New to Sage - Some Questions

[stefam]

OK, first post! I've been lurking the forums and learning all I can... But still have some questions while I wait for Sage to restock the HD Extenders...

I'm almost done with my 21-day trial and I'm loving it. After tinkering with Vista an XP MediaCenter for 3 years, Sage surpassed them in 4 weeks!

So... It seems obvious (after weeks of fumbling) that SageMC is the way to go. Lots of plug-ins, better WAF, etc.

1) Why isn't the default interface more like that one? You'd think they'd use the ideas, pay the fans who developed it, or something.

2) Why doesn't everyone use it? I'd imagine that would be the first thing most would do...

Am I missing something? Am I losing something critical (besides a full, very well written manual that comes with the OOTB solution)? Just seems you get a lot for just a little more effort and that these things would be rolled into the core product (well maybe not commskip and such... )

I'm testing on a PC with a PCI tuner, but:
Planning to roll out on a heavily modified HP MediaSmart home-server (model 475, 2GB RAM and a 2.6 GHZ processor) with two "stick" style digital tuners from hauppauge (HVR-950Q) in a USB2 hub, the HD-extender, old MCE remote (actually Logitec harmony with MCE profile), and only OTA ATSC signals (no cable or sat). My pioneer receiver will do the audio from the extender, and DVDs will be ripped or played from a DVD player (not Sage. An external eSATA DVD or Bluray may come later - as may the Wii Remote interface I'm tinkering with).

3) Am I missing anything? Suggestions before I plunge?

Probably shouldn't lump these in he same thread, but I will...
Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks
-Mike

[starfire]

Originally Posted by stefam

1) Why isn't the default interface more like that one? You'd think they'd use the ideas, pay the fans who developed it, or something.

2) Why doesn't everyone use it? I'd imagine that would be the first thing most would do...

3) Am I missing anything? Suggestions before I plunge?

1. Only Sage developers know the answer ! Perhaps Sage V7 will have a better interface. Without SageMC I would not have purchased Sage myself, just too family unfriendly I feel.

2. I suspect most people do? Maybe someone did a poll sometime on the forum, haven't checked

3. Nope, as you have done mess with the trial and make sure it does what you want

[stuckless]

1) Why isn't the default interface more like that one? You'd think they'd use the ideas, pay the fans who developed it, or something.

I can't speak for SageTV, but I would think that there are plenty of "fans" that use the default STV and prefer it over the SageMC. SageMC is pretty good, but the good thing about Sage is that you have the choice to install plugins to custom build your experience. Some people might say, why not have Comskip, imdb, webserver, etc, etc, etc as part of the default stv? I think that Sage is cautious to include anything into the default stv, since it just increases their support costs and maintenance costs. On the flip side, some developers, may not want Sage to "include" their plugin and "own" them. When that happens, they basically lose control over something that they built.

Personally, I'd rather that the Sage stv/plugin model was a little more "plugin" friendly, like the FireFox and Eclipse RCP plugin model, AND that they used a better MVC pattern so that the "View" was truly a view, and in being so, there could have been a lot more code reuse between SageMC and the default STV. Today, many plugins are SageMC specific, and it's shame that plugins couldn't have been more reuable between different STVs. I realize that Some plugins, that don't make ui contributions are compatible across different STVs, but most are STV specific.

[JREkiwi]

Originally Posted by stuckless

I can't speak for SageTV, but I would think that there are plenty of "fans" that use the default STV and prefer it over the SageMC.

I agree. I suspect that the vast majority of SageTV users are using the default STV. Of the users I know personally, none use SageMC, although all of them have tried it. (none of them inhaled )

Discussion on any forums is always skewed as the contributors are generally only a small subset of the install base.

John

[doc]

Originally Posted by stuckless

I can't speak for SageTV, but I would think that there are plenty of "fans" that use the default STV and prefer it over the SageMC.

I am one of those fans.

I just don't like the Windows/Vista media centre interface. I never have done, from the first time I saw it. Yes its flash, but I prefer a good old fasioned menu system. Why wait for the whole screen to scroll round when all you want to do is move down one line on a menu!

I spend most of the time watching TV, not looking at the menu interface

[tchapin]

I find the original SageTV interface to be almost unsable; the way that it's organized just does not work with my brain.

Not really the main menu, but the sub menus, like how the different options are laid out in the Recorded TV screen. Also, I find the icons that they chose to be difficult to map to their actions.

Also, the "settings" menus are horribly organized, and unfortunately, SageMC doesn't help us evade them.

I agree that if SageMC didn't exist, I would not have bought a license.

Also, it might depend on whether people are using extenders. My feeling is that SageMC is much more extender-friendly than the original interface.

Todd

[rv73]

Ditto.
Original SageTV interface = unusable
SageMC = Awesomeness x 7. Main reason I bought Sage.

I love how you can change the rows and columns and font size of the Guide.
Very cool. No other media center can touch Sage at the moment.

Keep in mind though,
You can't play a CD from SageMC.
A user made plugin enables it in original Sage though.

Stupid ? Yes.

As my friend says when he came round to show his new CD to me:
"So you paid thousands for a computer and all this software, and it doesn't play a CD ?"

[GKusnick]

Originally Posted by rv73

"So you paid thousands for a computer and all this software, and it doesn't play a CD ?"

To be fair, you didn't pay anything for SageMC. That's a freebie, so you can't really complain too much if it lacks some feature you want.

Also, nothing stops you from installing plugins into the stock STV and switching to that when you want to do things that SageMC doesn't support natively. So in fact your Sage system can play a CD if you take the trouble to set it up for that. Not the same as out-of-the-box support, I agree, but to say it can't do it at all is a bit of an exaggeration.

All of that said, I'm not a SageMC user myself. I'm not wild about the stock STV either, but I don't consider it unusable, just unappealing. Most of the time I use a custom STV I created myself, but I revert to stock for some things like setup and the music browser.

As to why the stock STV isn't more like SageMC, what would be the point of that? Choice is good, right? Given that SageMC exists, it would seem like a waste of effort for the Sage devs to imitate it instead of doing something different that might appeal to people who don't find SageMC compelling.

[stefam]

Thank you for the replies! its interesting to see that many people who know about both interfaces choose the stay ootb. Nothing wrong with that, but it does remind me that self != world.

Going ahead with my project and will use SageMC! After that's done I will be a paid user and entitled to whine about lack of windows mobile support on placeshifter!

Thanks again!

-Mike

[freedml]

If SageMC is great (and it looks great, I just haven't been able to get it working yet) and so much better than the standard system, why doesn't SageTV embrace it and offer it as the standard system? Volunteers have spent countless hours making this thing spin like a top -- all SageTV has to do is get their permission to use it, beta test it, and make life SO MUCH EASIER on the rest of us, saving us countless hours and headaches!

* merged *