Time for a check-in - who (if anyone) has reasonable channel changing with HD-PVR?

[TakeFlight]

Just to test again (even though I don't really watch TV this way much) I just went channel by channel through about 10 channels (on the HD-PVR) with zero problems on my HD Theater extender. 6 seconds between channel changes.

[Beefcake550]

Ok, so I'm going to have to try the delay thing this morning.....before work.

I'll report back if I can actually get it done....

[Beefcake550]

Ok, got it done.

GREAT NEWS - adding the tuning delay to the sage.properties and some sage.properties.(6.4.xxx) files on the server fixed the problem. I'm not sure which one actually does this trick, but I figured one is for the server itself and the other for the extenders. Like I said, I changed both since I found the same setup lines in both files.

Of course, I added 4000ms of delay and I'm going to try lowering that number to like 500ms. I'm going to do that tonight though. It does make it take longer to change channels, but basically as soon as Sage brings up the info bar for the new channel, the video and audio are there waiting for it. My channel changes are just about 5-6 seconds now whereas before it was probably around 1-2 seconds. So that makes sense since I added a 4 second delay.

I saw in the other thread that Sage knows about an AC3 problem (not ours though - the one with high bitrate AC3) and it's due to a driver issue from the vendor. Let's hope our issue gets fixed as well.

[Taddeusz]

I am using Firewire for channel changing, which I love. Much faster channel changing than with my USB-UIRT. With only one caveat though. If it is a two digit channel it takes longer to tune because the program that does the tuning strips the leading zero and as a result the cable box sits and waits a bit longer for a third digit. And I have to set my delay to 7000ms because for it to tune and sync a two digit channel can take up to that long. I played around with it for quite some time to get the best delay and that's as short as I could make it without giving me issues.

I want to devise a way to use EventGhost to do the channel changing so that it always sends three digits by sending each one individually rather than in a single string. But my server is completely headless and I need something that runs a service so I don't need to be logged in all the time. I'm hoping by using srvany.exe I can run it as a service. I just need to try it.

[simonen]

Glad to hear the delay setting worked for you. I agree that it would be nice if it was not a 4 sec. delay, but it is better than waiting 15 seconds for everything to get into sync.

[Chriscic]

Originally Posted by Beefcake550

Ok, got it done.

GREAT NEWS - adding the tuning delay to the sage.properties and some sage.properties.(6.4.xxx) files on the server fixed the problem. I'm not sure which one actually does this trick, but I figured one is for the server itself and the other for the extenders. Like I said, I changed both since I found the same setup lines in both files.

That is great news. Can't wait to see if it works for me tonight. When playing around some more last night I was reminded that sometimes right now I can't tune to a channel at all no matter what I do, as skip forward or back or stop or stop and restart won't help. I get 1 second video, 1 second pause, 1 second video over and over with no sound. This happenened tuning to SciFi HD last night, and then to see what would happen I hit record. Checking the HD Theater in the morning, it wouldn't play back *anything* (kept getting a Sage playback error message) until I rebooted the server and restarted the extender. Not good.

[paulbeers]

I have to reach back into my brain to remember, but if I am not mistaken, the reason for the necessity of the 4000 ms delay is for those who have their STB set to variable output. My recollection is this is a "bug" with the HDPVR. It takes it awhile to change its output correctly (i.e. from 1080i to 70P) and creates garbled video and it takes Sage awhile to "recover"...If you set the 4000ms delay, then Sage doesn't try to play back from the garbled video and so no "recovery" is necessary. This issue was discovered back in June/July.

I have my STB set to do 1080i at all times and therefore I have no need for the 4000ms delay when viewing from the HDPVR since the video resolution never changes.

[HelenWeathers]

Originally Posted by paulbeers

I have my STB set to do 1080i at all times and therefore I have no need for the 4000ms delay when viewing from the HDPVR since the video resolution never changes.

There is one other reason for the delay, and that's to avoid the Click Pop in the audio track that some of us get when using S/PDIF input on the HD PVR. It's an issue with the HD PVRs and not SageTV.

[sleonard]

Originally Posted by paulbeers

I have to reach back into my brain to remember, but if I am not mistaken, the reason for the necessity of the 4000 ms delay is for those who have their STB set to variable output. My recollection is this is a "bug" with the HDPVR. It takes it awhile to change its output correctly (i.e. from 1080i to 70P) and creates garbled video and it takes Sage awhile to "recover"...If you set the 4000ms delay, then Sage doesn't try to play back from the garbled video and so no "recovery" is necessary. This issue was discovered back in June/July.

I have my STB set to do 1080i at all times and therefore I have no need for the 4000ms delay when viewing from the HDPVR since the video resolution never changes.

Pretty close. If the resolution being output by the stb before the channel change is different than the resolution after the channel change and there is NOT a delay, the resolution is tagged incorrectly and confuses Sage.

The delay gives time for the stb to finish its channel change and start outputting the requested video (and, therefore, the correct resolution) before the HD-PVR starts recording.

Basically, the HD-PVR cannot handle resolution changes once it has started recording. I have tested this by watching live tv and manually changing the channel on the stb (using the front buttons on the stb) to a channel with a different resolution (i.e. - 480i to 720p) The video locks up in sage until I change the channel back to one with the correct resolution.

S

[Chriscic]

The problem for me is every channel change, and I know I'm not changing resolution every single channel change. Plus, I'm pretty sure my Comcast STB is outputting fixed 1080i. But I'll definitely try the delay tonight and it will either work or not.

[paulbeers]

Thank you sleonard and helenweathers for setting me straight! Like I said, I don't need to use the 4000ms delay so it doesn't effect me (I'm still using analog audio since I am too lazy to mess with my current setup and using a fixed 1080i output), so I couldn't remember the exact reasoning behind the need for 4000ms delay.

[Beefcake550]

To summarize the multiple reasons for assing this delay:
1) allows output of STB to "settle" when changing resolutions (HDPVR gets messed up)
2) get rid of annoying 'pop' when a channel is started to tune in (HDPVR inserts 'pop')
3) get rid of something in audio stream (probably 'pop' from #2) that reaches the decoder chip in the HD200 and makes playback function badly/not at all.

I'm inserting the delay to fix #3. I have my STB output set to 720p all the time. I'd like to allow it to go back to outputting multiple resolutions to save disc space. I'm going to have to play aroudn with this setting to see how it goes.

[Chriscic]

The delay at 4000 has helped tremendously. Now, usually the channel change goes smoothly; it's about 6-7 seconds between changes.

Things are not perfect; for example, I kept getting glitches when trying to watch HBO no matter what I did. And my HD200 has one second audio drop-puts about once a minute (HD100 doesn't do this). But at least progress to some usability. I'll have to see how things go with normal use the next few days to see where I am.

That's been life with Sage and the HD-PVR... fix one thing then on to the next issue. Hopefully the package will at least work acceptably now.

[bsung]

Originally Posted by Chriscic

The delay at 4000 has helped tremendously. Now, usually the channel change goes smoothly; it's about 6-7 seconds between changes.

Things are not perfect; for example, I kept getting glitches when trying to watch HBO no matter what I did. And my HD200 has one second audio drop-puts about once a minute (HD100 doesn't do this). But at least progress to some usability. I'll have to see how things go with normal use the next few days to see where I am.

That's been life with Sage and the HD-PVR... fix one thing then on to the next issue. Hopefully the package will at least work acceptably now.

My system was having some issues too but last night I did two things. First, I increased my delay as discussed. Second, I noticed that my 2 Comcast boxes had some odd settings for audio. One was set for stereo even though I was using optical (but surround sound seemed to be working). The other box was set on some light compression setting. I changed it to matrix with no compression. I'm not sure what matrix means but the order of choices was mono, stereo and matrix so I figured matrix was what I wanted.

I didn't have a lot of time to test much last night but the combination of changes seems to have fixed the following problems:

1. Channel changing as described by others in this thread
2. HDPVR recordings played fine but I noticed the blue recording light (where the top would glow) would turn on and off every few minutes
3. The audio would cut out for a second on rare occassion while watching not just through Sage but in passthrough mode through HDPVR

#3 happened too infrequently for me to say I know for sure the problem has been fixed but I'm hopeful that it has.

[Chriscic]

My Comcast box has always been set to "TV Speakers"; I always get DD 5.1 though.

It always outputs 1080i... so it's not a resolution change that makes the HD extenders go haywire with channel changes (without the delay).

[bsung]

Yeah, I've been doing some research and I seems as if matrix is supposed to provide some sort of enhanced effect. In terms of the compression option, I've read that it's supposed to reduce the difference between soft and loud sounds. I can't hear the difference myself when I switch from one to the other so it may or may not affect the optical output.

I did notice that some channels with bad reception still cause audio problems when watching TV on bypass mode and definitely cause the hdpvr to stutter/lock. So for me, I think the issue is my cable box or signal strength.

It sounds as if that may not be the problem you're having but hopefully that's helpful for you.