HD-PVR and satellite companies?

[gabrielcab]

Hello, i'm thinking into subscribing a satellite service or cable that offers HD content, and before I invest into the HD-PVR, i'd like to know if there is any consideration i should take before selecting the HD service provider? My local options are DishNetworks DirecTV and some local cable provider. Do the STB that offers Dish or DirectTV encrypts HD programs so it cannot be used with SageTV? or it doesn't happens here?

[bcjenkins]

I use the HDPVR with DirecTV no issues. You may also want to consider the internal Colossus tuner which is due out soon as well.

B

[war10ck]

i would go directv especially if you have newer boxes since you can use the ethernet port to do channel changes. (cant on dish boxes)

[stanger89]

First and foremost I would consider which provider provides the better deal, in terms of cost, channels etc. There's not enough difference between them IMO for "tuner friendlyness" to override any of that.

If they're a tie after that, then yeah, as a Dish Network customer, I'd go with DirecTV for the ethernet tuning capability (even though my USB-UIRT has been flawless).

[sic0048]

The raw digital signal from any of those providers is going to be encrypted. Certainly the satellite feeds are, and I don't think there is a cable company in existence that isn't encrypting their feeds now. Even if there is, don't count on it being unencrypted forever.

Therefore you must be able to decrypt the feeds somehow. With satellite that requires a STB. Unless you are going to use a R5000 box with DishTV, this requires using your normal STB and recording the output via SageTV. If you only want SD quality, then any normal analog tuner with S-video or composite video inputs will work (as long as it is compatible with SageTV). However, if you want HD quality recordings, then you must use the HD-PVR or the new Hauppauge Colossus tuner.

If you decide to go with Cable, you might have these options plus a couple of others. Namely, you might be able to get a cable card tuner to work in SageTV. Nothing is official, but there are a couple of hacks that allow you to record from the Ceton's Infini4 tuner.

You might also be able to get firewire to work with some STBs.

I like the idea of the HD-PVR and the Colossal tuners because you can use them with any provider. So if you end up switching from cable to satellite or vise versa, you don't have to buy all new tuners. For that reason, it might be wise to look at the Colossal cards.

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by sic0048

If you decide to go with Cable, you might have these options plus a couple of others. Namely, you might be able to get a cable card tuner to work in SageTV. Nothing is official, but there are a couple of hacks that allow you to record from the Ceton's Infini4 tuner.

Personally there's no way I'd buy a $400 tuner to use with SageTV, without official SageTV support, regardless of "hacks" or plugins. The way the plugins work relies on everything being marked Copy Freely, and that can be turned off at a whim, leaving you with a "brick".

I like the idea of the HD-PVR and the Colossal tuners because you can use them with any provider. So if you end up switching from cable to satellite or vise versa, you don't have to buy all new tuners. For that reason, it might be wise to look at the Colossal cards.

They're also guaranteed to work, regardless of what the provider might want to enable/disable.

[GKusnick]

Originally Posted by sic0048

I like the idea of the HD-PVR and the Colossal tuners because you can use them with any provider.

Not to quibble, but these device aren't tuners. They're strictly encoders, and rely on the provider's STB to do the actual tuning. So you can't, for instance, just plug a cable feed directly from the wall into the HD-PVR or Colossus (as you can with a QAM tuner). You must use an STB.

Most of us here understand this, of course, but since the OP is new to all of this I thought it worthwhile to spell out the difference.

I'll second the idea that at this late date there's not much point to investing in the old USB HD-PVR. You might as well wait a couple of weeks for the Colossus (assuming you have a free PCIe slot to put it in).

[Sparhawk6]

Originally Posted by stanger89

Personally there's no way I'd buy a $400 tuner to use with SageTV, without official SageTV support, regardless of "hacks" or plugins. The way the plugins work relies on everything being marked Copy Freely, and that can be turned off at a whim, leaving you with a "brick".



They're also guaranteed to work, regardless of what the provider might want to enable/disable.

Guaranteed to work? Hardly. Component outputs will disappear soon. These devices can be made obsolete at the whim of the provider, much like the provider can change encryption tags on a whim.

Also, if you hadn't seen, many people report problems with the IR blaster and the HDPVR itself (we'll see if the internal card is any more reliable). Add in the fact that you have to rent an additional HD STB for each stream ($120 per year per box on Comcast), and these things don't end up being more attractive than a $400, unsanctioned "hack." (which can be reduced to $250 if the "hack" will support the upcoming HDHomeRun Prime, which the developer says it will)

[gabrielcab]

Thanks, lots of good new information for me, I'll definitely will look into the DirectTV just for the network channel controller and wait for the colosus. If i understand right, as of now, if a tv provider decide to disable the copy freely from a channel, with the component inputs from the HD-PVR we will still able to record it?

[stanger89]

Originally Posted by Sparhawk6

Guaranteed to work? Hardly. Component outputs will disappear soon.

Define "soon"

These devices can be made obsolete at the whim of the provider, much like the provider can change encryption tags on a whim.

Except there are ways around component being disabled, aka the HDFury. No not a cheap solution, but there's no way around CableCard DRM that I'm aware of.

Also, if you hadn't seen, many people report problems with the IR blaster and the HDPVR itself (we'll see if the internal card is any more reliable). Add in the fact that you have to rent an additional HD STB for each stream ($120 per year per box on Comcast), and these things don't end up being more attractive than a $400, unsanctioned "hack." (which can be reduced to $250 if the "hack" will support the upcoming HDHomeRun Prime, which the developer says it will)

I see the appeal of CableCard, especially if running WMC, but without official SageTV support I think $400 is a big "risk" for something that could be bricked a week after you get it.

Originally Posted by gabrielcab

Thanks, lots of good new information for me, I'll definitely will look into the DirectTV just for the network channel controller and wait for the colosus. If i understand right, as of now, if a tv provider decide to disable the copy freely from a channel, with the component inputs from the HD-PVR we will still able to record it?

Flagging has nothing to do with the availability of component outputs.

[panteragstk]

Originally Posted by GKusnick

Not to quibble, but these device aren't tuners. They're strictly encoders, and rely on the provider's STB to do the actual tuning. So you can't, for instance, just plug a cable feed directly from the wall into the HD-PVR or Colossus (as you can with a QAM tuner). You must use an STB.

Most of us here understand this, of course, but since the OP is new to all of this I thought it worthwhile to spell out the difference.

Finally. I was wonder why everybody kept calling an input device (encoder) a tuner. No tuning happening there.

As for component going away. That is a rumor with nothing to back it up. There are only a handful of devices that have no component outputs, and there are plenty of HDTV's out there with no HDMI/DVI inputs. I wouldn't put any stock into such rumors. Especially since HDBaseT is going to be the new standard anyway...

[Sparhawk6]

Originally Posted by panteragstk

Finally. I was wonder why everybody kept calling an input device (encoder) a tuner. No tuning happening there.

As for component going away. That is a rumor with nothing to back it up. There are only a handful of devices that have no component outputs, and there are plenty of HDTV's out there with no HDMI/DVI inputs. I wouldn't put any stock into such rumors. Especially since HDBaseT is going to be the new standard anyway...

It's not "if" it's "when." HDMI inputs were created to specifically close the analog hole and give content providers more control over their content. If they continued to leave the analog hole open, then the main purpose of HDMI would be defeated.