To Extend(er) or not to Extend(er)

[greggerm]

Greetings fellow Sagers!

A few months ago, many of you were quite helpful as I rebuilt my SageTV system to bring it up to date on new computer hardware.

As of now, I use the SageTV server (not running as a service) on my HTPC as a directly connected device to my television, but I am seeing some drawbacks.

My current gripes:
CODECs - I've found that FFDSHOW works great with my analog recordings, but even the MT builds are choking on HD recordings... which is odd, as it seems to work fine on my desktop. Unfortunately the SageTV and Microsoft codecs look horrible with analog recordings, but play the HD items back great. I can't seem to get a good one-stop-shopping solution out of a video codec.

Space/Noise - Although it's the quietest computer in my apartment, the HTPC is still a little noisy when enjoying a quiet evening in the living room. I'm entertaining the idea of tucking it away in a ventilated closet. This will also free up a small but useful corner of space.

Extender to the rescue?

I've done some reading on the extenders and I have some questions and comments I'd like to verify, so I know up front what I am getting myself into.

STVs:
Q) Does the HD Theater extender support custom STVs? I 'need' to be able to run the Neilm custom menu module, as it allows me to tweak the default STV to something far more functional for my tastes. (Not a fan of the default...) I'd also like the flexibility of knowing I can drop in SageMC down the road if I want to.

Video:
Not too many questions. I can see the supported file lists, and that should cover all eventualities that I have run into. Would extender users say that the analog/SD video quality is on par with a 3rd-party PVR?

Audio:
Many of my DVD's have been ripped and reencoded into h264 files with 5.1 AAC audio. This plays just fine and dandy through my computer (and it's analog output ports) to my receiver (and it's "external decoder in") in glorious full surround. My reading seems to tell me that the extender will take this multichannel AAC audio and downmix it to stereo. Is this a correct assumption?

Re-encoding is not out of the question, as I have to do that anyway to up the bitrates now that I have a larger television. When I re-encode, I take it the best way to do it will be to embed the bitstreams (AC3/DD, DTS) right into the MKV container - this way the extender can simply pass the stream along to the receiver for decoding. Correct assumption?

I could also apparently use/create ISOs of my DVD's or simply rip down to the VIDEO_TS folder and let the system use them - depending on my available space (and available time to do the h264 rip/encodes!). With an extra hard drive or two, that may become a feasible option for me. Anyone have a preference between an ISO file vs. the VIDEO_TS rip?

Blue-Ray Considerations:
My ongoing plan as I build a BD library is to rip the disc down to the hard drive. There are many options for just ripping down the disc and letting the new Sage beta read the file structure, or ripping down to the core audio files along with the main movie, or re-encoding to a lesser bitrate. The choice is mine based on how I want to manage my disc space. The key part is that I should maintain a core digital bitstream for the audio rather than compressing to a multichannel AAC for the same reasons as above.

Storage:
I'm planning on flopping from Vista to WHS for this project. I'm enamored with the capabilities WHS has for storage across drives with the ability to get at the files should WHS fall out of favor.

Feedback?

Your feedback is, as always, greatly appreciated!

-Greg

[PLUCKYHD]

Do it you won't look back. The joy of never having to mess with codecs is heaven sent. Now for your questions.

STVs:
Q) Does the HD Theater extender support custom STVs? I 'need' to be able to run the Neilm custom menu module, as it allows me to tweak the default STV to something far more functional for my tastes. (Not a fan of the default...) I'd also like the flexibility of knowing I can drop in SageMC down the road if I want to.

Yes no problem you can even copy your existing html files to the extender clients.

Video:
Not too many questions. I can see the supported file lists, and that should cover all eventualities that I have run into. Would extender users say that the analog/SD video quality is on par with a 3rd-party PVR?

CAn't speak for sd but hd looks better

Re-encoding is not out of the question, as I have to do that anyway to up the bitrates now that I have a larger television. When I re-encode, I take it the best way to do it will be to embed the bitstreams (AC3/DD, DTS) right into the MKV container - this way the extender can simply pass the stream along to the receiver for decoding. Correct assumption?


I believe this is correct. not 100% as I don't use mkv conatiners.

Blue-Ray Considerations:
My ongoing plan as I build a BD library is to rip the disc down to the hard drive. There are many options for just ripping down the disc and letting the new Sage beta read the file structure, or ripping down to the core audio files along with the main movie, or re-encoding to a lesser bitrate. The choice is mine based on how I want to manage my disc space. The key part is that I should maintain a core digital bitstream for the audio rather than compressing to a multichannel AAC for the same reasons as above.

I keep the core uncrompressed audio hoping sage will support soon for now it donconverts fine.

Storage:
I'm planning on flopping from Vista to WHS for this project. I'm enamored with the capabilities WHS has for storage across drives with the ability to get at the files should WHS fall out of favor

This is icing on the cake IMHO WHS and sage is the best combo I just recently switch from media center and haven't looked back.

[razrsharpe]

I second plucky's Comments. Do it and you won't ever look back. I started my HTPC adventure running sageclient in the livingroom and after codec woes, and sleeping woes, and black level woes, and playback woes I said "You mean for $200 it just works and I dont have to think about it... DUH, no brainer"

STVs:
Q) Does the HD Theater extender support custom STVs? I 'need' to be able to run the Neilm custom menu module, as it allows me to tweak the default STV to something far more functional for my tastes. (Not a fan of the default...) I'd also like the flexibility of knowing I can drop in SageMC down the road if I want to.

I run SageMC and have no issues. Load it onto the server and select it as the STV from the UI on the extender. Not sure about the Neilm custom menu but i imagine it shouldn't be an issue (SageMC using the Neilm dynamic menu by default...)
[QUOUTE]
Video:
Not too many questions. I can see the supported file lists, and that should cover all eventualities that I have run into. Would extender users say that the analog/SD video quality is on par with a 3rd-party PVR?[/quote]
Not sure i only record Digital HD with the HDHR and HD-PVR. However, with the extender you can have it switch it's output to the native resolution of the video file (DVD's at 480i/p, etc) and then let your TV's scaler do the scaling. This will probably result in a better picture depending on TV's internal scaler, but it is probably better than the extender... It's worth experimenting

Audio:
Many of my DVD's have been ripped and reencoded into h264 files with 5.1 AAC audio. This plays just fine and dandy through my computer (and it's analog output ports) to my receiver (and it's "external decoder in") in glorious full surround. My reading seems to tell me that the extender will take this multichannel AAC audio and downmix it to stereo. Is this a correct assumption?

Re-encoding is not out of the question, as I have to do that anyway to up the bitrates now that I have a larger television. When I re-encode, I take it the best way to do it will be to embed the bitstreams (AC3/DD, DTS) right into the MKV container - this way the extender can simply pass the stream along to the receiver for decoding. Correct assumption?

I rip to VIDEO_TS folder stripping out only the main movie and audio tracks I want.. takes about 10min per movie. The HDD space gained by compressing to H264 isnt worth the time/effort IMHO. However, evilpenguin has a great tool for compressing tv/dvd called mediashrink. I use it for compressing MPEG-2 HDHR recording to H.264 with AC3 Audio in an MKV container. Works great. If you reencode then yes your best bet would be to rip to H.264 and copy the AC3/DTS soundtrack into an MKV. Sage/extender support for MKV is great.

I could also apparently use/create ISOs of my DVD's or simply rip down to the VIDEO_TS folder and let the system use them - depending on my available space (and available time to do the h264 rip/encodes!). With an extra hard drive or two, that may become a feasible option for me. Anyone have a preference between an ISO file vs. the VIDEO_TS rip?

I use VIDEO_TS because it just works. I'm not sure about ISO, but I think you have to run other software to mount/unmount the ISO for playback. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Blue-Ray Considerations:
My ongoing plan as I build a BD library is to rip the disc down to the hard drive. There are many options for just ripping down the disc and letting the new Sage beta read the file structure, or ripping down to the core audio files along with the main movie, or re-encoding to a lesser bitrate. The choice is mine based on how I want to manage my disc space. The key part is that I should maintain a core digital bitstream for the audio rather than compressing to a multichannel AAC for the same reasons as above.

I have an HD100 (thinking about upgrading to the HD200 for the bluray capabilities) and I rip my blu-rays to the hdd then copy just the main m2ts file. I remux them if neccesary (with tsmuxer) to a new m2ts file to get the core ac3/dts soundtrack of mux several m2ts files into a single file (like Hancock). With the HD100 i need to get the core ac3/dts soundtrack out of the HD one for stable playback (stuttering if I don't do this). From what I've read this isn't an issue with the HD200.

BOTTOM LINE
Do it and you won't be dissapointed

[greggerm]

.


(HD Theater Order placed...)


.

[chrishallowell]

Re-encoding is not out of the question, as I have to do that anyway to up the bitrates now that I have a larger television. When I re-encode, I take it the best way to do it will be to embed the bitstreams (AC3/DD, DTS) right into the MKV container - this way the extender can simply pass the stream along to the receiver for decoding. Correct assumption?

Yes, this works fine on an HD200. I use Handbrake and end up with an MKV container with h264 video and ac3 audio.

[greggerm]

Followup question -
Is/(was) there a WHS-specific version of SageTV out there I'll need to use on the headless server, or have they removed that version in lieu of the standard SageTV Media Center (standard server) software package?

I thought there was a WHS-specific version, but I can no longer find it on the site.

Thanks once more,
-Greg

[gplasky]

The WHS version is the SageTV download that ends in .msi and is installed through the WHS console. The versions for other Windows OS (XP, Vista, etc.) is the download that ends in .exe. There are two distinct downloads. It actually says this on the download site:

Download SageTV Media Server (V6.5 for Windows Home Server)

Click on the "Free Download" button on the main SageTV website to find the link.

Gerry

[greggerm]

Originally Posted by gplasky

Click on the "Free Download" button on the main SageTV website to find the link.

I looked practically everywhere except for the big fat graphic that says FREE DOWNLOAD. (sigh)

Thanks, my friend!
-Greg