SageTV talk on GreenButton

[cncb]

As an alternative I just wanted to mention that I wrote a tool that imports MyMovies data into J River Media Center. You can then use my JRMC Media Explorer plug-in/STVi and have multiple views into your DVD collection from Sage. I know it is throwing additional software into the mix but you can use JRMC to manage your music and images too. There are limitless ways of viewing your DVD collection using JRMCs view schemes and the SageMC custom menus. For example, I have a "DVDs" menu item in the Sage main menu that leads to a sub-menu that contains Cast, Genre, Category, and Year menu items. Selecting "Year", for example, presents all the years of the DVDs in your collection and selecting a specific year displays all the DVDs in that year sorted in any way you want.

Click the link in my signature for more information.

[ghostlobster]

Box sets/multi-disc sets, I'm using the 2 terms interchangebly. Basically, within MyMovies, I select LOTR Fellowship of the ring, and I'm presented with a bunch of selctions..Play Disc 1, Play Disc 2, Extra features disc 1, etc.

re:
Did back cover really disappear from SageMC? I thought that was in there? Everything else you list (I think) should be in SageMC if you've imported metadata from somewhere (like DVD Profiler).

I am running SageMC, and I have not seen anything related to back covers. However, I'm just doing the basic IMDB lookup within SageMC and pretty much just getting some kind of cover and a name.

I'm not using DVDProfiler or anything else like that. I suppose I could, but that kind of defeats the discussion related to MyMovies...it does everything without the need for another tool.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by ghostlobster

Box sets/multi-disc sets, I'm using the 2 terms interchangebly. Basically, within MyMovies, I select LOTR Fellowship of the ring, and I'm presented with a bunch of selctions..Play Disc 1, Play Disc 2, Extra features disc 1, etc.

Well, to me they're potentially different, take for example Lord of the Ring EE. Each movie is a multi-disc set, two for the feature, and two for extras. I would envision (ideally and fully implimented) you see one entry in the list for "LOTR: FOTR: EE", which would show the box art, all the relevant info, and would provide options to play the any of the four discs.

However, LOTR EE is also a box set of FOTR, TT, and ROTK, so for these, ideally there should be one overall entry for "LOTR", which would bring up a list of FOTR, TT and ROTK, each of which would go to the situation described above.

Of course that's kind of an extreme example, the big difference is I see there are two forms of grouping, one where several discs belong to a single item (LOTR: FOTR: EE) with movie+extras. In this situation you want to be presented with a "Detailed Info" view with the discs information and links to play any of the associated discs.

On the other hand, there's things like say the Star Wars or Star Trek (movie) box sets, where you want to be presented a single "Star Wars"/"Star Trek" top level item, that takes you to a sub-list of the individual movies, which takes you to the above Detailed Info page. This is much easier to implement, because each disc is a "mediafile" to SageTV with unique metadata. Associating metadata with a group of "mediafiles" is not trivial.

re:
Did back cover really disappear from SageMC? I thought that was in there? Everything else you list (I think) should be in SageMC if you've imported metadata from somewhere (like DVD Profiler).

I am running SageMC, and I have not seen anything related to back covers. However, I'm just doing the basic IMDB lookup within SageMC and pretty much just getting some kind of cover and a name.

It's been a really long time since I really used SageMC, last time I seriously played with it was when it was still mlbdude's baby, I'm pretty sure he/we had it displaying front and back covers, but I could be thinking of something of my own tinkering (and just to be clear, that would be from like version "1.5" of SageMC which was a much different animal than it's current incarnation).

I'm not using DVDProfiler or anything else like that. I suppose I could, but that kind of defeats the discussion related to MyMovies...it does everything without the need for another tool.

Don't you have to open the MyMovies collection management app in MyMovies? To enter/fix metadata?

Personally I think DVD Profiler + SageTV/SageMC is much more like VMC+MyMovies than SageTV/SageMC + IMDB. The MyMovies collection management app is almost a DVD Profiler clone.

[mbowe]

Originally Posted by stanger89

Personally I think DVD Profiler + SageTV/SageMC is much more like VMC+MyMovies than SageTV/SageMC + IMDB. The MyMovies collection management app is almost a DVD Profiler clone.

I agree, MyMovies didn't feel seemlessly integrated with VMC for me, or any more integrated then it looks like DVD Profiler will be with Sage. But, I was primarily an extender user, so only TV and msft formats felt seemlessly integrated.

Another difference/confirmation. MyMovies is free, DVD Profiler is for purchase now isn't it? I remember in the old days it was free, but I've not seen it in many years now.

[direwolf08]

I am not a Sage user, but I like to keep tabs on HTPC frontend software. In my limited experience with SageTV, the UI is the only thing that kept me from buying the software and outfitting my entire house with extenders. Feature-wise, SageTV has no equal. It is simply the best and the developer community that is out there is really the strength of this product. However the UI is simply too hard to navigate and too ugly for me to give Sage a serious shot. Here are my suggestions for improvements (some have already been mentioned):

1) Consistency in the look and navigation of the different menus has to be improved. On a lot of the SageMC themes, the home screen might look nice, but if that doesn't carry through to the rest of the menus, then you are left with a half-baked looking HTPC frontend.

2) The video, music, and picture interfaces are in desperate need of a redesign. Those interfaces should really have the media thumbnails taking centerstage. Currently they really miss that mark. Certain MP and XBMC skins are really good at doing that, not to mention coverflow.

3) This is very subtle: use text smoothing. this simple tweak makes UI's look much more polished.

4) Create a separate, equally polished touchscreen interface.

5) Sometimes simpler is better. Enough with the ornate backgrounds, oddly colored button shadows, highlights and glassy looks.

Some folks in the SageMC screenshot thread have really gone above and beyond with proving what can be done with the sageMC interface. Hopefully, some more UI improvements will come to light in v7, that will make me a convert.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by direwolf08

I am not a Sage user, but I like to keep tabs on HTPC frontend software. In my limited experience with SageTV, the UI is the only thing that kept me from buying the software and outfitting my entire house with extenders. Feature-wise, SageTV has no equal. It is simply the best and the developer community that is out there is really the strength of this product. However the UI is simply too hard to navigate and too ugly for me to give Sage a serious shot.

I believe the strengths are the solution to the weakness. The extreme flexability of the Sage software, combined with the strength of the developer community, have lead to a very good overall product. I do agree that Sage lacks 'Out-of-the-box' flair, but a few community add-ons, and it is hands-down the best overall solution for a whole-house DVR/Media setup. There are areas that still need a lot of work, such as Picture Galleries, and Music Library, but overall, it is a wonderful system.

[stevech]

everyone in this family has long said that there needs to be a dumbed-down UI for sage. Takes WAY TO MANY button pushes to do common things.

And the left-margin icons are much too easy to hit and do something that the non-techie user can't recover from. Like change the listings filters.

More times that I'd like to count, I've heard it exclaimed, after a bout of Sage UI frustrations: "Why is it that we don't just get a TiVo?"

And no, I don't want to become a UI designer with the Sage Studio tools. I tried it. Would take far too much time to learn.

I am very happy that the version of Sage I use runs and runs and doesn't crash or bugger up a database.

[wayner]

I am a new Sage user - moving over from XP MCE. I have also used TiVo for years and I have dabbled with BTV and Vista MC.

Some posters on this thread have compared the UI to TiVo and say "What's wrong?" Well the Main Menu is TiVo-like but not when you get deeper in the menu structure.

There is often too much on the screen at once. When you go into screens like SageTV Recordings the screen is just way too busy, with too many icons, many of which are not intuitive. The fonts are also the same - perhaps the titles could be in bold but other info like channel and date could be not bold to be less obtrusive.

The same thing when you click to "View Recording detail". You get a mishmash of lots of text that makes it very hard to find what you are looking for. Do you really need all of this information on the screen at once in the same bold text?

And there are other things that are annoying - if you are using a mouse and you click on the vertical scroll bar the behaviour does not follow the Windows standard.

And the icons could REALLY use an update. They remind me of those programs in the early 90s that tried to look like Windows but were really a DOS program - either that or they were lifted from Windows 3.0!

[snoby]

Hi I'm a vmc user and it drives me crazy that I use vmc. I would LOVE to jump ship, vmc is so bloaty. I moved to vmc because I liked the thumbnail recorded tv view and (unlike MCE 2005) you can hit the stop button and it stops the recording. Those last two features are the only thing that keeps me from going back to MCE2005. Oh yeah and the fact Microsoft doesn't care to support MCE 2005 any more.

All that being said I've tried SageTV a number of times and I've been disappointed. On the same machine as my main HTPC, the playback was more jerky (in vista, this was before EVR). The UI is just as described by wayner. So I'll try again, but SageTV has two big things working against it:
1.) UI
2.) cable card, Satellite Tuners

yes I know that Satellite Tuners aren't out yet, but they are in testing. Lord help us so that MS doesn't tie the satellite tuners to Windows Media Center 7, like they did with vmc.

Can someone point us to a Sagetv MC theme that duplicates vmc?

Thanks for letting me rant,
Matt

[mikejaner]

I don't see the Satellite tuners being unlocked for use other than on Windows 7 Media Centers, just like the Cable Cards. I hope they suprise us, but I doubt it.
Why not consider the HDPVR for recording from any Component source?
SageMC is pretty customizable, take a look at the screenshots thread in that forum to see what others have done.

[HelenWeathers]

All that being said I've tried SageTV a number of times and I've been disappointed. On the same machine as my main HTPC, the playback was more jerky (in vista, this was before EVR). The UI is just as described by wayner. So I'll try again, but SageTV has two big things working against it:
1.) UI
2.) cable card, Satellite Tuners

yes I know that Satellite Tuners aren't out yet, but they are in testing. Lord help us so that MS doesn't tie the satellite tuners to Windows Media Center 7, like they did with vmc.

I used MCE for 4 years, converted to Sage TV back in August and I love it. I use the Sage MC STV with one of the default themes. I added a main menu item to play my Blu-ray disks via Total Media Theater thru Sage. It looks good and gives me everything I want. So much for the UI.

In my SageTV server I have 3 OTA ATSC tuners for my local HiDef stations and 2 HD PVRs for my DirecTV HiDef. I watch on two clients and my brand new STP-HD200 extender. I don't get stutter except the occasional drop-out that is part of sat reception in general. Not the fault of SageTV at any rate. Maybe you'll need to upgrade some of your equipment for HiDef but it's worth it.

I waited for three years for those PC sat tuners and finally gave up on them and moved on. By the way, those Sat tuners bring DRM along with them, SageTV doesn't.

Take the plunge, work thru your issues, you'll be a happy camper as I am.

[ghostlobster]

Snoby,
This might help you out a bit...althought it's a bit outdated as I have not updated it in a while, but it'll get you pointed in the right direction.

http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34551

[snoby]

Thanks everyone for the feedback, I did a new install of SageTV with the latest sagemc. Is there no way for me to get the recordedTV view to show a video thumbnail like vmc while using sagemc for each entry? I know the default theme in SageTV does it, however it adds extra information into the picture that I don't like.

Basically the VMC recordedTV screen is what sold me on VMC to begin with.

The studder issue I think can be contributed more to vista than anything else. quick system specs:
AMD 4200+
ATI 2600XT
2 GB RAM
2 OTA tuners
2 analog cable tuners

Honestly my perfect Media Center would be Vista Media Center running on XP with the customization ability of Sage.

[Brent]

Originally Posted by snoby

...I did a new install of SageTV with the latest sagemc. Is there no way for me to get the recordedTV view to show a video thumbnail like vmc while using sagemc for each entry? I know the default theme in SageTV does it, however it adds extra information into the picture that I don't like. ...

In SageMC, you can view the video thumbnail by changing the following setting:

Settings>SageMC>Main>Screen Specific Options>My TV>Video Thumbnails

And select "Enabled"

[snoby]

Yes that does show a thumbnail whenever your cursor is on the recordedTV listing, but I'm talking about duplicating what VMC has. Where there are columns and columns of thumbnails of videos.