Nest has been bought by Google - sound familiar?

[tmiranda]

Originally Posted by ranger

So just how is Google going to make money by knowing that my smoke alarm had 3 false triggers last month? I'm sure they'll find some way to turn that into revenue...

I am not a conspiracy theorist but I am finding it more and more disturbing that companies and nations can find out so much about me and are working every day to see how they can find out even more. I am very curious to see how this all plays out over the next several years. We certainly live in "interesting times".

[SomeWhatLost]

so, Google buys Nest, and all the conspiracy theories start...
but where were the theories when Google bought up all the military robot makers?

what I really want to know most of all is, what does Google want with a Sage watching, smart temp controlling(and smoke detecting) killer robot????

[hemicuda]

1984 was supposed to be a warning. NOT a blueprint.

[Skirge01]

Originally Posted by SomeWhatLost

but where were the theories when Google bought up all the military robot makers?

I wasn't planning to install one of those in my home, so I wasn't too concerned.

[SomeWhatLost]

Originally Posted by Skirge01

I wasn't planning to install one of those in my home, so I wasn't too concerned.

what you plan, and what Google plans may not be the same thing...

[pjpjpjpj]

I don't know what y'all do for a living, but personally, I have nothing the government would care about or have any interest in "watching" me for. "Oooh, I see your wife spent another $150 at Target today... you're prime on the suspect list now, the Feds are watching!!"

If it's all about the principle, fine, you can have your principle. But as long as no one leaks any credit card info (heyyyyy.... speaking of Target.... ), I don't care what the Feds know about me. And I'd rather not know.

On happier, less-tin-foil-hattish topics, I had a vision of your Google TV popping up an ad during a show saying "hey, I can see it's cold in your house, perhaps you might be interested in buying some more insulation for your attic?".

I'm an HVAC guy by trade. The thing I think is interesting about this - and one reason I don't have a Nest already - is that my two-story house has one AC unit and one thermostat. It only knows what the temperature is in my dining room (where the thermostat lives). Because of this, it's a never-ending battle trying to determine the right temp setting on the thermostat that will keep all the rooms relatively happy, while tweaking the manual dampers for each register throughout the rooms. And just when I think I have the summer and winter settings right, we get the arctic temps we had two weeks ago and nothing is happy... anyway, back to my point, this is far from a "whole house" solution. Unless you have multiple (not just two) AC units, or a commercial-grade HVAC system with controllability in every room (and a thermostat in each of those rooms), all this is going to do is give you the ability to change temps in the room where the Nest lives. Even if they make remote temp sensors that talk wirelessly to the Nest and report temps in other rooms, it doesn't really solve the situation unless you have a device (damper, heater, fan) in the ductwork serving that room that can do something about it.

[ranger]

It's all OK 'cause Fadell promises to keep Nest user privacy away from Google.

Let's skip the government getting the data for a minute since the NSA probably already knows everything they need to know... Now I have to worry about someone hacking my thermostat, smoke alarm, as well as my refrigerator to send out SPAM.

And maybe this is a bit of a tinfoil hat today, but one of the 'targets' of the Nest thermostat is to know when we're home and when we're not home. So now I need to add a security system to protect my house because someone hacked my thermostat and knows exactly when it is safe to break in....

[Skirge01]

Originally Posted by pjpjpjpj

I don't know what y'all do for a living, but personally, I have nothing the government would care about or have any interest in "watching" me for. "Oooh, I see your wife spent another $150 at Target today... you're prime on the suspect list now, the Feds are watching!!"

If it's all about the principle, fine, you can have your principle. But as long as no one leaks any credit card info (heyyyyy.... speaking of Target.... ), I don't care what the Feds know about me. And I'd rather not know.

Just because you don't have anything to hide doesn't mean they aren't compiling information which you'd really prefer they didn't.

[pjpjpjpj]

Originally Posted by Skirge01

Just because you don't have anything to hide doesn't mean they aren't compiling information which you'd really prefer they didn't.

I have no problem with receiving coupons for things that I actually want. I love when I get coupon booklets in the mail from Kroger (local grocery of choice) based on purchases using their customer card, because they are for exactly what I frequently buy. I kinda wish the coupons in the Sunday paper (yeah, I'm that old school) were more targeted because the goal is to save more money than the paper costs, but many weeks I'll cut out one or two coupons out of 3 booklets' worth, just because it's all stuff I'd never use.

But I know I'm in the minority and I don't mean to have this argued any further.

[pjpjpjpj]

Originally Posted by Skirge01

Just because you don't have anything to hide doesn't mean they aren't compiling information which you'd really prefer they didn't.

Google isn't the only one with "creepy" behavioral spying:
http://news.msn.com/science-technolo...nt-to-buy-them

[Skirge01]

Originally Posted by pjpjpjpj

Google isn't the only one with "creepy" behavioral spying:
http://news.msn.com/science-technolo...nt-to-buy-them

I read about that already and--from what I know so far--I'm not all that concerned about it (yet). Tracking how I use their website, how long I look at something, where my mouse lingers, what's in my wishlist, etc, doesn't really bother me. That's seems like typical "know your customer" research. It's a website I've chosen to use, search, and store information on. They're still not inside my home. I don't have an expectation of privacy when I decide to search their website for products, just like celebrities don't have such an expectation when they're followed by paparazzi everywhere they go. I definitely have an expectation of privacy inside my home.

[wayner]

Originally Posted by ranger

So now I need to add a security system to protect my house because someone hacked my thermostat and knows exactly when it is safe to break in....

But once you get a Nest door lock and Nest security system they can unlock the door and also disarm the system!

This isn't that far-fetched. My HA system Control4 controls door locks, security systems, IP cameras, etc. I am not sure about the current version but an earlier version had absolutely no authentication. If someone was able to get on your LAN, like hacking into your Wifi, then they could find your controller, telnet to it and send commands.

[wayner]

And here's another thing to think about:

If you keep wifi turned on with your phone then it will keep trying to find hotspots for you to connect to. Apparently public wifi spots have programs running that track the MAC ID of a device that is trying to make such a wifi connection. So they can know that the MAC ID of your phone was at Starbucks this morning, went to McDs for lunch, and then stopped at a store on the way home.

Perhaps this is a good reason to keep your mobile devices wifi turned off unless you need it.

[phelme]

Originally Posted by pjpjpjpj

...reason I don't have a Nest already - is that my two-story house has one AC unit and one thermostat. It only knows what the temperature is in my dining room (where the thermostat lives). Because of this, it's a never-ending battle trying to determine the right temp setting on the thermostat that will keep all the rooms relatively happy...

Have to agree. I could have a few Nest's in the house and they'd still have no idea that around the corner from the wall where they live there were humans getting cold and reaching for their sweatshirts. Nest would likely blame that on my placement though.

Even though I'm acquainted with some Nest employees (and couldn't be happier for them!) I always thought the Nest was a solution in search of a problem whose existence was a bit ethereal.

If you really want to "dial-up" your thermostat, say for a vacation home, there are much cheaper solutions out there that work fine, but look and function like your "dad's PC." They won't have the "iDevice" like simple (retro??) design that many crave and are willing to pay a premium for. And that's part of their appeal to some.

[Naylia]

Unless you've seriously re-inforced your door, the lock only keeps out high school kids. Foot vs door has a pretty nasty habit of ending up with door frame broken and door swinging wildly open, foot still in one piece. Even scarier is what it takes to open your french doors. If you have some, don't even look it up - you really don't want to know.

[Fuzzy]

As an HVAC controls guy, I am a firm believer that that NEST is a terrible thermostat. It's a great product, because it will sadly, continue to sell like crazy, but it's a terrible thermostat. It's core premise is that it's better to adjust setpoints based on whether you are home or away - and that is true - if you have a horribly insulated structure. If the structure is built well, and insulated properly, however, it likely makes no difference, and you might as well let the thermostat maintain a constant temperature/humidity in the space. If the structure was built properly, and setbacks were less important, now the online connectivity is also pointless. My point being, if we built the buildings right, and had proper humidity control, we wouldn't have to cludge around and micromanage the thermostat - it would be set once, and never be touched again.

[tmiranda]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

As an HVAC controls guy, I am a firm believer that that NEST is a terrible thermostat. It's a great product, because it will sadly, continue to sell like crazy, but it's a terrible thermostat. It's core premise is that it's better to adjust setpoints based on whether you are home or away - and that is true - if you have a horribly insulated structure. If the structure is built well, and insulated properly, however, it likely makes no difference, and you might as well let the thermostat maintain a constant temperature/humidity in the space. If the structure was built properly, and setbacks were less important, now the online connectivity is also pointless. My point being, if we built the buildings right, and had proper humidity control, we wouldn't have to cludge around and micromanage the thermostat - it would be set once, and never be touched again.

My HVAC guy tells me the same thing

Kind of like investing (which happens to be my daytime job), if your portfolio is built right there is no need to micromanage and trade every day.

[Brent]

Then again, not many homes are really energy efficient enough to maintain that argument. The home/away thing on the nest is not perfect, but it can definitely help in some cases.

[pjpjpjpj]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

As an HVAC controls guy ... If the structure was built properly, and setbacks were less important, now the online connectivity is also pointless. My point being, if we built the buildings right, and had proper humidity control, we wouldn't have to cludge around and micromanage the thermostat - it would be set once, and never be touched again.

And as an HVAC mechanical engineer, I will say, yes, you are correct.... but.... how many buildings are built right?

(okay, you're in California, where they are probably built better than most anywhere else due to your insane building and mechanical codes)

Most people's houses are crazy leaky, and poorly insulated even if they didn't leak. And it's not like commercial buildings are any better... over the past month when we've had some "fifty year" temperatures (-10F), some of our clients - one being a major worldwide financial company - have been wondering why they have pipes freezing, and opening up ceilings to discover gaps in construction where you could literally see daylight. Buildings built by large, well-known, typically reputable construction companies. So you can imagine what your "get 'em up as fast as you can" residential house builders are doing.

Long story short, while I agree that we "shouldn't" need thermostats like Nest, the sad state of construction actually gives them a market.

[Taddeusz]

I've looked at the Nest. For such an expensive and popular product they certainly have a lot of problems. I read lots of people having issues with the active mounting plate failing after even small voltage spikes.