functional.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by CollinR

It would be nice to allow for 0 or 1 as an alternate view, this way if you don't want any filtering you don't have an "alternate 2" header thats not too useful. This basically just allows for no filtering at all, still some may prefer that. Or the option to remove the alternate views if desired as with only 1 it would needlessly say "Main".

That's already a future update mentioned in this post.

- Andy

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by JREkiwi

With the malore menu font size option controlling the font size of all the text on the page and the fact that the panel sizes are based on the font size, I can't get a font that provides a nice balance between the panel sizes and the panel fonts. I like the look of the fonts in the mlbdude view where the font in the left panel is smaller (looks like about -2) than the font in the right panel and to my eyes, the balance between the size of the top and bottom panels of the default and mlbdude views is good.

I didn't reply to your post earlier because I wanted to look into it more...

I found that 10 or 11 rows (using double height both will result in 5 rows) with a font size if 16 will size the top & bottom menu sections similar to the mlbdude recordings menu. (This is not a coincidence: the default setting is 10 rows using 16 pt font. As far as I know, it was designed to roughly match the default recording menu size at those settings.) The malore menu also uses a different default font face -- Verdana for malore vs. Arial just about everywhere else. You could set multimenu_menu_font_face to Arial to see how that looks.

The two mlbdude panes use the same default font size, but they are based on 2 different properties, so you may have changed them at some point -- ui/base_font_size and ui/airing_list_font_size.

Related to the fonts and panel sizing, I prefer the amount of detail that is shown in the top panel in the default and mlbdude views.

...

I also prefer the way that when scrolling in the left panel of the mlbdude view the top panel displays an episode list when selecting grouped items. I find that much easier to scan than the malore view which shows detail from the top entry of the group. This is the one my wife complains about most, but that's not why it's last.

I added an option to set the Upper Info Area Style: Malore or Standard. When set to Standard mode, the top area displays the first 5 items in the highlighted group or the standard set of info for a highlighted airing.

- Andy