Narflex please keep fighting for client licenses

[speck55]

Originally Posted by martin

The right thing for Google to do is keep the EPG service running until all of our hardware is obsolete. One year is not enough.

Yeah, there seems to be a lot of that going around from Soogle. My money is one year to the day, black. We are but thorns in the side of Google's plans.

[ThePaladinTech]

Originally Posted by GKusnick

How about this post:



As evidence of his good faith, he's already addressed the V7 upgrade issue and brought SageTV tech support back online. So yeah, I tend to believe him when he says he's working on it.

But if the idea is to convince him that's a waste of time and he should just blow us all off and not look back, rants like yours are probably a good way to do that.

+1 ... ever hear that you get more honey with sugar then vinegar?

[sleonard]

Originally Posted by ThePaladinTech

+1 ... ever hear that you get more honey with sugar then vinegar?

I think it's "you catch more flies with honey than vinager".

S

[davephan]

It's been quite awhile already... How many months will it take before people give up hope for a way to buy or get the client software? It seems like the decision was already made, and if you try to go to the web store, you see the answer. Unfortunately, "Full speed ahead" really doesn't tell you a thing. It's just an empty statement.

At the very minimum, I think it would show some decency to at least update the SageTV users that client software licenses will never be available or will be available, instead of just letting the users hang and wonder. The only thing not answering the question about the client creates is ill will and hostility, which does not help anyone.


Dave

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by davephan

At the very minimum, I think it would show some decency to at least update the SageTV users that client software licenses will never be available or will be available, instead of just letting the users hang and wonder. The only thing not answering the question about the client creates is ill will and hostility, which does not help anyone.

Unless the answer is 'I Don't Know', or more specifically:

Originally Posted by Narflex

I do understand the other complaints about no client licenses or extenders....and we are still trying to work on potential solutions to those problems

[stevech]

not selling new licenses.. what could the lawyers be paranoid about? Liability for support for hardware/software sold after the acquisition?

Customarily, the acquired company's contracts novate (to the acquiring company).
http://financial-dictionary.thefreed...ary.com/novate

If not that, then what marketing fear exists for the tiny few that need these licenses? And HD300s?

Or is it simply an M&A policy/generalized post-acquisition mandate?

[speck55]

Originally Posted by ThePaladinTech

+1 ... ever hear that you get more honey with sugar then vinegar?

And have you ever heard that if all the flies have left the building for all intents and purposes, you could just as well use water, vinegar, bleach, BEER (popular one around here)...

[davephan]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

Originally Posted by Narflex
I do understand the other complaints about no client licenses or extenders....and we are still trying to work on potential solutions to those problems

Unless the answer is 'I Don't Know', or more specifically:

How long should we wait for a response? Two months, six months, a year, five years? I think the non-response so far speaks volumes.


Dave

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by davephan

How long should we wait for a response? Two months, six months, a year, five years? I think the non-response so far speaks volumes.

Considering that statement was about a week ago, I'd give it some time. The thing is, what are you needing from them right now? MOST the users here have their systems up and running. I could gladly wait 5 years for an 'answer' to a question I haven't asked. If something really strange happened, and I DID need to add another client, I would just do a periodic image rollback (you, of ALL people should embrace any tactic involving disk imaging).

[karhill]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy

Considering that statement was about a week ago, I'd give it some time. The thing is, what are you needing from them right now? MOST the users here have their systems up and running. I could gladly wait 5 years for an 'answer' to a question I haven't asked. If something really strange happened, and I DID need to add another client, I would just do a periodic image rollback (you, of ALL people should embrace any tactic involving disk imaging).

I am in the middle of rolling out SageTV. I had purchased a server license and a client, but I need 10 more clients to complete my system. Now I'm stuck.

I would love to be able to purchase some more client licenses. The quick and unforseen abandonment of the product has really left me in a lurch.

Personally I find SageTV's actions to be unethical....a product like this takes time and effort to make it work. I invested a lot of time and trial and testing to see if the product would work for me. I also invested much money traveling to the installation destination. If SageTV had provided a heads-up, and given people a transition window, I would gladly have raced out and purchased lots of clients and a few more servers.

As it is, I really need some client licenses.

[Fuzzy]

Originally Posted by karhill

I am in the middle of rolling out SageTV. I had purchased a server license and a client, but I need 10 more clients to complete my system. Now I'm stuck.

I would love to be able to purchase some more client licenses. The quick and unforseen abandonment of the product has really left me in a lurch.

Personally I find SageTV's actions to be unethical....a product like this takes time and effort to make it work. I invested a lot of time and trial and testing to see if the product would work for me. I also invested much money traveling to the installation destination. If SageTV had provided a heads-up, and given people a transition window, I would gladly have raced out and purchased lots of clients and a few more servers.

As it is, I really need some client licenses.

The fact of the matter is, they were not allowed to give a heads up to the pending negotiations. There really isn't much else that could have been done ahead of time. It may work out that Jeff can come trough for you and the relatively few that are in your situation. But, even if they don't, there is still nothing unethical about it, as you still have full use of and support for every product you've purchased. Unfortunate, yes.. unethical, no. If they do finally come up with an answer (either a yes OR a no), then you can make a decision on which way to go. (either acquire the licenses you need from Google if that's an option, move to another product, or acquire the licenses through workarounds/tricks). The thing is, fully functioning software, that has no direct ties to the parent company (like an activation server, for instance) never truly die. Sagetv will continue to function. The only ties sagetv has to the company is the EPG data (available elsewhere), the plugin repository (also available elsewhere), and the locator service (which has alternatives in the form of free dynamic dns services).

[GKusnick]

Originally Posted by karhill

Personally I find SageTV's actions to be unethical...

I understand your frustration, but there are competing ethical concerns here. Sage had obligations not just to its customers but also to its employees, investors, and creditors as well as to Google and the SEC. The fact the you came out on the short end of it does not mean they acted unethically. It just means that other factors outweighed yours in the overall ethical equation, and we're not really in a position to know what all those factors were.

That said, I do hope that Jeff is able to work through the various constraints and come up with a solution for people in your situation.

[speck55]

Originally Posted by davephan

How long should we wait for a response? Two months, six months, a year, five years? I think the non-response so far speaks volumes.


Dave

Look up what the statute of limitations on these matters are in their jurisdiction, add a day.

[davephan]

Originally Posted by karhill

I am in the middle of rolling out SageTV. I had purchased a server license and a client, but I need 10 more clients to complete my system. Now I'm stuck.

I would love to be able to purchase some more client licenses. The quick and unforseen abandonment of the product has really left me in a lurch.

Personally I find SageTV's actions to be unethical....a product like this takes time and effort to make it work. I invested a lot of time and trial and testing to see if the product would work for me. I also invested much money traveling to the installation destination. If SageTV had provided a heads-up, and given people a transition window, I would gladly have raced out and purchased lots of clients and a few more servers.

As it is, I really need some client licenses.

Maybe you could clone the client, unless the server has to see unique clients.

Another option is to use the client trial and roll it back with an image every 21 days for decades. Maybe you could have it automatically roll back unattended. Then the trial might appear to be just like the licensed client. It would be a lot easier to simply buy a client license if they were for sale.

Another option might be to clone the server and use the clones for playback only. I think you could playback files from a mapped drive with the server clone just like it was a client.

Dave

[speck55]

Originally Posted by davephan

Maybe you could clone the client, unless the server has to see unique clients.

Another option is to use the client trial and roll it back with an image every 21 days for decades. Maybe you could have it automatically roll back unattended. Then the trial might appear to be just like the licensed client. It would be a lot easier to simply buy a client license if they were for sale.

Another option might be to clone the server and use the clones for playback only. I think you could playback files from a mapped drive with the server clone just like it was a client.

Dave

The server service maps the first client to connect using a given key to its MAC address. Subsequent attempts with the same key will fail. The table is cleared only by restarting the Sage service, at least that's how I understand it.

[Fuzzy]

correct, so running in re-imaged trial mode would be the best way to get around the lack of available client licenses... A script that runs on first boot after the deployment could simply copy a backed-up sage client folder from your server, and you should be good to go.

[sleonard]

A client in trial mode running in a VM might be easier. Every 30 days you could discard all changes and reinstall the client.

S

[speck55]

Originally Posted by sleonard

A client in trial mode running in a VM might be easier. Every 30 days you could discard all changes and reinstall the client.

S

Though keep in mind that while not a problem for most modern desktop machines, the video overhead in terms of CPU use may be a problem for the smaller net-tops like those running Atoms or the AMD equivalent.

[Fuzzy]

Honestly, the VM approach had occurred to me, but again, the video performance (and most likely the lack of any sort of hardware accelerated playback) eliminated it as a reasonable option. Really, the image rollback shouldn't be that difficult to automate.

[sleonard]

In Win7 you have the ability to boot directly from a VHD. All you need is a reference to it in the boot.ini file. If you were to do this than the video performance would probably be just as good while still being able to dicard the undo disc every thirty days.

S