What Motherboard?

[Greg]

Because the thread " What CPU?" got so long I'm not sure it's getting that much exposure so, I started this new thread. The thread migrated into a motherboard search, so a new thread may be appropraite for others searching at a later date.

From the last thread, I settled on the following CPU: AMD Athlon II X4 630.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...0II%20X4%20630


I copied the last two posts (with some editing) from "What CPU?".

An update to my motherboard search:

I've been reviewing boards from ASUS, MSI and Gigabyte. I think I eliminated ASUS and MSI as candidates, as they do not offer as much PCIe slots as Gigabyte. Gigabyte, at least on the boards that I'm interested in, offer one more x1 PCIe slot. I'm not sure that I will take advantage of it, but it's nice to have the option available. One potential issue is blocking of the connectors by other boards being in the way.

Thanks,
Greg



OK, I narrowed down the motherboard to the the following ATX style Gigabyte boards:

GA-MA785G-UD3H
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...GA-MA785G-UD3H

GA-MA785GT-UD3H
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...A-MA785GT-UD3H

GA-MA790GPT-UD3H
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-MA790GPT-UD3H

All of these boards have integrated graphics: HD 4200 for the 785 chipset and HD 3200 for the 790 chipset (the HD 3300 also has 128 MB of Sideport memory). I not opposed to a graphics card, but I'm going to see how the on-board solution works first. I will not be gaming and I will not be using the CrossFire mode.

Is there any performance differences between the HD 4200 and HD 3300 (with Sideport memory)?


My main goal was to get enough expansion slots as possible and I think these boards fit the bill.

The only real difference between the 785 and 790 boards is the PCI express issue with the chosen 785 boards that I mentioned a couple of posts back (shown again in red below). But, if I use the second graphics slot with a x1 or x2 board then it shouldn't be an issue....... an x4 or larger board would render two of the three x1 slots unavailable.

Two of the boards that I've been looking at are the Gigabyte GA-MA785G-UD3H and the GA-MA785GT-UD3H. Both have the same PCIe expansion slots as shown below (from Gigabyte's site):


1 x PCI Express x16 slot, running at x16 (PCIEX16_1) (Note 4)
1 x PCI Express x16 slot, running at x4 (PCIEX4_1) (Note 5)
(The PCIEX16_1 and PCIEX4_1 slots support ATI Hybrid CrossFireX technology and conform to PCI Express 2.0 standard.)

3 x PCI Express x1 slots (The PCIEX1_2 and PCIEX1_3 slots share the same PCIe bus with the PCIEX4_1 slot.) (Note 5)

NOTES:
Note 4) If you are installing a PCI Express graphics card, be sure to install it in the PCIEX16_1 slot.

(Note 5) The PCIEX1_2 and PCIEX1_3 slots share bandwidth with the PCIEX4_1 slot. When the PCIEX4_1 slot is populated with a x4 card, the PCIEX1_2 and PCIEX1_3 slots become unavailable.

I know a couple of people here are in favor of the GA-MA785G-UD3H. The reason for the other boards as candidates is for the DDR3 RAM, which may be more for future proofing than anything else at this time. And the GA-MA790GPT-UD3H has more capable PCI express graphic card slots.

Please comment back on the boards that I've selected.

Thanks,
Greg


Thanks again,
Greg

[MitchSchaft]

I went with a gigabyte ga-ma770-ud a couple months ago after my asus died. First time I've tried gigabyte and recommend them now. It doesn't have onboard video, but other than that it works fine.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...ss_T15_product

[IVB]

My needs were both for SageTV and Home Automation (CQC), so I accept that my setup was a little different than most. But I'll walk through some of it here in case you also want to expand similarly in the future.

I wanted to use a hardware based RAID card as I wanted to build a very large array that would be transportable to a different mobo in case this was unavailable, plus I wanted to offload stuff from the mobo. I have the Highpoint 3540, which is an 8x PCIe card. I also have a variety of PCI cards (HD OTA, Moxa 8way serial card, M-Audio 4 concurrent audio streams) plus USB devices (modem for callerID, blanking on others).

After MANY different mobos that didn't work (you can't use a non-video card in many non-1x PCIe slots on consumer boards), I ended up with the server-class Super Micro C2SBC.

It's pretty nice, it's got the 2nd PCIe 4x/8x slot, onboard video, 5 PCI slots, 6 SATA slots, and an onboard COM port. It has dual GigE, but I don't need that.

If you think you might make this into a bigger server type thing, but not directly render video, onboard graphics is just fine. But a server-class mobo may have advantages if you ever go with a physical RAID card (ie, not onboard RAID).

[MattHelm]

Originally Posted by IVB

...(you can't use a non-video card in many non-1x PCIe slots on consumer boards), ...

You can't? My Intel Ethernet card is currently setting in the only 16x slot on the MB of my server.

[IVB]

It's all *very* finicky, and is based on the card & the mobo.

IE, neither an LSI logic and Highpoint RAID cards would work in either the main 16x slot or a 2ndary 4x/8x slot of 3 different consumer mobo's that I got. The mobo was expected a video card in there, and even though I told it via BIOS that it wasn't going to get one, it just didn't like it.

I did hear of others using a different LSI card in a consumer mobo, but after trying 3 different ones I got sick of it and got a server-class mobo. Et voila, it all suddenly worked.

That experience is consistent with what the LSI logic support folks told me when I called bitching them out because they refused to give mobo recommendations. They just said "get any server mobo". (finally one guy said to get the SuperMicro one)

[Greg]

Originally Posted by MitchSchaft

I went with a gigabyte ga-ma770-ud a couple months ago after my asus died. First time I've tried gigabyte and recommend them now. It doesn't have onboard video, but other than that it works fine.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...ss_T15_product

For the price you can include a good video card and be near the price of a board with integrated video.

One of my concerns, and this is probably due to a lack of knowledge on my part, is that this board cannot take any cards over x1, except for the video card slot.

I'm not sure what other cards that I may want to add that maybe greater than x1. In the CPU thread a RAID card was said to be x4, and I did see some x4 NIC's, but I think these were high end.

What other cards take greater than x1?

Originally Posted by IVB

After MANY different mobos that didn't work (you can't use a non-video card in many non-1x PCIe slots on consumer boards), I ended up with the server-class Super Micro C2SBC.

It's pretty nice, it's got the 2nd PCIe 4x/8x slot, onboard video, 5 PCI slots, 6 SATA slots, and an onboard COM port. It has dual GigE, but I don't need that.
.

Originally Posted by MattHelm

You can't? My Intel Ethernet card is currently setting in the only 16x slot on the MB of my server.

I saw a motherboard review somewhere that had dual x16 slots, but when the second slot was used both slots ran at x8. The reviewer wanted to compare the performance of a video card running at the full x16 bandwith and at the x8 bandwidth. The reviewer inserted a PCIe NIC into the second slot to force the video card to run at x8.


Thanks,
Greg

[MitchSchaft]

Yeah, but integrated graphics suck. i.e., studdering when watching HD material. I have an older geforce 7600 I threw in it. That card is bare minimum as far as I'm concerned.

[IVB]

Originally Posted by MitchSchaft

Yeah, but integrated graphics suck. i.e., studdering when watching HD material. I have an older geforce 7600 I threw in it. That card is bare minimum as far as I'm concerned.

Hmm, I just realized I assumed he was building a server, not a video-rendering HTPC.

With an extender, I believe the server does nothing as far as video goes, just serving up the stream.

To the OP: My apologies if you're building an HTPC. I thought most folks nowadays just went the extender route. God knows I haven't looked back; playing BluRay, Hulu, Netflix WatchNow, as well as TV & DVDs has never been simpler, and I haven't had to muck with video or audio filters in years.

[Rico66]

Originally Posted by MitchSchaft

Yeah, but integrated graphics suck. i.e., studdering when watching HD material. I have an older geforce 7600 I threw in it. That card is bare minimum as far as I'm concerned.

HD3200 or HD4200 are perfectly fine for most htpc situtations. I've been using integrated graphics for a long time (dating back to Nvidia's 6150 and now a HD4200), and don't have problems watching HD.
Many graphics cards either produce additional heat or noise which isn't great either. And for a server solution an IGP sounds even more logical.

[Greg]

Originally Posted by IVB

Hmm, I just realized I assumed he was building a server, not a video-rendering HTPC.

With an extender, I believe the server does nothing as far as video goes, just serving up the stream.

To the OP: My apologies if you're building an HTPC. I thought most folks nowadays just went the extender route. God knows I haven't looked back; playing BluRay, Hulu, Netflix WatchNow, as well as TV & DVDs has never been simpler, and I haven't had to muck with video or audio filters in years.

No problem..........I think I'm confusing myself, as well as others. My main goal is a SageTV server with HD200 extenders, however I had this idea that I also wanted to run an HDMI cable directly to a TV. In a pure server role the simplest of graphics will work, because as you said, the server just serves up the stream.
Instead of driving a TV with the video output of the server it may be a better idea to build an HTPC Sage client for this one particular TV and serve up the stream to it.

As far as motherboards go, any of the ones that I selected or the one that Mitch recommended should work. I think were I get confused or side-tracked is where I read all of these reviews and look at the specs and start thinking about well, what if I get this board or that board, maybe this will future proof me if I decide to use it for other purposes down the road.

I think I got to stick to a game plan.......this is a server and don't over design/spec out the system.

So first, build a server and if needed, build a separate HTPC.

So, let's make this clear, especially for myself........this is for a server with no need to drive a TV directly...........HD200 extenders will be used. The stake has been put into the ground

So after saying that I need some final advice before selecting a motherboard.

I am using an AM3 socket CPU, so I have two options: an AM3 board or an AM3/AM2+ board. For a server does it matter? I think the only difference is DDR3 vs DDR2 RAM. Are there any other differences? Here is one area that I was getting hung up on the future proofing thing........to get DDR3 or not? Some say to get it, the prices are about the same as DDR2 and that's the future. There is only a $5 difference between the two boards, but, I think the other thing that I'm struggling with is the number of reviews. Both have professional reviews, but the DDR3 board has only 6 reviews at Newegg, while the DDR2 board has 107.

Thanks,
Greg

[SWKerr]

The difference in performance between DDR3 vs DDR2 has not been enough to warrant the extra cost but now that both are similar in cost it make sense to go with the DDR3. I would spend the extra $5.

You have more slots those boards than you will ever use. the 4x thing on the GA-MA785GT-UD3H sucks but you are unlikely to use that slot at all so it is really a philosophical argument. You have 3 PCIe x1 and 2 PCI slots. That is fine for your intended use.

On-board 785G/4200 graphics work great for watching TV or basic desktop work. If this thing becomes a HTPC some day you are still in good shape. If you get into gaming buy a Xbox or Playstation it is cheaper and less hassle.

If you have decided on server only for this thing than you should consider Windows Home Server. (Whole new thread. Raid\Backups etc.)

[Greg]

AVS Forum has the AMD Athlon II X4 630 CPU and the Gigabyte GA-MA785G-UD3H listed for one of their HTPC system recommendations.

I think this may be the board that I will be going with. It fits with what many people are saying here and what I have been able to come up with in my search.

Memory will be next.........I could hardly wait!

Thanks for all of the help,
Greg