Tuner card required?

[YvesAdeleHarlow]

I've downloaded and installed SageTV, and I'd like to see it stream a ripped (non-copy protected) DVD before I buy. If I can't get that working, I might as well stick with MCE.
The trouble I'm having is playback errors (-4,0 x80040217). I've searched the forum and found a few hits, but none of the offered solutions have helped. I'm using a GeForce4 MX 440 video card, have no tuners installed on this test machine, and have tried both VMR9 and overlay renderer settings.
The SageTV decoder filter is set to SageTV MPEG decoder, the video card has been set to both clone and dualview, and 3d acceleration is set to performance.
I've tried both tv as primary display (via s-video) and the machine's video monitor as primary. I've tried all of these in various permutations. All result in the same error.
So my question is, do I need to have tuner cards installed on this test machine to stream imported dvd files? Could an underpowered CPU be the problem? Or am I doing something else wrong?

Tx...
YAH

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by YvesAdeleHarlow

So my question is, do I need to have tuner cards installed on this test machine to stream imported dvd files?

You shouldn't. Are you trying to play these DVDs on the SageTV server, or on a Client? If on a Client, can it access the DVD via the same path as the server?

[olyar15]

Could be that you don't have proper DVD decoder installed. Can you play the ripped DVD in WMP?

[YvesAdeleHarlow]

Originally Posted by stanger89

You shouldn't. Are you trying to play these DVDs on the SageTV server, or on a Client? If on a Client, can it access the DVD via the same path as the server?

I have some ripped DVDs in native DVD data format (.vob, .bup, etc) on a machine with available storage, in a shared directory as per the Sage user guide. I configured the SageTV server (separate machine) to see the shared directory for imported video. The Sage server has a GeForce4 video card with s-video out, which is connected to my tv.
I can see the DVDs listed in Imported Videos and can select one, but clicking "watch now" brings a playback error.

[YvesAdeleHarlow]

Originally Posted by olyar15

Could be that you don't have proper DVD decoder installed. Can you play the ripped DVD in WMP?

WMP 10 cannot play DVD files from a hard drive (or so it claims when I try). I've not converted the native DVD files to AVI or MPG or WMV; I'm taking Sage's claim that it plays DVD video files at face value. According to the docs this should work, and SageTV does indeed see the DVD file structure so I think I'm almost there.
In Detailed Setup I have set the DVD decoder to SageTV DVD decoder. I've set the decoder in Audio/Video to the same.

[olyar15]

I don't think the Sage decoders will play DVDs, though I never tried it.

I do know that WMP 11 will play ripped DVDs, so I am surprised that WMP 10 can't. Just open the VIDEO_TS.IFO file for the DVD that you want to play.

You can try downloading the trial of the Nvidia purevideo decoders and see if that works.

[gplasky]

Originally Posted by YvesAdeleHarlow

WMP 10 cannot play DVD files from a hard drive (or so it claims when I try). I've not converted the native DVD files to AVI or MPG or WMV; I'm taking Sage's claim that it plays DVD video files at face value. According to the docs this should work, and SageTV does indeed see the DVD file structure so I think I'm almost there.
In Detailed Setup I have set the DVD decoder to SageTV DVD decoder. I've set the decoder in Audio/Video to the same.

That's not going to work. You need a decoder capable of doing CSS. You will need to actually own a decoder like nVidia, Cyberlink PowerDVD , Intervideo WinDVD, etc. Dscaler 5 is a free one. Sage will play it with the proper decoder, it doesn't supply one for DVDs. Sage's is called SageTV MPEG Video decoder. There is no such thing as a SageTV DVD Decoder. The audio is called SageTV Audio MPEG decoder.

Gerry

[YvesAdeleHarlow]

Originally Posted by gplasky

That's not going to work. You need a decoder capable of doing CSS. You will need to actually own a decoder like nVidia, Cyberlink PowerDVD , Intervideo WinDVD, etc. Dscaler 5 is a free one. Sage will play it with the proper decoder, it doesn't supply one for DVDs. Sage's is called SageTV MPEG Video decoder. There is no such thing as a SageTV DVD Decoder. The audio is called SageTV Audio MPEG decoder.

Gerry

I'm going to grab Dscaler 5 and give it a try, at your suggestion. I'll report back my success or failure in a later post.
As to the DVD decoder, you're correct, there is the SageTV MPEG Video decoder. That's what I selected in the Detailed Setup, DVD tab, DVD Video Decoder option. It's also what I selected in the Detailed Setup, Video/Audio tab, MPEG2 Video Decoder Filter option.
I wasn't sure which section was handling ripped DVD files, so I experimented with both. The SageTV docs don't mention needing a separate decoder for ripped DVD files, just how to arrange them so SageTV can find them, so I assumed the built-in decoder would do the job. Given the tab titles and labels in Detailed Setup, there's no reason to assume I'd need anything more than SageTV to make this work. I'll keep pluggin'. Thanks!

[YvesAdeleHarlow]

Originally Posted by olyar15

I don't think the Sage decoders will play DVDs, though I never tried it.

I do know that WMP 11 will play ripped DVDs, so I am surprised that WMP 10 can't. Just open the VIDEO_TS.IFO file for the DVD that you want to play.

You can try downloading the trial of the Nvidia purevideo decoders and see if that works.

Looks like that's the way this is heading. I'm going to download a free decoder and give it a whirl. I'll post the results here when I get through it.
Thanks for the pointer!

[YvesAdeleHarlow]

I downloaded but did not install Dscaler. Before giving it a try, I re-read the relevant sections of the SageTV v.6 manual (chapter 3, Video Browser; Appendix I, Playing DVDs From The Hard Drive).
I then re-tried my previous efforts. From the main menu I selected Media Center, then Imported Videos. SageTV shows me my four ripped DVDs and I can select Play, but I get the error.
I decided to try something new and selected Browse Media Files from the Media Center menu. I was able to navigate to the directory where a movie's files reside and SageTV displays the VOB files. I selected one and SageTV played it. I backed out of that and selected another, and SageTV played it. So SageTV *does* know how to play ripped DVD files on it's own, without an external decoder. This option doesn't present the DVD playback controls, so I can't simply click a file and watch the entire movie.
The trouble, then, appears to be in using the Imported Video section of Media Center. I went ahead and installed Dscaler but it didn't change anything. No additional decoder was displayed in SageTV setup and I received the same error upon playback. I have since un-installed it.
Still scratching my head. SageTV can play the individual VOB files from a movie but cannot play them as a single movie item, even though it recognizes the collection as a DVD movie in Imported Videos.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by YvesAdeleHarlow

I was able to navigate to the directory where a movie's files reside and SageTV displays the VOB files. I selected one and SageTV played it. I backed out of that and selected another, and SageTV played it.

That indicates to me you have a path problem (not a decoder problem). That whatever box you're trying to play the DVD from, can't access the directory, so it can't play the DVDs, (you can't stream IFO files).

The DVDs have to be accessible via the exact same path on the client as the server.

[YvesAdeleHarlow]

Originally Posted by stanger89

That indicates to me you have a path problem (not a decoder problem). That whatever box you're trying to play the DVD from, can't access the directory, so it can't play the DVDs, (you can't stream IFO files).

The DVDs have to be accessible via the exact same path on the client as the server.

In order to eliminate any path problem I moved one of the ripped DVD directories onto the SageTV machine, and pointed an import directory to it. Again I was able to see the movie listed as a DVD in Imported Videos, but got the same error when playing it. I was again able to view the movie's VOB files individually. So path isn't the problem.

[Opus4]

As mentioned above, the SageTV decoder doesn't play DVDs. If you can play the individual VOB files, but not the whole thing as a DVD, then I thought that would indicate that the SageTV Decoder doesn't know how to handle a DVD structure w/menus & so on.

After installing a DVD-capable decoder, try restarting SageTV before trying to use that decoder.

Regarding paths: I'm not clear on whether you are trying to play this DVD while using SageTV on the server or on the client PC. The client on another PC is the one that needs to be able to access the DVD path directly, the same path SageTV displays the path in the DVD's Video Detail info screen.

Anyway, those are my guesses...

- Andy

[YvesAdeleHarlow]

Originally Posted by Opus4

As mentioned above, the SageTV decoder doesn't play DVDs. If you can play the individual VOB files, but not the whole thing as a DVD, then I thought that would indicate that the SageTV Decoder doesn't know how to handle a DVD structure w/menus & so on.

Ah. You've confirmed what I arrived at. I had no luck getting Dscaler 5 to work as a decoder, but I'll take a look at some of the others available.

Originally Posted by Opus4

Regarding paths: I'm not clear on whether you are trying to play this DVD while using SageTV on the server or on the client PC. The client on another PC is the one that needs to be able to access the DVD path directly, the same path SageTV displays the path in the DVD's Video Detail info screen.

There is no client installation in my test scenario. The SageTV server box is connected to the TV via S-video out on the GeForce4 display adapter, and I've been controlling it either directly from its keyboard or via a remote administration console. The ripped movie files reside on a separate machine, a household server really, and SageTV has an import directory pointing at that machine's shared videos directory. So Sage is simply reading the files over ethernet.
For one of the tests I moved one DVD's files over to the SageTV server box to eliminate any network path weirdness, but all indications point to what you confirmed, above. It's never going to read it unless I get a working DVD decoder app running on the Sage box.
I guess that if I were to use a client machine for watching these ripped movies I'd have to install the DVD decoder there, as well? More importantly for me, how about the SageTV Media Extender? The online literature mentions that it will play

All TV recordings, online video, music, photos and DVD library the same on every TV, no need to transfer recordings or music media around

Does that mean that a DVD decoder running on the SageTV server will decode the ripped files as a movie and stream the results to the Extender?

Cheers to everyone who has chipped in advice on this issue...SageTV is really very cool software and I'm looking forward to using it as a path to HD in our home.

[Opus4]

Originally Posted by YvesAdeleHarlow

I guess that if I were to use a client machine for watching these ripped movies I'd have to install the DVD decoder there, as well?

Yes. And, I think this was mentioned above: the server cannot stream a DVD to SageTVClient; the client must be able to see the DVD files on its own, at the import path where the DVD is found. This means UNC import paths or a mapped drive letter on the client to match the letter on the server.

More importantly for me, how about the SageTV Media Extender?
...
Does that mean that a DVD decoder running on the SageTV server will decode the ripped files as a movie and stream the results to the Extender?

DVDs on the extender are handled differently -- SageTV plays them on its own w/o a 3rd party DVD decoder, but only supports playing non-encrypted DVDs. It cannot play commercial DVDs that are encrypted. And, it works best for hard drive based DVDs.

The Placeshifter does not play DVDs, btw.

- Andy

[YvesAdeleHarlow]

Originally Posted by Opus4

DVDs on the extender are handled differently -- SageTV plays them on its own w/o a 3rd party DVD decoder, but only supports playing non-encrypted DVDs. It cannot play commercial DVDs that are encrypted. And, it works best for hard drive based DVDs.

I'd be inclined to go the Extender route vs. a PC client, so this functionality is just what I'm looking for.
To put this thread to bed, I installed the trial nVidia DVD decoder package and sure enough, it appeared as a decoder option in SageTV's DVD setup. I was then able to select the hdd-based DVD in Media Center:Imported Videos and play it just fine.
Again, thanks to all for the great pointers.