Analog to Digital Cable Switch

[mayamaniac]

With analog signals converting to digital in Feb 2009, what are the options for the analogers in cable TV land? How will you guys handle the switch?

How many are getting the $40 coupon for the conversion box? This is the cheapest solution and it fixes the signal problem, but I still see a channel changing problem. I'm not sure what those conversion boxes support in term of channel changing. IR blaster is always an option.

Another option is to rent digital STBs from the cable company for each analog tuner you have. Still have the channel changing problem but I think there are already ways to do it, may it be by serial, IR blaster, or firewire. At $5-$10/month per STB, it can get pricey depending on how many analog tuners you have.

The other option is to replace analog tuners with digital ones. This is an expensive option, and you will only get clear QAM channels, or non encrypted channels.

And the most expensive option, dump all analog tuners and go ALL HD-PVRs and HD STBs, with the assumption that everything works flawlessly with the HD-PVR and SageTV.

Are there any other options I'm missing?

[QueOnda]

The digital conversion is only for OTA. Cable may have a few analog channels for your viewing, but have seen some channels moved to a higher channel number than able to tune with the analog cable cards.

I've got a couple of coupons but don't think I need them. I still have a couple of months to decide, since I don't do OTA. I which I was able to use the coupons on the HDHR.

[mayamaniac]

So cable TV is not affected? Do the cable companies plan to cut off analog soon also? I would've thought they take advantage of this switch and make everyone rent their boxes.

[paulbeers]

I have 7 Tv's in my house. 3 of which are HD and 4 of which are not. I am planning on going to Dish Network as soon as the HD-PVR comes out (and is proven to work with Sage as I am no longer allowed to be the adventurous type when it comes to technology). Because several of my tv's would require either to add ASTC converter boxes or MediaMVP's, I decided to do this:

I recently picked up an MVP for Ebay (it's actually a rebranded by Helius). It has an RF modulator built in to it. Do a search on ebay for Helius MediaStream SST.

(you'll need these instructions to make the Helius MVP work with Sage: http://forums.sagetv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29280)

Next I picked up this:
http://www.amazon.com/Next-Generatio...0896520&sr=8-1

The RF remote controller will work with any remote so it's going into a MediaMVP remote for my Helius, so that anyone with that remote can work the Helius from anywhere in the house.

Now the Helius is going to be wired directly into my Coax Amplifier in the basement so that it can then send the signal from the Helius to all the tv's in the house as long as they tune Channel 3.

This has several advantages:
1. Only 1 MVP is needed for any tv that is currently not hooked to Sage
2. Since my server can transcode HD on the fly in high quality, all TV's now have access to HD content
3. All tv's can be watching the same thing at the same exact spot (this is important because in the morning my wife likes to turn on 3-4 tv's in the house while watching the news and thru Sage it never seems to be perfectly synced)
4. In our kitchen there isn't a good place for the MVP, so now it doesn't need one.

Cons:
1. All tv's will only be able to watch one channel (unless hooked to its own MVP or HD100)
2. All tv's hooked to this are using Coax which of all the connection options has the poorest image.


Some day I will probably puchase enough extenders (MVP and HD100), so that the Helius will ONLY be used for the kitchen tv (see pro #4), but until that day this is a good alternative.

Edit: I should tell you that the RF Remote Controller is still on its way, but the reviews sing its praises so if that's the case I should be golden! The Helius is working as planned.

[paulbeers]

Originally Posted by mayamaniac

So cable TV is not affected? Do the cable companies plan to cut off analog soon also? I would've thought they take advantage of this switch and make everyone rent their boxes.

My understanding is that Cable doesn't have to shut off its analog signal until 2012 I believe. The biggest problem, is that your cable operators would have to give digital tuners to everyone if they did this, so who knows when the analog switch will actually happen (I see more delays in this switch off so it could be 2014+)

[Keith]

Originally Posted by mayamaniac

How many are getting the $40 coupon

Please don't get the $40 coupons. Nobody should use those. That's not free money - those are my and your tax dollars and I don't know about you but my taxes are way too high already. The last thing I need is to be paying for someone else's TV viewing.

[gplasky]

Originally Posted by Keith

Please don't get the $40 coupons. Nobody should use those. That's not free money - those are my and your tax dollars and I don't know about you but my taxes are way too high already. The last thing I need is to be paying for someone else's TV viewing.

The money is already earmarked and spent. You may as well get something for "free" if you're already paying for it.

(Plus you got your money rebate this year for all those years of overpaying. I'm sure we're almost even now )

Gerry

[pjpjpjpj]

Originally Posted by Keith

Please don't get the $40 coupons. Nobody should use those. That's not free money - those are my and your tax dollars and I don't know about you but my taxes are way too high already. The last thing I need is to be paying for someone else's TV viewing.

As Gerry said.... do you really think the government is going to refund money to everyone for all of the $40 coupons not claimed?

(sigh) ...Keith, my man, you have a lot to learn....

[paulbeers]

Originally Posted by pjpjpjpj

As Gerry said.... do you really think the government is going to refund money to everyone for all of the $40 coupons not claimed?

(sigh) ...Keith, my man, you have a lot to learn....

Besides, those of us on these boards have jobs and actually pay taxes (that's how we can afford this hobby). Would you rather people who pay taxes get these coupons or those who don't work and live off the government and would never "pay back" their coupons?

[matt91]

Originally Posted by paulbeers

My understanding is that Cable doesn't have to shut off its analog signal until 2012 I believe.

Just to clarify -- Cable Co's are required to carry the locals in analog until at least 2012. They apparently are phasing out the rest of the analog channels at varying times in different markets. I believe (= I read someplace on the internet) that Chicago Comcast has already gone 'all digital'. I'm not sure if they still have the 4 or 5 locals in analog, or if they provided a STB to everyone instead.

Matt

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by matt91

Just to clarify -- Cable Co's are required to carry the locals in analog until at least 2012. They apparently are phasing out the rest of the analog channels at varying times in different markets. I believe (= I read someplace on the internet) that Chicago Comcast has already gone 'all digital'. I'm not sure if they still have the 4 or 5 locals in analog, or if they provided a STB to everyone instead.

I'm a little confused by the FCC mandate. It doesn't seem to be mandating anything that isn't obviously true. If cable companies go all digital, of course they will need to be able to provide customers with cable boxes (since we know they won't go all unencrypted QAM). The only thing that would make it significant is if it means they have to provide cable boxes for free, which the FCC's press release does not say.

[Taddeusz]

Originally Posted by reggie14

I'm a little confused by the FCC mandate. It doesn't seem to be mandating anything that isn't obviously true. If cable companies go all digital, of course they will need to be able to provide customers with cable boxes (since we know they won't go all unencrypted QAM). The only thing that would make it significant is if it means they have to provide cable boxes for free, which the FCC's press release does not say.

I believe the actual FCC mandate was that cable operators must do one of the following:

1) Provide analog channels without the need for a set-top box till 2012

2) Go all digital and provide set-top boxes for all of their customers

With services like Uverse that require a set-top box I don't find it unappealing. Only the most stubborn of people are going to take getting a set-top box negatively. With the exception of my HDHR I don't use my cable without an STB. I personally need to trade mine up to an HD capable box.

[sleonard]

Originally Posted by matt91

Just to clarify -- Cable Co's are required to carry the locals in analog until at least 2012. They apparently are phasing out the rest of the analog channels at varying times in different markets. I believe (= I read someplace on the internet) that Chicago Comcast has already gone 'all digital'. I'm not sure if they still have the 4 or 5 locals in analog, or if they provided a STB to everyone instead.

Matt

If a cableco switches to all digital before a certain date (?) then they are exempt from carrying any analog. Only if they are unable to make the all-digital conversion in time are they subject to the above requirements.

S

[hemicuda]

Comcast here is slowly moving more channels to digital service. I keep getting charged the same for less and less service in return. At least 2 in the next month are going digital according to a letter in the mail and a some are getting shuffled around in the lineup. PITA they are. Come on EPB, get moving w/ fiber.

[mikesm]

Here's a very interesting quote from communications daily today on the DC circuit ruling support the FCC's denial of a cablecard waiver for Comcast:

Comcast needs no CableCARD waiver for a no-frills digital-to-analog converter that Chief Operating Officer Steve
Burke told investors it will begin deploying this year in some markets to reclaim analog bandwidth (CD May 2 p5), said an
industry source. The boxes won't work with encrypted programming or advanced services like VoD, but Comcast hasn't
said if it will need waivers. It won’t because “the boxes don't have embedded security," the source said.

So it looks like whatever programs the DTA will be decoding will be transmitted in the clear. This is VERY GOOD news, as it likely means the ADS versions of expanded basic will be transmitted in the clear so any QAM capable TV can receive them without a box.

This mean clear QAM tuners will likely be able to pick up everything in the expanded basic tier. Good news indeed.

[rfutscher]

Originally Posted by Keith

Please don't get the $40 coupons. Nobody should use those. That's not free money - those are my and your tax dollars and I don't know about you but my taxes are way too high already. The last thing I need is to be paying for someone else's TV viewing.

The money is not from tax dollars. The switch to digital will free some of the broadcast spectrum. The money is coming from the sale of this spectrum. The government got more money for the spectrum because some of the money is being used to subsidise the converter boxes, freeing up the spectrum sooner.

[ke6guj]

Originally Posted by rfutscher

The money is not from tax dollars. The switch to digital will free some of the broadcast spectrum. The money is coming from the sale of this spectrum. The government got more money for the spectrum because some of the money is being used to subsidise the converter boxes, freeing up the spectrum sooner.

+1.

The sale of some of the spectrum is gonna bring in tens of billions of dollars, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/700_Mhz...ectrum_auction . Setting aside around $1B for converter coupons isn't gonna bankrupt .gov.

That coupon program is neccessary. Can you image the firestorm that would occur when they turn off analog and all the low/fixed-income peoples TVs stop working. And to top it off, to hear that .gov made money on the deal that broke their TVs?

[reggie14]

Originally Posted by Taddeusz

I believe the actual FCC mandate was that cable operators must do one of the following:

1) Provide analog channels without the need for a set-top box till 2012

2) Go all digital and provide set-top boxes for all of their customers

Right. My point was that any cable company was going to do one of those things anyway. I fail to see what it requires that cable companies wouldn't have done without the mandate. Since cable companies don't seem to really like clear QAM and/or cable cards, going digital means providing STBs (presumably for a fee).

The mandate doesn't say a company can't stay with analog. It doesn't say a company can't move to digital. The only thing it seems to say that a cable company can't move local channels to digital without moving all their channels to digital. The STB requirement seems like a non-issue, since STBs are inherent to digital systems (at least in practice).

The only thing I can think of is that a strict reading of the mandate might require cable companies to cancel service to anyone that doesn't have a box before turning off the analog signal. That seems unlikely. I imagine companies would just check their records to find out who doesn't have a box (or a card), and then they'd mail them one (and tack on a monthly rental fee to their bill).

When the FCC made this announcement last year it got lots of press, but I've never understood why anyone thought it was a big deal. It seems like a no-brainer, and only forbids something that was unlikely to happen. My posts probably make it sound like I'm concerned about this issue. Really its just something that has confused me for a while.

[Taddeusz]

Probably the people that made a stink about were those that have the cheapest of basic cable without a set-top box. Those people are going to either have to either start leasing a box or have a "rent to own" kind of thing like cell phones.

[briands]

Originally Posted by reggie14

Right. My point was that any cable company was going to do one of those things anyway. I fail to see what it requires that cable companies wouldn't have done without the mandate. Since cable companies don't seem to really like clear QAM and/or cable cards, going digital means providing STBs (presumably for a fee).

The mandate doesn't say a company can't stay with analog. It doesn't say a company can't move to digital. The only thing it seems to say that a cable company can't move local channels to digital without moving all their channels to digital. The STB requirement seems like a non-issue, since STBs are inherent to digital systems (at least in practice).

The only thing I can think of is that a strict reading of the mandate might require cable companies to cancel service to anyone that doesn't have a box before turning off the analog signal. That seems unlikely. I imagine companies would just check their records to find out who doesn't have a box (or a card), and then they'd mail them one (and tack on a monthly rental fee to their bill).

When the FCC made this announcement last year it got lots of press, but I've never understood why anyone thought it was a big deal. It seems like a no-brainer, and only forbids something that was unlikely to happen. My posts probably make it sound like I'm concerned about this issue. Really its just something that has confused me for a while.

Of course forcing people to use an STB at each TV location eliminates one of the benefits that cable has over satellite. I can see a lot of people investigating alternatives if the cable co tries to shove STBs down their throat.