Where's the "sweet" spot in buying a new computer?

[reboot_this]

I have been window shopping for a new desktop. I would build one, but things seem to be cheaper when bought all together nowadays. I looked through all the Black Friday/Cyber Monday sales, but nothing was to-die-for.

To explain, I have an AMD 3200+ (single core) on a Gigabyte board with 2GB of memory and a PNY 5950 Ultra... it's about 4-5 years old, and slow. When I built it back then the components were about one step behind bleeding edge, I think it was when the AMD FX chips had just come out. I was looking at maybe upgrading the processor and ram, but I can't even find a replacement upgrade processor! I guess I've been behind the time for a while.

Anyway, it's time to move on for the right price and turn my current desktop into a server. I just want a best bang for the buck and am not sure where in the technology spectrum to buy in. Heck, anything I buy that's currently being sold is going to be night/day to what I'm using.

I mainly use the computer for graphics software (Adobe CS3 mainly, some 3D stuff, etc), a little video editing, office apps, a few games (older ones anyway), and online stuff (surfing, music, etc) One thing is that I love to multitask and I usually have about 5-10 or more Firefox windows open at a time.

I am mainly looking at Dell and am probably going with Intel. I will probably spring for Vista Ultimate, as well. I do like the XPS Studio (Intel I7 and no monitor) set up, but not sure if it's worth the money, when there are several other options at lower prices (non I7 rigs). I have been "building" (mainly dreaming) different configurations up at Dell... from Core 2 duo's to the I7. I just don't know where the "sweet" spot is, of course I doubt it's the I7, but will spring for it if it's really that good... although I'm thinking about waiting until the new AMD processors come out first of next year and drive down the Intel prices. I want to keep price under 2K, but that's why I'm here blabbing, why even spend that kind of dough when there are deals for 800-1000?

I figured I would post here while I continue to kick the tires, done blabbing now.

[GKusnick]

Originally Posted by reboot_this

I would build one, but things seem to be cheaper when bought all together nowadays.

The point of building your own isn't to save money. It's to get exactly the parts you want, with known stable drivers, and without a lot of preinstalled crapware. Most PC reliability and performance problems come down to cheap hardware, flaky drivers, or resource-hogging startup programs that you'll probably never use.

[reboot_this]

Originally Posted by GKusnick

The point of building your own isn't to save money.

Well that is true, I guess I should have said I just want the convenience. I have been on the edge "to build or not to build"

But either way, I still don't know where that "sweet" spot/best bang for my buck is. All I know is I don't need nor want to pay for "bleeding edge" stuff.

(I'm married now... and the cardboard side tables, the hand-me-down couch, etc. didn't cut it anymore )

[stanger89]

Core i7 920? Basically the 3rd fastest processor you can buy, and <$300.

[lobosrul]

Sweet spot right now (if your into encoding/comskip etc) would be an intel P35/45 based board, a low level Quad Core probably the Q8200, and 4 GB of DDR2). The i7's arent too expensive, but the mobo's are much more and DDR3 is also quite a bit more expensive then DDR2. If you're into gaming the Nvidia 9800GT is a good buy right now. Add a case and power supply (I prefer Antec for both) and thats a complete computer (except periphreals) for no more than $800.

[davephan]

I used to have an AMD 2800+ system and upgrade to an Intel E6850, 3.0 dual-core. The E6850 is only $200 now at New Egg. The old AMD 2800+ system barely had enough processing power to transcode compressed video on-the-fly or to compress videos while using SageTV.

There is a huge difference in performance with a 3.0 gig dual-core. Files can be compressed while transcoding two separate programs at the same time.

Dave

[SWKerr]

I have been thinking about this myself lately. I seem to build a new system about every 12 months but never with the latest tech. Right now I want a decent test box so I am going to buy a new main desktop machine and us my existing system to play around with. I still have several HTPCs and one each for the wife and kids.

The sweet spot really depend on your needs. I tend to cannibalize part from previous builds so the process can be cheaper than starting from scratch. The core PC is the real variable cost in the build: Motherboard, Video Card and CPU. Cases and power supply costs depend on your taste and needs. Hard drives, Memory and DVDs are commodity items. Things like BluRay, and tuner cards are add-ons.

Do you want a quite HTPC rig or something big an expandable you can put under a desk. When you build it yourself you can decide.

Case & Power supply $100-200
Hard drive $100
DVD $30
BluRay $100

Core Components Cost:
Low End:
ATI 780G motherboard, 4GB RAM and a 45w AMD dual core for only about $200

Med:
Intel Core 2 Duo E7300, 4GB RAM and Radeon HD 4650 for about $350
*** for another $70 you could substitute a low end Quad Core Q8200

High:
Core i7 920, 6GB RAM and Radeon HD 4650 for about $800
*** memory and motherboards are still pricy for the i7.

You can always spend a lot more and get the latest CPU and Video cards but the noticeable improvement will be lost for everyone that is not a hard core gamer. I have an Xbox for gaming.

For just about everything you do I doubt you will see much difference between any of these except for the video editing. Recoding video is the thing that takes a lot of cpu. I have a AMD X2 today and editing HD video is OK but the rendering the final result take quite some time. I also recode BluRays to mkv files for sage and those will run for a good 12 hours. Really I just let the stuff run overnight and it does not bother me. I still have enough power to surf and play music at the same time.

I am between the Low and Med right now. I am actually leaning toward the low end and swapping the motherboard with my HTPC machine. I am thinking since it’s on all the time that the low power cpu would be a better fit. I am not really thinking I need all the extra power.

[davephan]

Originally Posted by SWKerr

Med:
Intel Core 2 Duo E7300, 4GB RAM and Radeon HD 4650 for about $350
*** for another $70 you could substitute a low end Quad Core Q8200

When I replaced my system, my goal was to keep the CPU at 3.0 gig since many on the forum thought that it made a big difference between the 2.33 to 2.66 range and 3.0 gig. Maybe a slower quad-core would offer enough performance, dividing the load between the four cores instead of only two cores. The fast 3.0 gig dual-core made a huge difference for me!

For about $70 than the E7300 you could get a E6850 3.0 dual-core. The E6850 has enough power to transcode video and to transcode two compressed videos on the fly into the MVP units. Both cores are very busy, but there is no stuttering. The E8400 is also a 3.0 dual-core that is about $165, right between the cost of a E7300 and E6850. It's a bit cheaper than the E6850 and but still 3.0 gig, but I heard it does not overclock as well, which should only be a concern if you overclocked.

I don't know if a slower quad would do as well. I sometimes feel like switching to a fast quad but a 3.0 quad Q9650 is much more expensive, now $550 on NewEgg, but I've seen it cheaper sometimes on NewEgg.

Whichever you choose, I think it is a good idea to buy a bit more processing power than you think need so that the computer can last a bit longer before you have to replace it again.


Dave

[reboot_this]

Originally Posted by davephan

Whichever you choose, I think it is a good idea to buy a bit more processing power than you think need so that the computer can last a bit longer before you have to replace it again.

Dave

Well that's what I ended up doing... I went for the I7, bunch of ram, low-end video card (will upgrade myself, because the one I wanted wasn't offered), and I got a new monitor (been wanting one anyway), it's good because my old monitor doesn't have the right connection guess it's real OLD too!

I got a great deal on everything, so I'm happy. The old system will probably become a server, so we'll see how that goes. I'm thinking about WHS for it.

I appreciate all the input from everyone...

[SHS]

Originally Posted by GKusnick

The point of building your own isn't to save money. It's to get exactly the parts you want, with known stable drivers, and without a lot of preinstalled crapware. Most PC reliability and performance problems come down to cheap hardware, flaky drivers, or resource-hogging startup programs that you'll probably never use.

That why went I buy and OEM system the frist thing I do is format and reinstall OS with out all preinstalled crapware.
It use be cheaper to building your own PC and get better parts but now it cost at less lot more.

[ojosch]

Well, I was able to build a very nice HTPC SageTV server / theater client station for around $1200 using the Intel S5000XVNSATAR board ( http://www.provantage.com/intel-s500...r~7ITSP0EL.htm ) as a fast, and stable foundation, for reasonable cost.

This offers a VERY STRONG platform for having cutting edge at a good cost. This motherboard is based on the Intel server class design, but is called a 'workstation' board since they also added an x16 PCIe slot (so you can run nice video cards).

This foundation lets you run 1366mHz FSB, 45nm quad core processor (single or dual CPU), and you can run all sorts of other goodies. I have also more recently added in a 3ware 9500s RAID controller, and a PRO1000 Intel fiber card for connecting to my network LAN, and I recently got a cheap $50 Creative Labs sound card for it that does digital 5.1 optical pass thorugh.

I run this board with just a single, quad core e5420 processor and 4GB (4 x 1GB) quad channel PC2-5300 RAM, 8600GTS video, etc, and it is super fast. Windows Vista rates it a 5.1 on the Windows Experience scale (see picture attachment). But I did a lot of research, and this was the most computer I could build for the money. I was also on a tight budget, so it was important to get the most bang for the buck. I bought the e5420 CPU refurbished, and RAM off of eBay for really good prices, and basically built a server grade box for pretty cheap, that can play 1080p flawless. It can even be recording SageTV off the satellite, encoding something else, ripping a Blue-Ray disc and playing a 1080p movie simultaneously without a hiccup.

I just thought I'd share that

[mistergq]

Back in the beginning of the millennium, I decide it was no longer a value to build your own computer.

In 2005 I bought a Dell computer for my house. I opened it up to add a video card for multiple monitor support to discover no AGP slot. How is a computer built in 2005 with just a regular PCI slot and no AGP slot.

Since opening up that computer, I decided that I would no longer buy a name brand computer anymore. Maybe I spend more money, but at least I know what parts are going in and what upgrade options there are in the future. Also, and more importantly, I control which case I use and can get a case with good airflow.

[SHS]

mistergq Back in the beginning of the millennium days people where not b$t$hing about upgrade able and most Consumers didn't do there home work very well and yes it was ture min OEM computer where a big joke must becuase there where not giving a specific full set of product tech information like some common things number of device slot and or port input.
Most of your avg consumers that are not your Gamer or HTPC type well buy what ever the cheap.
Look at Intel lates new Core i7 even the cheaps CPU cost $300/1000+ and that dose count all other thing you need like memory $100/150+, motherboard $250/300+, and even a new really good power supply $100/150+, harddrive, dvdrom, case and monitor then there the video card that depend on what you want to do with it so you could spent as little as $80 up $1000+ you eazy spent about $1400 on new Core i7 home build now if we was to compaire this to Dell Studio XPS Desktop line with monitor in mini way a home build is a better value but that depend on the consumer how ever Dell Studio XPS Desktop for $1500 is a good value as starter doing a little ever thing.
How ever I still a bit dispoint in after market motherboard which alway seem to have way to min Graphics Slot and one that doing high number of 1x PCIe slot is GIGABYTE but like all thing there adding to much LEGACY carp.

What I like about the Dell Studio XPS Desktop is it Expansion Slots
PCIe x1: 3 Slot
PCIe x16 (Graphics): 1 Slot
I would have like see dell do have done 4 1x Slot and give us god dran info on the number SATA input which I'm pettey is 4 but I would perf to see min of six and tab bigger case with good layout.
The best value has to be the Inspiron 518 this make good little server been it come with "2" 1x PCIe pop in "2" 2250 or "2" 1800 all done.