Centralized vs distributed video systems

[wayner]

I have a Control4 Home Automation system. Many of the folks with a system like this have matrix switches and place all of their AV sources in a central location and then distribute via Ethernet or HDMI cables to all of the end-points in their house.

This is more expensive up-front, as the matrix switches can be horrendously expensive, but it can save you money on things like cable box rental as you only need as many cable boxes (or SageTV extenders) as you have people in the house. And it makes it very easy to seamlessly move from one room to another while watching a show, even easier than what it is with SageTV. It can also allow you to have a cleaner install since you will have very little hardware in the room where your AV end-points reside.

I have been arguing against some of these folks that have centralized systems that it is a waste of money, especially since the hardware is getting smaller and cheaper and it is easier to mount a HD300 or Nvidia Shiled invisibly behind your TV.

Anyone have any feelings on this topic?

[EnterNoEscape]

I have a centralized system I built from the ground up. I'm familiar with Crestron and Control4 systems, but just couldn't stomach the expense and that it doesn't really feel like it's your hardware since there isn't a lot you can do yourself to expand it. I realize I'm probably in the minority since I'm sure a lot of people would rather just call in a professional and have them just make it work.

If I were to do it again, and I will likely be in that boat again when I buy a new house, I wouldn't bother with the centralized approach. The first reason is because of all of the effort involved in getting everything working from a remote control standpoint. The second reason is all of the additional cabling required for audio/video. The third reason is that almost anything I ever want to do now can be done with very small Android boxes, so why am I being a masochist with my design.

When I had to be able to share a Bluray player, Android box, HD300 with all of the rooms in my house, the central location made sense. I rarely use the Bluray player and the Android boxes replace the HD300. The Android boxes are so cheap and do everything I want, so I really can't think of a good reason to go through all that effort a second time.

Edit: The only thing that I would probably do again is if the room has in-wall speakers (I did this for a few rooms in my house), I would route all of the back to a central location or closet just to get the amp out of sight.

[wayner]

Thanks for the response ENE. I put in a bunch of Control4 lighting, blinds, etc about a decade ago when I was doing some renos on my house. I didn't really use it for media at all until recently and right now I am just using it for audio distribution. C4 works very well for lighting, etc but it isn't cheap as you are looking at close to $150/dimmer or switch and you need more expensive dimmers to handle LED lighting.

Having a Sage system with extenders I, like you, never understood the attraction of a centralized system that requires (probably) additional cabling and $5k+ spent on stuff like matrix switches. We have 8-9 TVs in our house but at most of them only 2 sources which is SageTV and cable boxes, but the cable boxes are rarely used. But the folks on the Control4 forums swear by it and don't know why anyone wouldn't do this, despite the high cost. They say that they don't want to futz around with a Shield mounted behind a TV.

Some of the newer video over IP stuff looks interesting, like Just Add Power. But even then you are spending at least $500/source and $500/end point, and more if you want to future-proof by getting hardware that can handle 4K. And you essentially need a dedicated LAN for this equipment so you may need additional ethernet drops throughout your house. But if I was building a new house or doing substantial renovations I would consider it and certainly ensure that I ran enough cabling plus extra conduit for every room where I may want AV stuff.

The audio distribution and control is somewhat interesting and I could see myself doing more in this area - putting wall or ceiling speakers in most rooms and having that as a second zone in rooms where you have a TV and (in some instances) an AVR with a surround system. But then you have to run lots of speaker wire around your house and tie it back to a central matrix amp.

Control4 is pretty good in that you can control most of what you want, but you still need a dealer to do mundane stuff like add a new DVD player or whatever. I work with an online dealer to do this sort of stuff and that works OK. You can also find the hacked "dealer" versions that let you do everything if you are so inclined.

Getting everything working from a remote control standpoint isn't that hard with a system like C4. That is probably where it shines. But then you generally need one of their remotes and controllers in each room although you may be able to avoid this if you have hardware that can be controlled via IP or if you can extend IR buds into your rooms.

Someone did a SageTV driver for Control4 a few years back. However I don't think it works anymore. It used IP control but required you to be running the SageTV webui without authentication. Or you could just rewrite the driver to use IR for control.

[nebulink]

I have C4 throughout my house. I use it to control Audio, Thermostats, Video Distribution, Lighting, Locks, and Cameras. It works great.

I have a 16x16 video matrix. This was an expensive piece of equipment. It works great. When I purchased it, it was necessary to provide a nice clean look at the TV's by reducing clutter. However, now that I primarily only use Roku boxes the matrix is probably overkill for me. A Roku can easily be attached behind a TV to provide a nice clean look.

[wayner]

Following up on this again - there is a system called Video Storm. It is kind of interesting and is much cheaper than traditional centralized systems. It is more of a virtual matrix switch in some ways. It uses an AndroidTV box at the TV as the "receiver" of your video.

But that begs the question - if you have an AndroidTV box at every TV then do you need to have everything centralized? Some folks swear by this and I do see the point of a centralized and synchronized whole house audio system, but I am not as convinced with video vs having SageTV extenders or AndroidTV devices at every TV.

[Wayneb]

I have an Octava Video Matrix switch and an HTD audio matrix in my setup.

One thing bad about my Video Matrix setup, with a long HDMI cable in the wall, a nearby lightning strike blew out the HDMI ports on my living room TV and also on my AV Receiver.
I had even unplugged the power during the storm but the strike was close enough to induce a current in the cables. The electrical outlets were arcing also and I lost a lot of electronics that day.

I don't like any Home Automation system I can't install myself, I use CQC and I also have a bunch of URC Complete Control remotes, the in wall remotes can send IP commands directly and the other remotes can have there RF commands used to send IP commands through my automation controller.

I won't buy URCs newer Total Control stuff because they won't give the software to non dealers anymore.

[wayner]

By the way, the Video Storm distribution system uses encoders that are essentially the same as the BM-1000/BM-3000 to do the HDMI encoding. Then it uses an AndroidTV app at the other end to do the decoding.

[Telecore]

Every time I look at a centralized system, I always come to the same conclusion that I did back in 2010 - use SageTV+wired ethernet and put an extender at each TV. (also add Rokus to those locations that might use them). Done. Everything else I have searched for and looked at ends up costing too much. By the way, I use Insteon with the ISY994i for home automation, IR over Cat5 for remote control and Apple Airplay for music - very much a DIY setup.

[wayner]

I personally think it is only of marginal benefit but many of the folks in the HA world swear by it. That may be due to not being familiar with the advantages of a SageTV system.

@Telecore - Isn't a Shield even a better solution? They you don't need a Roku - run SageTV on the Shield and also use it for streaming services, etc.

[Telecore]

Well the solution I described pre-dates the Nvidia Shields, but I do have two Nvidia Shields as well (connected in locations which also have a HD-300) and they are my only 4K/HDR sources at this time. Some time in the future I can see these being a possible 1 box solution, but some minor issues (remote control and 5.1 audio + non-jerky video) are preventing me from using them full-time for SageTV. Use for the Rokus is going down because now I watch Netflix in 4K/HDR via the Shield.