HD, encoder_merit, lineup issues

[kricker]

Okay. There has been plenty of talk about encoder_merit and lineup configurations spread all across the board. I have tried to follow the links around, but just get lost in the mess.

Is there anyway to actually have Sage prefer a HD encoder over a SD encoder when a show is marked as HD AND have the lineups for each so that the HD and SD for the same channel are mapped together so it only shows up once in the guide?

Example:
Fox analog channel:
11 WTNZ
Fox HD channel:
104-0-1 QAM from channel scan (actual listing is 7## WTNZHD)

I remapped the station for analog channel 11 to WTNZDT so shows that are in HD are properly marked as HD. I remapped channel 104-0-1 to logical channel 11 and mapped the station to WTNZHD.

This way I obnly get one channel 11 WTNZHD in my program guide.

The show Terminator:The Sarah Conner Chronicles on channel 11 is marked as HD. Sage is recording it on one of the 2 SD tuners and not the HD tuner. There are no conflicts for the recording time. The encoder_merit for the HD encoder is set at 3, the analog tuners are both at 0.

Please tell me the Sage logic can handle this.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by kricker

I remapped the station for analog channel 11 to WTNZDT so shows that are in HD are properly marked as HD.

But, the catch is that it isn't properly marked as HD -- you now have SD airings improperly marked as HD because you are using the digital channel's listings for the analog channel.

I remapped channel 104-0-1 to logical channel 11 and mapped the station to WTNZHD.

If you really want to keep both the analog and digital channels, I would map them to their correct stations, so SageTV knows which airings are actually HD and which are SD. Or, if you only want the digital version of the channel, disable the analog one.

The tuner merit only comes into play when all else is equal. But, I'm guessing that you don't have all other things equal because maybe the digital tuner has other channels not available to the analog tuner & something else could be recorded. If only the actual HD airing were marked as HD, there would be less of a chance for this scheduling issue because HD is preferred over SD for Favorites.

- Andy

[kricker]

Okay I get what you are saying. The shows on the channel 11 are not HD, but are available in HD on channel 104-0-1. I was keeping the analog channels due to the fact I only have one HD tuner. I figured the 2 analogs would be my backups to record when the HD tuner is busy. The 2 analog tuners have the same lineup and the HD one only has the 4 major networks HD channels. I was hoping this could be done having the network affiliates listed only once in the guide, I guess that is just not possible. I'll just go back and switch the analog channels and HD channels to their respective lineup stations.

[kricker]

I have switched back to having separate HD and SD stations for the same channels. Now Sage is recording both the HD and SD versions of the same show for a few of my son's favorites. The shows have the exact same name and description as well as ID, the only difference is that HD one comes on 3 hours earlier than the SD one. Can Sage not "see" that it is the same show, since all the other relevant info is the same? I even have "Detect repeat airings with non-unique IDs" enabled.

[Opus4]

What is the ShowID on the recording's detailed info screen? If it is not unique, there is no guarantee that SageTV will be able to guess they are the same.

If you have two Favorites, one limited to the HD channel & one limited to the SD channel, it will record from both channels.

- Andy

[kricker]

Both IDs are exactly the same. There is only one favorite for each show, neither limiting to a specific channel. There are two different shows recording both SD and HD versions.

[Opus4]

What is the ShowID?

- Andy

[bialio]

I don't know why it doesn't work for you. I have a similar situation - all the analog tuner channels mapped to their Digital version in the guide. I have the merit's of the tuners set up so that:

HDHR (QAM) = 10 (4 total)
HDHR (OTA) = 9 (2 total)
HD-PVR = 8 (1 total)
PVR500 = 5 (2 total)

Sage always favors the HD tuner to record shows. I rarely get a recording on one of the PVR 500 tuners.

btl.

[kricker]

Originally Posted by Opus4

What is the ShowID?

- Andy

I just had one happen today. I already removed the duplicate and don't remember which one it was, but here is the next one on the schedule.
Show name: Super Why. ShowID:EP9488270018
Scheduled on 8/27 at 8am on channel 782 then again at 2:30 PM on Channel 2

[kricker]

Originally Posted by bialio

I don't know why it doesn't work for you. I have a similar situation - all the analog tuner channels mapped to their Digital version in the guide.....
Sage always favors the HD version of shows. I rarely get a recording on one of the PVR 500 tuners.

btl.

I don't know either. I'd call it frustrating to say the least. I have plenty of shows that, although are not listed as HD, look better on the digital tuner, but don't record there even when there is no conflict.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by kricker

Show name: Super Why. ShowID:EP9488270018
Scheduled on 8/27 at 8am on channel 782 then again at 2:30 PM on Channel 2

I would select each one, then choose Record Options -> Adjust Favorite Options to double check that there really isn't another Fav coming into play.

If there isn't another Fav, you could try removing & re-adding the Fav. Or, remove the Fav anyway & see if either of them are still outlined as Favs.

And, to double check this: you've looked at the Program Information menu for each airing? I had a situation where the description was the same, but one channel had the EPG from digital channel's broadcast stream and actually had a DT### ID.

Other than separate Favs, different IDs, or Manual Recordings, I don't remember another reason why the same episode might get recorded multiple times.

- Andy

[kricker]

Originally Posted by Opus4

I would select each one, then choose Record Options -> Adjust Favorite Options to double check that there really isn't another Fav coming into play.

If there isn't another Fav, you could try removing & re-adding the Fav. Or, remove the Fav anyway & see if either of them are still outlined as Favs.

And, to double check this: you've looked at the Program Information menu for each airing? I had a situation where the description was the same, but one channel had the EPG from digital channel's broadcast stream and actually had a DT### ID.

Other than separate Favs, different IDs, or Manual Recordings, I don't remember another reason why the same episode might get recorded multiple times.

- Andy

I did check the detailed info for each entry in the schedule. The IDs are exactly the same. I know for a fact I only have one favorite for the show, but IR is enabled. Is IR not "intelligent" enough to know better? Is that my issue? I'll remove the fav now and see what happens.

IR is the culprit. I checked the favorite settings and recording schedule for each of the shows exhibiting this behavior. The SD broadcast was not marked as a favorite. The favorite settings had the show limited to the HD channel. Once I set the favorite to "any" channel, the IR chosen SD version went away.

[bialio]

so IR was the problem? That's definately something that I don't use so that might explain our differing results .....

[kricker]

Yup...good ol' IR. Intelligent is as Intelligent does....

[Opus4]

My first question about the duplicate recordings asked if the Favs were limited to specific channels & I could have come up with a solution quickly if I had known they were & that the SD shows were not even Favs.

You can remove the limit (which you've done) since HD shows will be preferred anyway or, if you really want to limit the Fav to the HD channel, set up another Fav limited to the SD channel & only allow it to record 1 show with auto delete disabled. You could also use negative padding to let it record just a few minutes so the show doesn't take up much disk space & then never delete it. I know that's a work-around, but it solves it for me on a couple Favs.

- Andy

[kricker]

I thought your first question was aking if I had a fav for both the SD and HD versions, which I did not. To be honest I wasn't even aware I made the channel limit when I made the favs. Your followup asking about my favs made me look at them again and the tip about looking to see if they are outlined gave me the real clue (I am mostly in SageMC with most icons turned off so there wasn't a true visual clue until I switched to the default STV for troubleshooting), so once again you led me to the cure.