HVR-1600 QAM - Problems with some channels but not others

[bznotins]

I have been having a great time getting my HVR-1600 configured and working with the QAM in SageTV. Remapping channels, finding new channels, etc, etc.

Recently I started having problems tuning some HD channels. Not all, mind you -- just some.

FOX HD and CBS HD come-in great. I can watch and record HD no problem. NBC and ABC, on the other hand, don't tune (just a black screen in live SageTV and the "blocked" unwatchable result when recording). The same problem is present when I try the WinTV app. When viewing recordings it is clear that something is recording because I can see brief flashes of shows with the familiar "blocking" of a feed that isn't being totally decoded. So I know there is a signal there.

I originally thought it was a weak signal on our cable. We have a ton of cable outlets in the house. From the main feed, the signal gets split six times, and then a further three times at my HTPC to feed the three tuners that I have. On analog TV, some channels were "fuzzy" and I had a hunch that it was due to a weak signal. So I went and purchased a Motorola Signal Booster and installed it in the attic before the signal was split. It fixed the "fuzzy" channel problem perfectly on analog TV, but my HD reception on those two channels on my HTPC was still inop. I also tried removing the last three-way split before my HTPC and feeding the QAM tuner directly but again, still no luck.

Any thoughts? Should I call the cable company? Do they even officially support QAM (is it considered part of my standard analog cable package or is it a nice, but unsupported, freebie)?

I'm in Houston, using Comcast extended basic analog cable.

HVR-1600 QAM and Analog Tuners w/current drivers
ATi eHome Wonder Analog Tuner
Intel Dual Core E2140 overclocked to 2.8ghz
nVidia 8500GT w/current drivers

The weird thing is that both NBC and ABC used to work (even without the signal booster). They were a little spotty at times, but now they're just unwatchable.

The WAF had reached an all-time high recently (her "Dancing With The Stars" in HD was the clincher) but with the failure of ABC & NBC to tune in HD the WAF has returned to historical lows.

Thanks!

[Protoman]

What do you mean by split 6 times then split an additional 3 times? Exactly how many splitters do you have connected to the lines? Do you have like 8 two-way splitters, or what?

Each splitter will drop the amount of signal that is received by the devices. The more splitters = the more loss of signal. You may want to consider getting a bigger splitter for all of the drops like an 8-way, and remove all of the other splitters, or at least minimize the number of splitters being used.

If you are going to used that amplifier be sure that it is as close to where the cable enters the house as possible and before any splitters, and not where you are using the Tuner or STB, etc.

Another note is to try and keep your cable runs as short as possible, and not have 20 feet of cable coiled on the floor next to your computer.

Be sure to use a 75 ohm terminator on any open jacks (that are not being used).

One issue I had was with the cable itself. I have made all of my own cables so I could get them customed lengths ~2.5 feet from my 8-way splitter to the tuner cards. Some of the connectors used their own core (center wire in coax), while some of my older ones used the core built into the wire itself and were about an 1 3/4 long (longer than normal). With the ones that had their own core buuilt in I got really crappy analog reception. It took me a few days before I decided to try the older cables I made and the reception quality was a ton better. All of the cables I used were RG6 with RG6 connections.

Hope these items help,
Protoman

[bznotins]

Re splitters and the signal booster. The order is as such en route to the HTPC.

Cable --> Booster --> Six-way splitter --> Three Way Splitter --> HTPC (2xAnalog, 1xATSC).

I have taken out the last splitter with no impact.

[kevine]

First, I hope you did not spend $2300 on that signal booster.

I have had problems with the 1600 with QAM since I got it. I too thought it was a signal booster. However, that does not fly when I get fine reception on my HDHR. Recently, I downloaded the signal tester from Hauppuage. Located here: http://hauppauge.lightpath.net/softw...al_monitor.exe
With this I get around 30 for signal strength. The problem is that I get many unrecoverable errors and that strength does not hold. It fluctuates. I personally think I have a bad card but support has not suggested I return it yet. I am still in limbo trying things they ask of me.

I agree with the protoman's post regarding splits and amplified splitter.

Barring that, an easier test is to move the PC to where it comes into the house and test it from there.

[bznotins]

LOL, nope the booster was only $30.

I would move the PC to where the cable comes into the house but it's in the attic.

I'm tempted to give the new ATi QAM tuner a try if it gets supported in Sage. I might also try RMAing the Hauppauge Tuner...

The funniest thing is that the Fox HD channel is crystal-clear but neither WinTV nor SageTV pick it up on a channel scan. I have to add it manually. Probably not related to this problem but interesting nonetheless.

[wirecreative]

It took me a while to get my card connected to the correct input, remember to delete the FRQ file and re-scan the correct option, but once I did, my scan resulted in several new channels discovered.

This process could be more intuitive, but I'm satisfied now.

[sabre]

I thought i would add this here as well, as it sounds very familiar to your issue in post 1.

--
ORIGINAL ISSUE:

"anyone getting WCBS-HD in connecticut on cablevision? I used to be able to pick it up on 118-2-1 w/ the 1600, and seems it should still be there, but when i map it in sage it now shows PBS kids there, and when i scan i no longer pick up WCBS. It is on Norwalk cablevision."


FOLLOW UP- "got it on 94-2-1. CBS-HD used to come in great, but now is blocky. Same w/ ABC. In fact, NBC and FOX used to come in bad, and now great, while CBS and ABC used to be great and are now blocky.

Any ideas why? I notice that CBS (94) and ABC (92) are on low frequencies and NBC (101) and FOX (i think > 100) are higher. Perhaps higher frequencies come in better with my signal? I will have to check to timing when things changed, but i added a bi-directional amp and maybe that is making the lower channels have too much signal and higher ones just correct signal at this point? If so, perhaps a way to balance it..."

[gplasky]

I would consult with your cable company. Many are reorganizing their stations and moving them all over the place.

Gerry

[sabre]

So, I reduced the signal level by adding a split and it did not help on the lower frequencies (94/92). So I put it back to how it was.

via the cable box, I measured the signal level for each channel, and they were all 8db and 38 SNR +/-1. And on the hauppuage signal monitor SNR for all were 30.5-30.9.

But, the lower frequency (92=ABC and 94=CBS [this is worst w/ most uncorrectable errors) still do not come in very well. While with the same signal the higher frequencies (101=NBC and 107=FOX) come in great.

not sure what can be done, other than go to HDHR, and there is the risk the cable cos could move the channels around some more, impacting reception.

[tawd1992]

I had a similar problem to yours using the HVR-1600. I could get the 1080i channels fine (PBS, NBC, CBS) but the 720p channels (ABC, Fox) are usually black with the picture coming in intermittently. When it comes in the framerate is <10 fps. I connected the HVR-1600 directly to the ground block where the cable comes into my house & this didn't help a thing.

All the local HD channels work perfectly fine using the QAM tuner in our 46" Sharp LCD so I know the cable isn't the problem. When I plug a 720p recording into Videoredo it gives me all sorts of errors, so it's obvious the recording is bad.

[bznotins]

The most frustrating problem is that one day FOX will tune just fine in HD on the PVR-1600. The next day not at all. And then the day after it will tune but be "choppy".

My guess is that the HVR-1600 isn't as "sensitive" or "forgiving" as a TV tuner and therefore has problems with a signal that isn't perfect. Maybe there's noise in my signal. Maybe it's not strong enough. Who knows.

I'm hoping we get HTPC QAM tuner quality up to those that are in TVs some day. TVs seem to "just work" while HTPC tuners always have a myriad of problems that present themselves.

[waters10]

I have had problems with the 1600 with QAM since I got it. I too thought it was a signal booster. However, that does not fly when I get fine reception on my HDHR. Recently, I downloaded the signal tester from Hauppuage. Located here: http://hauppauge.lightpath.net/softw...al_monitor.exe
With this I get around 30 for signal strength. The problem is that I get many unrecoverable errors and that strength does not hold. It fluctuates. I personally think I have a bad card but support has not suggested I return it yet. I am still in limbo trying things they ask of me.

I'm having the exact same problem! I get around 30.7-31 with the signal monitor, which is shown as yellow. The problem is I'm getting a significant number of correctable errors, turning that bar to yellow half the time. And the occasional uncorrectable error, like 2-3 every 5 seconds or so. This is enough to get stutter every once in a while.

You didn't mention if you tried a signal booster. So, did you? I'm thinking about trying one, but based on the OP experience, I'm skeptical that this will help ... I think a booster would help with the SNR, but the number of correctable/uncorrectable errors would remain the same, if not increase.

Does anyone know what can be done to reduce the number of errors? Some type of filter?


Oh and for the record, this is specific to my 1600 card. My cable set top box shows higher SNR, around 33-34, and no errors. And this is with the same cable coming out of the same splitter. And my MyHD card never had problems with QAM channels ...

[jjstok]

I'm having a weak signal error now too. It was fine a few days ago then my server went down and I had to rebuild it. Most of the digital channels are working except for two. One is at about 10% or so and the other at 0%. I don't recall any specific configs prior to my current setup. I have a NVR 1600. Any ideas?

[David HVR1600]

I did a search and found this thread. Interestingly my problem is a bit different. I can watch the sage recordings with VLC but sage wont show the channel or the recordings of a specific QAM channel.

[bryonrw]

Originally Posted by jjstok

I'm having a weak signal error now too. It was fine a few days ago then my server went down and I had to rebuild it. Most of the digital channels are working except for two. One is at about 10% or so and the other at 0%. I don't recall any specific configs prior to my current setup. I have a NVR 1600. Any ideas?

I have the same issue did you get all the channels to scan?