OTA recording depository online - possible?

[wado1971]

I hope this random thought doesn't violate #4 on the forum rules. If not, maybe someone could shed some light on this for me.
Is it possible (read legal) to record an OTA TV show and then send that file to a friend?
What if I set up a server depository and ask anyone online to become my friend (registered user - no money involved)? Still legal?

Why do I ask...... the main reason is I'll occasionally miss a recording from my HTPC (normally my fault). Another reason... someone asks "did you see that bench-clearing baseball brawl last night?".. answer, "no it's not a favorite". Although it doesn't happen often, it still pisses me off that I can't go to a central location to simply download any missed file (with commercials from OTA broadcast).

Background info (why I ask): I currently subscribe to onlinetvrecorder.com which has an online service which allows it's subscribers to request any upcoming german tv recording prior to it's air time and then download that recording for free. They have EVERY broadcast German TV show 24/7 available for free. Now GermanTV is government regulated without any pay service to speak of so it's not really comparable to our system but I've always wondered if that model is relevant to the US with OTA broadcasts.

Now lets assume I have the resources to tape all OTA programs 24/7-x2wks (which i don't.. but) and set up a server to allow distribution of these shows to anyone who wants them. As long as I don't make any money, I see no problem legally!! Taking it one step further, you can now add my url to the sagetv online service menu to list by network/date/time and stream at your convenience. You've just increased your recording storage capacity by about ..?? well let's just say 4OTA networks x 24/7/2 = 1344 hrs of recordings.

Of course we see some hints at this with some various business models like the recent hulu and the networks have some (not all) content available but both require leaving my couch/remote to access and come with limited lineups. I realize this wouldn't divert my current htpc approach all that much but might be a nice addition.

thoughts?
w

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by wado1971

I hope this random thought doesn't violate #4 on the forum rules. If not, maybe someone could shed some light on this for me.
Is it possible (read legal) to record an OTA TV show and then send that file to a friend?
What if I set up a server depository and ask anyone online to become my friend (registered user - no money involved)? Still legal?

No. TV shows are copyrighted. You are allowed to record them for your own use, but you are not allowed to sell or give them to others.

That's why rule #4 exists on this forum.

- Andy

[bastafidli]

I wonder if the possible business model would be to rent recorders rather then the recordings. Imagine I have a facility which can record 24x7 and I allow you to rent this facility for a reasonable fee. Let say $1 a day you can go to web and tell me what TV shows you want to record and my hardware records it for you and let you watch it. So in fact I have rented you the hardware to record the TV shows for your own use the same way as the cable provider rents you the DVR, but instead of the DVR being in your living room, it sits in my datacenter. You can then go and watch whatever you recorded. Well on the backend if two people decide to record the same thing I can just record it once and let those 2 people watch it (but not anybody else, since they haven't recorded it). Well people could then subscribe to rent the facility to record for themself the entire line up all the time and again. What I would be doing is renting them the hardware rather then sharing with them the shows.

To make it even more transparent to the law, let say my facility from the perspective of a user would behave exactly as Tivo and I would call it TiWo, So whatever you can do with your Tivo at home you would be able to do with my TiWo over the Internet but nothing more (record only the channels you subscribe too, etc.). The only advantage I would give you is that me TiWo would have enough capacity to record 24x7xAll channels for 2 weeks. So then what is the legal difference between the Tivo and TiWo when only hardware difference is that the tuner and HDD is not in your house but in my datacenter???

Hey, if this is patentable, be warn they you have heard it here first .

[gplasky]

Still probably illegal because I don't think you can rebroadcast or resell the recording. Cable companies pay license fees to do what they do.

Gerry

[bastafidli]

I think it will be interesting to see if somebody will try it because the on demand tv recording is the next step in current evolution of TV unless the channels finally wake up and do it themselves.

Imagive Tivo evolution path:
0. current state: full hardware Tivo box sitting on your shelf.
1. evolution: instead of recording to HDD, record to Amazon S3 and get rid of the HDD.
2. evolution: instead of recording from the local cable attached to the box and then sending it to S3 tell somebody else to record it to S3 and make it available to you and get rid of the tuners.

So now we basically had what is HD extender except with shared backend. I wonder which step would be deemed illegal.

[wado1971]

This must (might) be what onlinetvrecorder.com is doing. I can't imagine that the copyright laws are much different in Germany and I always thought it was a bit odd the way they operate. You must FIRST request the show before it begins and then it's available to you - if you forget to request it.. then no show. This "request" may in fact be to rent their hardware.?.? They also supply a decoder software which must be used on each downloaded file. This software not only decodes but also opens up a browser page to insure your account made the request prior to airing. They of course make money on ads.

Has anyone seen a2bTV - someone using slingbox and satelliteTV in Wyoming to make a buck. Reading the FAQ is very interesting. Especially the answer to the question "Can I see my equipment" They apparently "host" your equipment.

[GKusnick]

Originally Posted by wado1971

As long as I don't make any money, I see no problem legally!!

It's not about whether you make money. It's about undercutting the copyright owner's ability to resell the work. If they choose to broadcast it again, they get paid again by the advertisers depending on the size of the audience. If nobody watches the rebroadcast because you've given away copies for free, the advertisers aren't interested and the owner doesn't get paid.

Basically any time you distribute a work without the copyright owner's permission, you're taking money out of their pocket, even if you're not getting paid. That's the whole theory of copyright, which means literally the right to make and distribute copies.

[mistergq]

In the United States, this is a well resolved legal issue. Whether a company or individual makes any money or not is irrelevant, you cannot record an OTA TV show and then send that file to a friend. Its a clear US copyright violation. Companies have already been taken down for this approach of "pooling" shows and redistributing to various customers.

[stanger89]

ReplayTV got sued almost out of existance (partially) due to their "Internet Video Sharing" feature.