iPad/iPod/iPhone application: TiSageTV

[Fonceur]

About tiSageTV

Tallus iOS SageTV allows you to monitor your SageTV Server, by browsing your Favorites, Scheduled recordings, etc. It also doubles up as a remote control, to navigate all your Client(s) and/or Extender(s), start/stop/pause playback, etc. The video streaming is done through jreichen's iOS streaming plugin. All this through the comfort of your iPhone, iPod or iPad.

Demo videos

Here are videos of the version 1.37, which might be slightly different from the current version...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnN_bp7TZi0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XB0k-AKYuBE

The second set is the avi version, should you be browsing on an iPad...

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/408295/TiSageTV-iPhone-2.avi
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/408295/TiSageTV-iPad-2.avi


Detailed instructions are available on the TiSageTV wiki.

This application is available on the app store ($29.99).

[ybrew]

$29 seems a bit steep, but I'd buy it.

Do you see any roadblocks to getting this approved on the app store? If so, would you consider going through cydia?

Will it be a universal app?

[Fonceur]

Originally Posted by ybrew

$29 seems a bit steep, but I'd buy it.

It's pretty much based on the big thread about buying it for $30... It also matches the android version, when you take into account Apple's 30% cut...

Do you see any roadblocks to getting this approved on the app store?

I don't see why there should be any issue. As I plan to offload the streaming itself to Air Video or such, that pretty much kills any issue Apple could have had with it.

Will it be a universal app?

Yes, it will handle iPhone/iPod/iPad from the same app. Initially it will be designed for my iPod touch in portrait mode, but supporting the other formats does not seem that hard.

[ybrew]

Originally Posted by Fonceur

It's pretty much based on the big thread about buying it for $30... It also matches the android version, when you take into account Apple's 30% cut...


I don't see why there should be any issue. As I plan to offload the streaming itself to Air Video or such, that pretty much kills any issue Apple could have had with it.


Yes, it will handle iPhone/iPod/iPad from the same app. Initially it will be designed for my iPod touch in portrait mode, but supporting the other formats does not seem that hard.

Cool. I didn't realized the android version was that much, but I probably only used the trial version (did you create that as well?). That was the only thing I liked about the android phone.

Like I said though, I'd buy it.

[Fonceur]

Originally Posted by ybrew

I didn't realized the android version was that much

The main issue is that SageTV is really a niche market. Unlike those 99 cents games with potential sales in the millions, the 6 months of development for taSageTV probably haven't resulted in 2 dozen sales yet, and most were at $9.99... Now tiSageTV has the potential of hitting the 3 digits sales for 2 months of development, but...

but I probably only used the trial version (did you create that as well?).

Yes, that was my first serious stab at a mobile app.

[madpoet]

Looking forward to it. If it works, I'll buy it

[Brent]

I'd pay $30 for it. If it had decent place shifting of livetv

[Chriscic]

Cool. Ditto on the I'll buy it too if it handles live TV streaming well (the one problem with Air Video).

[mikejaner]

I agree with others that $30 is steep, but it does fall in line with the Slingbox, and Hava apps etc...
If it is this price, I would expect, like Chriscic, perfect streaming of LiveTV, and pre-recorded shows. In addition I would expect a native app quality version of the Sagetv interface, including Guide, and recordings. If you were to throw in pictures, and music, it would definitely make it worth it.

[darcilicious]

I guess I'll be the nay-sayer here then. I can do all the "navigating" (recording schedule, recordings, guide, etc) with the free mobile web server. While an iPhone native GUI would be (very) nice, it wouldn't be worth $29.99 to me.

Speaking of cost: all of the Hava/Monsoon applications are currently free, OrbLive is $9.99 for full access to all media (live tv, audio, video, pictures, and documents) and the OrbServer is free. Air Video server is free and the iPhone app is $2.99. Sling appears to be the only one in the $29.99 price range.

I agree that a remote function would be nice but I've already got Intelliremote (server is $24, iPhone client is free) and no extenders so personally I wouldn't use it.

I definitely believe that developers should be compensated for their efforts; I just think in this particular case given the alternatives that I probably wouldn't pay $29.99 -- perhaps $19.99, definitely $9.99 (the price I paid originally for both OrbLive and Hava).

Just my $0.02...

[Fonceur]

Originally Posted by darcilicious

I can do all the "navigating" (recording schedule, recordings, guide, etc) with the free mobile web server.

Well, if you consider the cost of the phone over a 3 years plan, with the monthly charges and all, that mobile web server usage isn't exactly free... It's more of a $X versus $X + $30 where X >> 30...

I definitely believe that developers should be compensated for their efforts

OK, so lets ignore the 2.5 years of development time spent on SageTCPServer, MLSageTV, CQC SageTV plugin and taSageTV, which will make the development of tiSageTV much faster, compared to starting from scratch...

Instead lets assume 2 months to learn the iOS development environment and come up with tiSageTV. Now since Apple keeps 30%, lets make it 3 months. So take 25% of your yearly income, lets be generous and divide that by 100 sales, and that would be a fair price, right?

[mikejaner]

Originally Posted by Fonceur

Well, if you consider the cost of the phone over a 3 years plan, with the monthly charges and all, that mobile web server usage isn't exactly free... It's more of a $X versus $X + $30 where X >> 30...

Ah, but you have to divide, but the percentage of usage of this one particular app in a day. So if I use it 5 minutes a day, divide by 60, then 24 hours, then 365days, then by 3 years.... so 5/60/356/3=... carry the 0, and add the frustration ratio for updates and bugs etc... subtract medical bills for carpal tunnel etc....

Originally Posted by Fonceur

Instead lets assume 2 months to learn the iOS development environment and come up with tiSageTV. Now since Apple keeps 30%, lets make it 3 months. So take 25% of your yearly income, lets be generous and divide that by 100 sales, and that would be a fair price, right?

Better yet, let's take my wife's salary ($0) and divide by that, oh wait, my Pentium just crashed!!!!
What were we talking about?

[darcilicious]

Darn! And here I thought he meant that if I used his app instead, he'd cover my data usage fees for using his app!

[PLUCKYHD]

I got to say more power to Fonceur. By charging up front for his app and being up front about the cost time. I think his value is about right given he can accomplish everything he hopes to as always if you don't like the cost you don't have to use it.

It is definitely a fine balance and hard to figure the cost. I am sure on an hourly rate this will not equate to much money but at least it will give him incentive to stick around and fix bugs if nothing else. I am not sure of the sagetv to iphone/ipad market being sagetv is so limited anyhow.

I think it is a fair value and wish you good luck on the project.

[soulprops77]

Originally Posted by PLUCKYHD

I got to say more power to Fonceur. By charging up front for his app and being up front about the cost time. I think his value is about right given he can accomplish everything he hopes to as always if you don't like the cost you don't have to use it.

It is definitely a fine balance and hard to figure the cost. I am sure on an hourly rate this will not equate to much money but at least it will give him incentive to stick around and fix bugs if nothing else. I am not sure of the sagetv to iphone/ipad market being sagetv is so limited anyhow.

I think it is a fair value and wish you good luck on the project.

I agree with Plucky on this for the most part. However, for me to buy it at that price point it will need to be a full fledged Sage experience. Streaming and a polished UI are essential.

The combination of Hipporemote, Orb and the Mobile Web UI works very well at a fraction of the cost.

That being said, I'm pretty excited at the possibilities here and will be watching closely.

[ybrew]

I really like the remote screens. I've been less than pleased with most universal remotes in the app store. This is the best I've seen so far.
(I was starting my post to ask to PLEASE allow some customization of the remote interface, but after looking at the remote layout above, i'm not sure that's necessary)

When are you gonna be looking for beta testers?

[Fonceur]

Originally Posted by ybrew

I really like the remote screens.

Thanks, the buttons were created by jrlewis from the CQC forum for my Android app, so I figured it would be a good starting point.

(I was starting my post to ask to PLEASE allow some customization of the remote interface, but after looking at the remote layout above, i'm not sure that's necessary)

Making things totally configurable is way passed my current knowledge of the iOS SDK... OTOH, I am totally opened to suggestions. Trying to cram as much buttons as possible within 2 screens is certainly a challenge.

Currently, all the buttons are logically mapped except the |<<<, >>>| and abc123. The first 2 being redundant and without an extender I have no clue what the abc123 is supposed to do.

When are you gonna be looking for beta testers?

I am waiting for Tallus LLC to get an Apple developer's license, so I can start pushing the app to actual devices. Between the owner's day job and migrating the Tallus server to a new internet provider, that slows things down a bit...

[Chriscic]

Originally Posted by darcilicious

I guess I'll be the nay-sayer here then. I can do all the "navigating" (recording schedule, recordings, guide, etc) with the free mobile web server. While an iPhone native GUI would be (very) nice, it wouldn't be worth $29.99 to me.

Stop discouraging our developer : )

Seriously, I understand what you are saying. If I had less disposable income (and I don't have a ton but enough to pay $30 for something neat) I might feel differently since you can get most of the way there with existing solutions.

Regardless, Fonceur isn't likely to get rich off of this. Even at $30 and the app a big success selling several hundred units (how many Sage users are out there?) we're not talking retirement type $ here. But I'm sure the journey is the reward regardless (back to encouraging the developer)!

[Stuntman]

I'd pay $30 for the functioning app.. but I imagine the real question is.. would you sell twice as many if you sold it for $15? Three times as many at $10? No way to find out that I know of.. but I have to think that there is a reason why so many apps keep their prices down.. then again, as was stated, when you sell millions of copies of them you can afford to do it that way..

Glad I'm not having to make that decision!

Good luck! Looking forward to it, for sure!

[Fonceur]

Originally Posted by Stuntman

but I imagine the real question is.. would you sell twice as many if you sold it for $15? Three times as many at $10?

Yeah that was pretty much my logic. Considering that the prerequisites are already relatively high: 1) owning an iPod/iPad/iPhone, 2) owning a SageTV system and 3) having a subscription to a TV provider (or using an OTA antenna)... I don't need to hire a market research firm to know that I wouldn't triple my possible sales by selling at 1/3rd the price...

Since the typical SageTV user skips the commercials, having a free version with an annoying ad banner doesn't really make sense either...