iPad anyone?

[nick_l]

Originally Posted by flavius

I appreaciate that you updated you initial defamatory post for 'clarity'. And you are actually right about one thing: In the beginning Apple did fight the idea of an 'app store'.

1. My update WAS for clarity. It was Opus that was afraid of hurt feelings.

2. Regardless of how you or I feel about Apple, I am "right" about everything I said in that post. Facts are divergent from feelings. Windows mobile Was introduced in June of 2003 and included support for things like third party apps, native exchange support, full bluetooth stack support (which the iPhone OS STILL does not support, runing multiple apps, the ability to access memory cards (another no show for apple) and it ran on devices almost as small (if not quite as thin) as todays devices. Id say that fits the definition of "portable computer", and 3 1/2 years before anyone had even heard of the iPhone.

[PLUCKYHD]

Originally Posted by Opus4

Yesterday must have been a slow news day... this was covering most of the front page of our newspaper.

- Andy

That;s all you got, You are suppose to say we are developing a client for the ipad only kidding (partially)

[PLUCKYHD]

Originally Posted by nick_l

1. My update WAS for clarity. It was Opus that was afraid of hurt feelings.

2. Regardless of how you or I feel about Apple, I am "right" about everything I said in that post. Facts are divergent from feelings. Windows mobile Was introduced in June of 2003 and included support for things like third party apps, native exchange support, full bluetooth stack support (which the iPhone OS STILL does not support, runing multiple apps, the ability to access memory cards (another no show for apple) and it ran on devices almost as small (if not quite as thin) as todays devices. Id say that fits the definition of "portable computer", and 3 1/2 years before anyone had even heard of the iPhone.

I think the main difference here is apple's approach vs Windows. Windows/Microsoft is very bad about press and getting excitement on their products. Where as apple with get all the hype up and advertise correctly. I good example of this is Windows Media Center. Had they have advertised that correctly and pushed those advertisements all over the place like apple does I think it would have been/would be more successful.

Hype and press go along ways Microsoft gets bad hype/press and apple gets good. That is why the app store worked for them but not for Microsoft

cheers

[wayner]

One thing to keep in mind is that the iPad is not really overpriced compared to the competition. There are three Windows tablets that I believe are similar (see this post http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/show...4&postcount=24)

The Archos 9 is the cheapest of these machines - so let's compare:
____________iPad(16GB).....Archos9
OS................iPhone OS......Win7 Starter
Memory............??..............1GB
Storage.........16GB.............60GB
Screen..........9.7"...............8.9"
Res...............1024x768......1024x600
CPU..............1GHz A4........Atom Z510 1.1GHZ
Weight...........680g............800g
Batt Life.........10h..............5h

So these are pretty comparable in many respects. Perhaps the big question is how much do you value being able to run pretty much all Win apps on the Archos 9 vs. specialized apps on the iPad.

[Clift]

Originally Posted by fidget

But that is the case with any manufacturer, the second generation is always better than the first. If you wait one more year before buying a car, you will get more bells and whistles. Electronics just move faster: cost effective LCD TVs went from 60 Hz 720p to 240Hz 1080p (with LED backlights) in about four years.

For me, the iPad is not currently worth the investment. The 2G iPad may have those features that will change my mind. I have been using my iPodTouch more that I even thought I would.

I agree, except for one thing:
These features already exist in the iPhone and could easily have been implemented. They are blatantly left out. Was there a good reason to leave a 3G radio out of the original iPhone? Maybe, but I never got a good reason. Don;t give me that it was not tested or battery life or whatever, because that won't fly IMO. I own a 3G smartphone that came out before the iPhone, is thinner, and can last a day on a single charge even though the battery is weaksauce. Also, I understand some features, such as GPS and compass were improvements. That makes sense that products get better over time. Look at it this way, if you were buying a car from Apple, they would intentionally leave out your gas gauge and give you a "low fuel" light instead and call it simplicity. Then they'd make you pay for an "estimated range remaining" meter to track the fact that a fuel gauge is missing. I, for one, would not buy a car that didn't have what is considered to be "standard" features NOW, not a year or two years from now. GPS, Flash, multitasking, camera, etc... Those features exist now. And if you're talking about other MIDs or UMPC, whatever, they don;t have those features. But I consider the iPad to be a larger iPhone. And in that regard it's missing features it should have.

[wayner]

Originally Posted by fidget

You would need to have a streaming server installed on your network and connect via the web. If there were a SageTV client, it would require the use of a SageTV server.

I am fine with the use of SageTV server as we all have that. It would be great to hear that Sage is working on a SageTV Placeshifter for the iPhone OS that would work on the iPhone, iPodTouch and iPad. The closest thing we have to that today is using the Sage Web server.

[nick_l]

Cant argue with any of that. Microsoft's problem, imo, it that they lack the focus of a driven leader like Jobs. As many horrible, mean things as Id like to say about that guy, I must admit that he has will and the way to get any projects he deems important researched, developed, engineered and marketed like no other ceo I know of. He's also very good at picking up on developing market trends and co-opting others existing tech to best advantage. If balmer took a more personal interest in some of the more high profile "retail" projects at Microsoft I think it would really help their image and product awareness. Microsoft is EVERYWHERE but it's shocking how few people know that they do anything outside windows/office and the xbox.

[stuckless]

Originally Posted by sic0048

The ONLY redeeming qualities of this device is the battery life and form factor. You have to admit it is pretty impressive to get 10+ hours out of a device with nearly a10" screen that is only about 1/2" thick.

I guess it's impressive if you think of the device as a "real" computer, but given that it's a crippled computer, it doesn't seem that impressive. I mean 10hrs doing what? 10hours watching HD video? Listening to music? Reading a book? Kindle, as a single purpose device fares much better.

I guess it remains to be seen how well this niche device will do. One thing is for sure, apple will have 100% of "pad" market, since every other tablet pc will be an actually computer.

This could very well end up being "revolutionary", it could end up being a niche, low volume unit, like AppleTV, or even worse. Apple has had 2 very successful products in the last 10 years... ipod and iphone... maybe ipad will be their 3rd big hit (although in reality it's not a new product, just a larger ipod). You'd have to wonder what their long term plans are for their desktops. Apple seems hell bent on controlling every aspect of your computer, including what you run on it... so I wonder if in 5 years we'll see ipad OS on the macbook... (Imagine the battery life when you are only running 1 app at a time on your 17" macbook )

[sleonard]

Originally Posted by nick_l

1. My update WAS for clarity. It was Opus that was afraid of hurt feelings.

2. Regardless of how you or I feel about Apple, I am "right" about everything I said in that post. Facts are divergent from feelings. Windows mobile Was introduced in June of 2003 and included support for things like third party apps, native exchange support, full bluetooth stack support (which the iPhone OS STILL does not support, runing multiple apps, the ability to access memory cards (another no show for apple) and it ran on devices almost as small (if not quite as thin) as todays devices. Id say that fits the definition of "portable computer", and 3 1/2 years before anyone had even heard of the iPhone.

1. I missed the original post so I can't comment on that directly but if he was defaming Apple I would probably have agreed.

2. Couldn't have said it better myself. The only place the iPhone beats WinMo phones is in Apple's commercials. (see next quote/comment)

Originally Posted by PLUCKYHD

I think the main difference here is apple's approach vs Windows. Windows/Microsoft is very bad about press and getting excitement on their products. Where as apple with get all the hype up and advertise correctly. I good example of this is Windows Media Center. Had they have advertised that correctly and pushed those advertisements all over the place like apple does I think it would have been/would be more successful.

Hype and press go along ways Microsoft gets bad hype/press and apple gets good. That is why the app store worked for them but not for Microsoft

cheers

Microsoft is getting their butt kicked in the advertising/marketing space and always has. Apparently they just can't figure this part of their business out. It's a real shame because they otherwise wipe the floor with Apple and the perception among the general public is exactly the opposite.

S

[simonen]

So I can say "That chick is on her iPad" and not be called a pig? Thank you Apple.

64 gig iPad will forever be known as the heavy flow model.

Does the Period Tracker app come free?

If I order this, will my boyfriend and I have to worry if it comes late?

If you and your friends all buy one, will they sync up?

[sleonard]

Ya beat me to it

S

[PGPfan]

Originally Posted by PLUCKYHD

I think the main difference here is apple's approach vs Windows. Windows/Microsoft is very bad about press and getting excitement on their products. Where as apple with get all the hype up and advertise correctly. I good example of this is Windows Media Center. Had they have advertised that correctly and pushed those advertisements all over the place like apple does I think it would have been/would be more successful.

Hype and press go along ways Microsoft gets bad hype/press and apple gets good. That is why the app store worked for them but not for Microsoft

cheers

You are correct about the main difference being a different 'approach' between Apple and Microsoft, but I think the reason is fundimentally far different than you've illustrated. Apple always has been, and continues to be, a completely closed platform with near totalitarian control over all things in their ecosystem. Who else besides Apple could be responsible for drumming up hype over new devices? Whereas with Microsoft, since the entire PC ecosystem was built with the idea of an open hardware ecosystem you have many vendors introducing new hardware - and therefore many others 'diluting' a single source of 'hype' from Microsoft.

It's pretty easy to find a good industrial design firm that can create beautiful product designs and if you build to that one design you can create the lineage of beautiful looking equipment easily. In the PC world, you have several hundred case manufacturers, each thinking their designs are the most beautiful/unique, or affordable out there - the end result is they dilute the market.

To me, the iPad is a good thing - not because it's by Apple, but because it 'will' stimulate competition and it will result in cheaper, more powerful, more open alternatives at lower cost. The iPod's of today pale in comparison to other MP3 players for most people willing to look, the iPhone is on the verge of being viewed in the same light thanks to the 'Droid' versions coming out - the 'pads' will be no different, as I see it.

-PGPfan

[flavius]

Originally Posted by PGPfan

It's pretty easy to find a good industrial design firm that can create beautiful product designs and if you build to that one design you can create the lineage of beautiful looking equipment easily. In the PC world, you have several hundred case manufacturers, each thinking their designs are the most beautiful/unique, or affordable out there - the end result is they dilute the market

That's an interesting viewpoint. So, there are too many nice designs out there?

To me, the iPad is a good thing - not because it's by Apple, but because it 'will' stimulate competition
-PGPfan

I'm wondering if Google is going to tackle that one, too.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by flavius

I'm wondering if Google is going to tackle that one, too.

See, i think that is exactly making the point. It doens't have to be 'google' to tackle it. There are already a slew of perfectly functional tablets coming to market. However, since there ARE that many, no single device stands out. Google makes a great OS, and there are plenty of hardware manufacturers jumping on it to produce tablets (MSI's 10" @ $500 starts to really stand out... I mean.. it's so advanced, it can multitask...)

[flavius]

It seems to be quite clear, to me at least, that many manufacturers are waiting for the iPad to hit the shelves.

Personally, I'm hoping for a slow start, since Apple is likely to react like they did with the iPhone, by slashing the price.

[nick_l]

Originally Posted by sleonard

1. I missed the original post so I can't comment on that directly but if he was defaming Apple I would probably have agreed.

I was just being snide and used a poorly chosen noun. Thats what happens when I post after being up for too long. I am proplerly chastened.

[nick_l]

Originally Posted by PGPfan

You are correct about the main difference being a different 'approach' between Apple and Microsoft, but I think the reason is fundimentally far different than you've illustrated. Apple always has been, and continues to be, a completely closed platform with near totalitarian control over all things in their ecosystem. Who else besides Apple could be responsible for drumming up hype over new devices? Whereas with Microsoft, since the entire PC ecosystem was built with the idea of an open hardware ecosystem you have many vendors introducing new hardware - and therefore many others 'diluting' a single source of 'hype' from Microsoft.

It's pretty easy to find a good industrial design firm that can create beautiful product designs and if you build to that one design you can create the lineage of beautiful looking equipment easily. In the PC world, you have several hundred case manufacturers, each thinking their designs are the most beautiful/unique, or affordable out there - the end result is they dilute the market.

-PGPfan

So right about hardware, but MS still fails for promotion the features of it's OS, and related products.

A perfect example is desktop widgets. There should be a MILLION of them. Everyone should be falling over each other to create them. What? I can push my content right to users destops? My service can be their first choice because its always there and active and in front of thieir faces? MS has had the capability for interactive desktop content for over a decade, if you count active desktop in win98, and yet try to find a good dictionary app, a good facebook widget, hell a good rss widget. there is CRAP. You wait though, when Apple anounces widgets that will run in the "desktop" space of iPad... Choirs of angels will sing, the clouds will part and low the unwashed masses will see the beauty of "widgets". Why? Steve Jobs and Apple marketing. It really is remarkable: something for anthropoligists and historians of the future to study, Assuming SkyNet <cough> google <cough> allows any of that information to exist for future generations.

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by nick_l

A perfect example is desktop widgets. There should be a MILLION of them. Everyone should be falling over each other to create them. What? I can push my content right to users destops? My service can be their first choice because its always there and active and in front of thieir faces?

Engadget had an editorial a week or so ago along these lines. They didn't point to desktop gadgets in particular, but more generally Internet-aware Windows apps.

I'm a little skeptical, particularly of desktop gadgets. My computers basically always have a Firefox window open. I practically never see my desktop, unless I'm looking for some file that I downloaded. I have some Windows sidebar gadgets, including a Facebook gadget, and I just can't really imagine them being terribly useful. Why would I want to look at Facebook using a small window with a relatively limited interface? Can you describe what a nice facebook gadget would look and act like?

[xxLJLxx]

Originally Posted by simonen

If you and your friends all buy one, will they sync up?

For some reason, I enjoyed this one way too much. Thank you for making me look like a fool in front of everyone at work.

[nick_l]

Originally Posted by reggie14

Engadget had an editorial a week or so ago along these lines. They didn't point to desktop gadgets in particular, but more generally Internet-aware Windows apps.

I'm a little skeptical, particularly of desktop gadgets. My computers basically always have a Firefox window open. I practically never see my desktop, unless I'm looking for some file that I downloaded. I have some Windows sidebar gadgets, including a Facebook gadget, and I just can't really imagine them being terribly useful. Why would I want to look at Facebook using a small window with a relatively limited interface? Can you describe what a nice facebook gadget would look and act like?

Well, Facebook was simply one example, and ideally there would be several facebook widgets to choose from, by different programmers, to fulfill different needs. For me though, a good facebook widget would be on that cleanly and clearly showed me my friends status' and main updates. With a quick look I could see, for example, that my sister went to see Avitar and hated it as much as I did, or that my high school class is planning a reunion meeting, or my best friend is whining because he has a cold. I dont always need or want the full facebook "experience" so updates are nice.

I always have multiple browsers open as well. For example right now i have 9 instances of IE and firefox open with a total of 45 tabs open!! it can be hard to find info in all that mess.

With one key combo (WIN + D to minimize all windows, or WIN + G to bring all the gadgets to the top) I can see in one glance

what the real time traffic is like in my area
what the temp is, if there are any weather warnings and what tomorrow will be like.
if any of my servers (sage, homeseer, email, file) have stopped responding to pings
what my friends x-box avitars currently look like
what my upcoming Outlook/Exchange appointments and tasks are
What sage is currently recording (and one click shows me whats coming up)
What lights are currently on, via Homeseer (and likewise, a click will turn them on/off
one click access to my favorite pandora stations, without the heavy browser drag
the current time, in a cute "nixi tube" style.

And one more click hides them all away again. So its not like I need to go to my desktop to see them, I can bring all that info to me, at the same time, without typing urls or clicking multiple favorites. To me, thats priceless usibiliby, but it could be SO much better. Widgets can be poorly coded and possibly not updated for years. If Microsoft got a "Clue" and started pushing this feature, we could have a much better selection of better coded widgets. And thats just one example of where Microsoft provides the "tools" but totally drops the ball on following up on them and education the public that they even exist.